sweet home Kansas-balama... (page 2)

Billygoat

Good point. I still stand by my comments and beliefs about the validity of his words, but I agree, it was probably not the best venue. Thanks for pointing that out.

I lived in Liberal, KS and Dodge City....what a sucky part of the country to grow up in. The best view of SW Kansas...is the one in your rearview mirror as you are leaving. Even the JW's are hardliner conservatives there. No get-togethers. No dancing at wedding receptions. No anything fun. It was like living the story line of "Footloose". It sucked more than anything has ever sucked before.

In the words of Bart Simpson "I never knew anything could blow and suck at the same time."

Ern

the_classicist

uh, except for in the House of Representatives. you see billygoat, there's this little thing called separation of church and state, that the west is supposed to be well known and respected for. and then this dude throws hundreds of years of progress out the window just because he wants to exercise his "right" to pray in public.

Separation of Church and State is an American principle. I mean, our head of state, the Queen, must be an Anglican and must be the governor of the Church of England. I also think that the Anglican Church of Canada is a quasi-state church because Parliament must legislate their synods to enact them.

The only other place where separation of Church and State really go under way besides the USA was France perhaps Germany too, but I'm not that familiar with Germany. After the Reformation, the Protestant countries did not separate Church and State, but nationalized the Church and subjegated it to the State.

Euphemism

Good point, Classicist. To me, the real issue here is not just the separation of church and state (although I agree with it), but that the clergyman took what should have been a unifying, uplifting moment and turned it into a political rant.

If the pastor got himself elected to the House of Representatives, he'd be perfectly entitled to stand up and speechify about his opinions. But when you're a clergyman brought in to open the session with prayer, that's not your job.

tetrapod.sapien

Separation of Church and State is an American principle. I mean, our head of state, the Queen, must be an Anglican and must be the governor of the Church of England. I also think that the Anglican Church of Canada is a quasi-state church because Parliament must legislate their synods to enact them.

wasn't separation of church and state a post Saint Augustine principle? De Civitate Dei

wasn't it he who originally argued that, while the official roman religion, christianity should be concerned with the heavenly City of Jerusalem, and not politics?

Carol

I've got to agree with Billygoat. As far as seperation of church and state???? We have God on our money, in our pledge of allegiance and prayers being said before sessions in the hous and senate of every state and at national level. The U.S. fights religious wars (i.e. Iraq...yes it's for oil and because baby Bush is getting revenge for threats made against Daddy Bush...but it is also a Christian against Muslem thing....) I don't care for this particular minister or his church...but I glory in the fact that he doesn't kiss the a*ses of the politicians in his state.

Good topic! Love to hear more opinions!

chrissy

But today, I'm a little more secure in MY faith and MY beliefs, so I don't get all up in arms when someone expresses their spirituality differently than I. It's just different.

Billy,

Yes, good point. Walking into central christian that day was my first church experience. It was an overwhelming introduction to 'christendom' for a pair of very greenly freed jw eyes, as you also said. At that time (about five years ago), I was barely twenty or so, and half expected armageddon's arrival...the walls would cave in, and I would be crushed in the rubble as Jah looked down nodding in disbelief that I was even there.

I have been in other places of worship since then and am able to, if nothing else, respectfully observe free of judgment. Still, no place compares to CC of Wichita.

Furthermore, I am not surprised that the sneaky and inappropriate prayer went down as it did. That place had a certain feeling of arrogance and self righteousness. And the way they blocked intersections to protest abortion...rather hostile, not to mention inconvenient for drivers.

Wow. it is so good to say I am not in kansas anymore. no offense, kansans.

sweet home Kansas-balama...