Posts by OneEyedJoe

28

Is it really that great being one of the Governing Body Members?

by John Aquila in

movie stars travel to, or buy their own private beaches, they get invited to fun parties, and are able to buy not one, but several fast sport cars like jay leno.

they can buy their own planes and helicopters and fly them like harrison ford.

(how much fun would that be?

OneEyedJoe

I think it's all relative. Would I want to be a GB member? Hell no. However for them, it may well be the best life they could achieve. They have a level of security that most people do not - they needn't worry about their housing, food, healthcare. They live on well manicured grounds and get to travel the world with no cost. They don't own mansions, but they have access to picturesque "regional translation offices" and I'm sure they're not staying in 1-star motels while traveling. They clearly either use the money they control to purchase luxuries for themselves (watches that cost 5-figures, gold rings, etc) or they use their power to secure many "gifts."

Security is an immensely valuable thing, and these guys have it. They may have to live by the moral code that they've set up, but I'm certain that there are ways around that for men in their position. Honestly I didn't find the JW moral code to be all that oppressive (well, not once I got married...) and they probably aren't bothered by the parts of it that they follow. Their friends might be conditional, but they're probably all bordering on sociopaths (being conservative) and probably enjoy the power that they wield over their "friends." Their travel may be for JW events in most cases, but there are a great many people who would love to go and talk in front of an enthralled audience of thousands of adoring fans anytime they travel. I'm sure the JW related events are a very different experience as a GB member - not the drudgery that we're used to. So a vacation centered around a convention might be quite enjoyable in that position.

They may not get the absolute best in life, but lets face it - if not for the cult they'd be nothing close to movie stars, so it's not really a worthwhile comparison. The life of a GB member is probably the absolute best life that any of them could attain. Just because I'd kill myself doesn't mean that they're absolutely not in it for themselves. Whether conscious or not, I believe that most, if not all, of them are definitely keeping the cult going in part to maintain their lifestyle.

25

Going Nuclear - Marriage

by Sofia Lose in

has anyone here gone nuclear on their spouse and, all of a sudden, came out in the open as a jw opposer?.

by this i mean, sitting them down and saying: i no longer want to be a jw anymore, do not want to go to meetings or preaching anymore!

and, what has happened in the relationship after that?.

OneEyedJoe

Husband has expressed to me that he would choose Jehovah over me, in a fit of rage of course. I love him and our marriage is great in every way, except for me having to fake the faith thing for many years now. He is hardcore, so it does not look good for me. However, this faking stuff is weighing heavier as time passes by.

You can't always trust what's said in a fit of rage, to be sure. If your marriage is otherwise good, then you probably have good chances of being able to at least maintain a dialog about how to move forward instead of him just blowing up and leaving you. It might be worthwhile to see a therapist or counselor of some kind for a little while in order to learn how best to communicate in order to keep things civil while working towards a solution that you can both live with. A therapist can also help you work out just what it is that you actually want as well as providing support before and after you call it quits - that support will likely make a huge difference if things do go as badly as you fear.

It sounds like you've been going through the motions for quite some time. I don't know how you do it. The year I spent at it was miserable and it was affecting every aspect of my life and it definitely did some damage to my marriage as well. Perhaps you don't have to jump in with both feet, though - maybe you can talk to him simply about taking some time off from the JW thing to work through your doubts...you might find that it's not that much easier than faking it, or you might find that it's the best thing you've ever done. That'll really inform your decision whether or not to make a stand.

28

Im always afraid

by BlackWolf in

jw
friends

people tell me all sorts of different opinions.

i seem to feel a constant feeling of dread and anxiety.

the possibility of god existing scares me but so does the possibility of him not.

OneEyedJoe

Thank you all for your advice. Although I don't really have any close friends and I'm not allowed to talk to non jws. And I homeschool.

You're definitely in an unenviable position. Obviously the ideal would be to have a great support system of people that could be physically present with you. If that's not possible, feel free to PM me if you ever want to talk things through. I'm sure a great many others on this site would be willing to provide a listening ear as well.

25

Going Nuclear - Marriage

by Sofia Lose in

has anyone here gone nuclear on their spouse and, all of a sudden, came out in the open as a jw opposer?.

by this i mean, sitting them down and saying: i no longer want to be a jw anymore, do not want to go to meetings or preaching anymore!

and, what has happened in the relationship after that?.

OneEyedJoe

I didn't initiate it directly, but I had that conversation with my wife back in April. She'd known for a few months that something was up (it'd been about a year being awake) and apparently my attempting to show her an article of how the mormons use the BITE model for control was the final straw. We talked a while and for a while I played it as if it was innocent for a while but when she asked me point-blank if I'd made up my mind that I don't want to be a JW I confirmed that I had.

It was touch-and-go there for a little while, but we've more or less recovered into a place where we can at least talk fairly openly with civility. It took probably 3 months before the random crying spells (on her part) stopped, but they tapered off after a while. I'll not say that the marriage has fully recovered, but I expect that to take some time...the year that I spent awake caused some significant problems due to her treatment of me for what little tapering off in cult activity that I did during that time.

On the plus side, I haven't been to a meeting or recruiting since mid april and she hasn't tried to get me to go either. She knows I'm done and I'm never going back and she seems to be accepting that part of the new reality reasonably well.

She and her parents (though not her brother, apparently) seem to be somewhat more liberal than most JWs, though. She's gotten upset about other people who have started to treat me as "bad association" (not complete shunning, but it's noticeable) because she doesn't think it's right to cut someone out just because of their privately held beliefs (but somehow she refuses to see that doing so is completely in line with what they're taught to do). So in that way she might not be completely typical.

Unfortunately, there are no guarantees here. I've read accounts of someone "coming out" in this situation and the responses seem to have ranged from immediate separation followed by divorce to the spouse relating that they too have had doubts and the couple examining them and leaving together.

I wish you the best of luck in whatever you decide to do, though.

3

Vincent TOOLE

by Joe Grundy in

i have just reviewed the arc evidence given by this man.

it is pathetic.. i am now retired, but until then my professional life was spent in the legal arena.

toole fumbles his way through his answers, fails to understand the principle of 'instructions', and so much more.

OneEyedJoe

Toole has proved himself to be a dickhead.

Toole is a tool.

24

If they go bankrupt, so what?

by maksutov in

it seems likely that the watchtower is worried about its finances, given the downsizing, property schemes, and money-grabs we have been seeing over the last few years.

perhaps they suffered badly from the financial crisis.

for sure, there will be more expenses to come from child abuse payouts.

OneEyedJoe

They won't go bankrupt, but if they come upon increasingly difficult times financially they'll be likely to start downsizing and selling off KHs to take the money while simultaneously continuing their recent pattern of shamelessly asking for money in every way they can come up with. I expect that both of these will shake a few loose of their grasp. Hearing ever increasing demands for money and getting nothing in return for your contributions as your KH is sold out from under you and you're required to drive long distances - I expect many will reach a breaking point. Maybe they don't wake up right away, but this could be enough to cause many to stop attending and give them the mental space needed to start to see other flaws and overcome their phobia of "apostate information" and wake up.

I don't expect this cult to disappear anytime soon, but anything that gives another opportunity for the r/f JWs to wake up and get out of this abusive cult is a good thing.

39

The only way to know God exists!

by iconoclastic in

do everything as god would do if he were present here.

this will attract his attention, and you will experience his invisible hands blessing everything you do, giving you results more than what you sowed.. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------.

hence put to the test the above, and then you can make really authentic comments!.

OneEyedJoe

Which god?

31

How to evade questions from elders when you stop going out door to door

by Olivia Wilde in

due to circumstances right now i cannot leave permanently the watchtower, however i need honest advice of what to say when elders question me how come im not meeting the group out for door to door & going out in " field service"... what would be proper responses not to draw suspicions since i'm aware of ttatt.. .any serious advice please...

OneEyedJoe

There is no way around it, either you come clean or tell a lie...

That's not necessarily true. Silence works too.

When I was visited by a couple elders to "encourage" me, I didn't tell them a single lie and I didn't tell them enough to DF me either. Much of the exchange went like this:

Elder: Is there a reason you haven't been at the meetings?

Me: Yes.

Elder: Do you want to share that reason with us?

Me: No.

Elder: Ok...(long pause) Well do you still view your dedication to jehovah as something that is valid to you?

Me: My relationship with god is a very personal thing.

Elder: Uh....OK...well do you believe that the bible is god's word?

Me: That's definitely a very good question that everyone really needs to consider and decide for themselves, isn't it?

Elder: Yes...yes it is...

It's not necessarily an easy thing to do, because you'll be acutely aware of how uncomfortable you're making them. Especially if you actually happen to like the elders that are questioning you - one of them was a very kind brother that I liked personally, but luckily the douche ex-DO that's been COBE for all of 3 months was the one that did all the talking which made it a little easier. He definitely wasn't used to someone failing to bow down and spill their guts at his questioning, but there's nothing he can do about it, ultimately.

27

Who am I to screw up their happiness?

by Crazyguy in

that was the question to me tonight.

because of their beliefs they have a moral compass, a net work of friends and a support group.

they have what they believe is a loving god.

OneEyedJoe

It's not your fault that they're living in delusion. The pain of waking up is not caused by the information that causes the awakening, the pain is because of the delusion that was previously entertained.

Who are you to bring an end to their delusion? I would ask the inverse question instead - who are you to withhold evidence that they are staking (and wasting) their lives on the lies of a cult?

Just because this cult bases it's lies on a twisting of biblical scripture doesn't make it's control over the lives of JWs any more justified than Scientology's control over the lives of it's adherents. Yes they teach a semblance of a moral code, but how great are the morals that JWs are taught? I think just about everyone, regardless of their cultural upbringing gets the basics pretty much instinctively: don't steal, murder, rape, etc. Let's look at the morals that JWs teach that won't come to them naturally. They're taught that a person's privately held beliefs are grounds for emotionally manipulative behavior designed to force that person to change their beliefs. They're taught to fear, distrust, and invalidate the rights of homosexuals. They're taught to feel shame due to their normal sexual impulses. They're taught to judge everyone they meet based on the arbitrary (and I would argue, damaging) rules made by the watchtower society. The list could go on nearly forever. The JW moral code is not something to be put on a pedestal. In fact, one could argue that having a moral code prescribed by a third party does little but discourage a person from devoting thought to how best to live in society in such a way that it is bettered by their presence. An absence of an imposed moral compass can leave someone a better person because they have to put thought into it themselves and thus they're more invested in their moral decisions.

You also cite the community that they have... Sure maybe waking up will cause some loss there, and it's difficult to rebuild, but they will become a part of a community roughly 1000 times larger. They'll be free to chose their own community based on who they like, not based on who professes to hold the beliefs as published by a man-made cult.

175

Implications of gay marriage ruling

by Rattigan350 in

while many think that the ruling is good for the gays and their response is: how does that affect your marriage; then on the other side the religious people cry god and sinners.

but both are missing the forest through the trees.. the problem with the ruling is that which is discussed here so many times.

five unelected federal officials decided on policy for the whole country, running roughshod over every democratic principle.

OneEyedJoe

You're absolutely right! This whole movement reminds me so much of the Watchtower, the similarities are uncanny.

Yeah, this is just like the WTS! Those guys are always expanding personal freedom! Damn them to hell!