Where Is Paradise?

by Honesty 15 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  Honesty

  The WTBTS says it is on earth. However, an examination of the 3 scriptures that mention paradise raises questions as to the validity of the WT's claims.

  For instance, at Luke 23:43 Jesus tells the criminal beside Him that he (the criminal) will be with Him (Jesus) in paradise. The WTBTS asserts that Jesus can never return to earth so where is the paradise Jesus was referring to?

  Luke 23:43 You will be with me in Paradise.”

  Paul, at 2 Corinthians 12:3-4 says that unutterable words which it is not lawful for a man to speak were heard in paradise. So who could speak these words and where would they be spoken if man could not speak them?

  2 Corinthians 12:3-4 Yes, I know such a man-whether in the body or apart from the body, I do not know, God knows- that he was caught away into paradise and heard unutterable words which it is not lawful for a man to speak.

  Jesus said, at Revelation 2:7 that to him that conquers Jesus would grant him to eat of the tree of life in the paradise of God. In Revelation, the only reference to ones who conquer are those who have the assurance of heaven. So is the tree of life on earth or in heaven?

  Revelation 2:7 To him that conquers I will grant to eat of the tree of life, which is in the paradise of God.’.
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  Robert K Stock

  According to the singer, song writer Meat Loaf, paradise can be seen by the dashboard light.
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  Legolas

  In Middle Earth!
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  Schizm

  Honesty,

  Adam and Eve originally lived in a "garden" called Eden. Of course the Garden of Eden was a physical paradise, but its physical beauty wasn't the only reason for it being a paradise. Inside the Garden of Eden there was security, good health, and true happiness = PARADISE.

  Is there only one such "paradise"? Apparently not, since Paul said that the "third heaven" was a paradise.

  2 I know a man in union with Christ who, fourteen years ago—whether in the body I do not know, or out of the body I do not know; God knows—was caught away as such to the third heaven. 3 Yes, I know such a man—whether in the body or apart from the body, I do not know, God knows— 4 that he was caught away into paradise and heard unutterable words which it is not lawful for a man to speak.--2 Corinthians 12:2-4.

  Where is this "third heaven" that Paul refers to, and who live in that paradise?

  Looking up, we normally think of the earth's atmosphere as being a heaven = Heaven # 1.

  But what lies out past the atmosphere? Of course that would be the realm which the material galaxies occupy, which would then = Heaven # 2.

  Now if Heaven # 2 begins where earth's atmosphere ends, then logically, Heaven # 3 would be found just out past the most distant galaxies. And Paul said that voices were heard in THIS heaven. Whose voices were they? Apparently, the "third heaven" that Paul alluded to is the place/realm in God's vast universe where the angels themselves live, and so the voices heard were those of the holy angels. Do the angels enjoy paradisiac conditions?

  Apparently, there's more than one paradise.

  .
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  FlyingHighNow

  Heaven is in Your Mind (Winwood/Capaldi/Wood) You ride on the swing in and out of the bars Capturing moments of life in a jar Playing with children, acting as stars Guiding your visions to heaven and heaven is in your mind Take extra care not to lose what up feel The apple you're eating is simple and real Water the flowers that grow at your heel guiding your visions to heaven and heaven is in your mind ------------------------------------------------------------------------ F.S. Music Ltd (PRS) & Island Music Ltd. (PRS) All rights on behalf of F.S. Music Ltd. admin by Warner-Tamerlane Publishing Corp (BMI)
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  heathen

  Schism --- I think it likely he was talking about the jerusalem above . The city in which jesus does return to earth in during the conclusion of the system of things . I believe the entire earth will be made a garden paradise when that happens . The thief will be resurrected with the rest of the dead but likely not in the first resurrection of saints since jesus did not anoint him or promise him a co ruler position . rev .20:5
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  Legolas

  Ok, Ok, for the second time...It is in Middle Earth!
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  doofdaddy

  Heaven or hell. It's your mind which create them
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  JosephMalik

  For instance, at Luke 23:43 Jesus tells the criminal beside Him that he (the criminal) will be with Him (Jesus) in paradise. The WTBTS asserts that Jesus can never return to earth so where is the paradise Jesus was referring to? Honesty, The WTBTS is wrong! The scriptures clearly teach that our Lord will return here to earth once again in the flesh just as He was taken up: Acts 1:11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven. Honesty said: Paul, at 2 Corinthians 12:3-4 says that unutterable words which it is not lawful for a man to speak were heard in paradise. So who could speak these words and where would they be spoken if man could not speak them? 2 Corinthians 12:3-4 Yes, I know such a man-whether in the body or apart from the body, I do not know, God knows- that he was caught away into paradise and heard unutterable words which it is not lawful for a man to speak. Paul did not say that man could not speak them. He said that it is not lawful for a man to speak them at least not yet. Paul did not have authorization to reveal in detail what he saw in this Paradise. However Paul did give us other insight into such a paradise such as the immortality of its inhabitants and how some will be changed when they enter. This Paradise is the promised Kingdom here on earth where Christ will be at that time. It is the third heaven in which this thief will also exist. The first heaven was the Law covenant under which man served God. The second heaven is the Kingdom Covenant under which we now serve God. This third Heaven will be the Kingdom itself the heaven here on earth to which our Lord will return and into which resurrection will take place and qualified mankind will serve God to become Sons of God once again. Honesty said: Jesus said, at Revelation 2:7 that to him that conquers Jesus would grant him to eat of the tree of life in the paradise of God. In Revelation, the only reference to ones who conquer are those who have the assurance of heaven. So is the tree of life on earth or in heaven? Revelation 2:7 To him that conquers I will grant to eat of the tree of life, which is in the paradise of God.’ Why do so many interpret the word “Heaven” as a place somewhere in the universe far, far away? Sometimes it is used that way and sometimes not. We should pay attention to the message being given and not jump to such conclusions? Did you notice that heaven does not appear in Rev. 2.7 that you used here? You simply added this meaning yourself is this not so? Where then is the scripture that teaches us that God will make non-human beings out of human ones to fill out this day of rest? Theology is full of this sort of thing and the WTBTS prints it in abundance. Perhaps it is time to study the scriptures for ourselves apart from such erroneous literature. Joseph
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  skinnyboy

  Great Ocean Road, Victoria, Australia..... In my car, with my mrs, Dean martin on the stereo, sun shining on the black top.... plus you get to see the 12 Apostles there too!