Shining One's Link To A Dishonest ICR Article

by AlanF 37 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  ellderwho

  : Where does logic come from, eh Alan? Where does your reasoning come from in the first place?

  : How can you, with a naturalistic presupposition, account for the existence of logical absolutes when logical absolutes are concepts of the mind and not physical, energy, or motion?"

  AL: You're getting into questions that no one can answer at present in a completely satisfactory way. I hope you understand that such "laws", being constructs of the mind, are like the "laws" and axioms of mathematics, and in fact are a subset of them.

  But you did answer. Remember?
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  Pistoff

  OK:
  
  I am a one foot in, one foot out witness who was raised to see the stupidity of evolution.
  
  After three years of reading with an open mind, for once, I believe in evolution.
  
  Part of the reason for this, but only a small part, is the blatantly dishonest and unethical positions of people like Rex here. I learned here and on my own that the "Creation" book from the WT is mostly a restatement of YEC arguments, with the only change being that even the WT is not stupid enough to believe in a young earth.
  
  And then the incredible mental torture that Rex puts himself through. In this post he has villified science for attempting to explain the variety of species in nature: that's it. So, as I see it, after countless hours of research and observation they have found nothing to contradict the theory as understood today.
  
  Along comes Rex and the YEC's who REJECT the neutral reporting of findings, and replace it with:
  
  **You don't watch an object NOT bring itself into existence if it doesn't exist. Therefore, no law of logic can be observed by watching nothing.**
  
  Wow; proceeding from the imagined to the stupid conclusion. Rex: your lack of scientific training is obvious. Here, though, lack of scientific process is not revered as it is in YEC.
  
  
  (And the concept that God and Christianity is the source for logic and reasoning; I seem to have lost track of the scripture that champions logic. Maybe it is in the same book of the Bible where Uzzah dies for helping out??)
  
  
  Tell me Rex: do we replace all scientific method with your assertions that God is all, was all and will be all? How do I reconcile this with the next religious idiot that comes along, maybe with a padded vest and a button in his hand?
  
  After years of accepting what was told, I am throwing my lot in with science for this subject. At least science throws out it's frauds.
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  Cygnus

  Odrade, I'm not "wrong," what did I say? I said some lurkers would benefit from Alan's post then you substantiated that by tellng of your husband. Even Alan said I was right.
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  Shining One

  Thanks, Elderwho!
  
  Rex:Where does logic come from, eh Alan? Where does your reasoning come from in the first place? How can you, with a naturalistic presupposition, account for the existence of logical absolutes when logical absolutes are concepts of the mind and not physical, energy, or motion?"
  
  AL: You're getting into questions that no one can answer at present in a completely satisfactory way. I hope you understand that such "laws", being constructs of the mind, are like the "laws" and axioms of mathematics, and in fact are a subset of them.
  
  The keyword here is 'like' and that may not fit either.
  Yes, Alan. You did answer! If anyone out there is honest they can admit that your vaunted logic and scientific reasoning is totally useless in figuring out the Origins question. This is just like having a scripture debate with a JW who refuses to admit he's been had!
  Are any of you (agnostics, we know already that you can't be defined as atheists) going to follow the lead of ANTHONY FLUE and become a Deist? That's a real bummer, isn't it? Then you would (logically! LOL) have to decide which RELIGION has the best answer to the problem of evil. LOL
  Ouch, that brings us back to C.S. Lewis!!!!!!
  
  Rex
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  Odrade

  :: 6 months from now it will be long forgotten
  just this.
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  Shining One

  Reality is exactly that, Oldrade. Reality is what each one of us perceive since all of us have various presuppositions or axioms that we use to 'filter' what we observe. That's why Ken Ham said that his students were swayed by arguments both for and against evolution. You are probably taking in more naturalist influences, that changes your axioms. Many of us were ensnared by the WBTS in the same way. We had our previous belief system removed, and a new one put in its place.
  This is the mistake people make when they leave the Borg. This is the reason why so many JWs become agnostics and naturalists. They have already been pre-conditioned to discount any other faith. It is so easy to turn to the present fad of 'science', since our culture is inundated by their general assertions with few dissenting voices. Have you observed how people here try to drown out any contrary opnion to the popular one?
  Rex
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  stillajwexelder

  Thanks Alan - Good read
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  Shining One

  >yet it has diverged to the point of true reproductive isolation
  
  Is that the only requirement for speciation????? I think not! Come on, look at the claims of evolutionists. Primordial soup, magically (miraculously) becoming life, become single cell (we can't do that in a lab even now), becoming fish, becoming amphibians, becoming lizards, becoming mammals and speciation into man? LOL
  OOhhhhh, I forgot it took billions of years and we all know that if we have enough monkeys tapping typewriter keys they will eventually tyoe out the Bible! LOL again! From where did we gain consciousness? Oh, and how did the eye develop and how is it that the brain could transform light into pictures?
  What 'banged' the Big Bang and why is it slowing down? What happens when it stops?
  I guess the idea of 'pink, invisible unicorns' is becoming more reasonable now, is it not?
  Rex
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  rem

  Why are you bringing the Big Bang theory and Abiogenesis into a conversation about Evolution? Oh, that's right. Because you don't know what you're talking about.
  
  rem, atheist class
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  tetrapod.sapien

  Is that the only requirement for speciation????? I think not! Come on, look at the claims of evolutionists. Primordial soup, magically (miraculously) becoming life, become single cell (we can't do that in a lab even now), becoming fish, becoming amphibians, becoming lizards, becoming mammals and speciation into man? LOL
  
  OOhhhhh, I forgot it took billions of years and we all know that if we have enough monkeys tapping typewriter keys they will eventually tyoe out the Bible! LOL again! From where did we gain consciousness? Oh, and how did the eye develop and how is it that the brain could transform light into pictures?

  HA HA HA!!! ROFLMFAO!! (ah my god, thx rex, my sides hurt now...)

  are there any libraries in west virginia, rex? you have much work ahead of you.