insidetheKH

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Posts by insidetheKH

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  42

  Preaching is a waste of time

  by konceptual99 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  before anyone gives me the "bears/wood" similarities, this is a post based on insidethekh's reply on the mormon v jw thread.

  (http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/287545/1/who-is-copying-who-jws-or-mormons) i like to see wt friendly posts on here as some of the wt bashing displays the same logical fallacies as levelled against the wts and it's followers so it's good to consider reasoned debate.. on the one hand i think itkh makes a fair point if you compare the worldwide success of mormons v jws but there is an overall context to the preaching work that is completely ignored by those fully "in" and has been a major factor in my move from being an active witness to one on the cusp of getting out.

  from a statistical point of view there are great headline numbers presented by the wts but if you put them in the context of the number of witnesses, conversation ratios, ratio of new witnesses to birth rates, numbers that must be leaving, growth differentials across the globe, penetration in muslim nations and so on then these numbers become meaningless.

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  insidetheKH

  @Vidiot In the United states and 2 or 3 other countries this is the case in the rest of the world this is not the case. Besides that, Mormons count everyone who was ever baptised as a member regardless if the person still identifies himself as a mormon or not, and they also count all unbaptised children under 8 years old as a member.

  So their numbers are inflated. On the other hand the number of Jehovah's Witnesses is considered (by scholars) to be conservative cause JW's only count those who participate regurarly in the preaching work.

  That is why JW's say that there are only 1.2 million JW's in the U.S and national surveys say there are more than 2 million people in the U.S that identify themselves as JW.
• 
  42

  Preaching is a waste of time

  by konceptual99 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  before anyone gives me the "bears/wood" similarities, this is a post based on insidethekh's reply on the mormon v jw thread.

  (http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/287545/1/who-is-copying-who-jws-or-mormons) i like to see wt friendly posts on here as some of the wt bashing displays the same logical fallacies as levelled against the wts and it's followers so it's good to consider reasoned debate.. on the one hand i think itkh makes a fair point if you compare the worldwide success of mormons v jws but there is an overall context to the preaching work that is completely ignored by those fully "in" and has been a major factor in my move from being an active witness to one on the cusp of getting out.

  from a statistical point of view there are great headline numbers presented by the wts but if you put them in the context of the number of witnesses, conversation ratios, ratio of new witnesses to birth rates, numbers that must be leaving, growth differentials across the globe, penetration in muslim nations and so on then these numbers become meaningless.

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  insidetheKH

  @theredeemer worldwide the situation for mormon active membership is even worse

  In the "Vital Statistics" article of the Encyclopedia of Mormonism, Dr. Tim Heaton cites internal church data:

  "Attendance at sacrament meeting varies substantially. Canada, the South Pacific, and the United States average between 40 percent and 50 percent. Europe and Africa average about 35 percent. Asia and Latin America have weekly attendance rates of about 25 percent."

  For clarity, Dr. Heaton cites data as representing the average attendance at sacrament meeting as a percentage of membership. These figures do not appear to include "lost address file members," as sacrament meeting attendance rates are calculated based on total congregational membership, whereas lost address file members are not included in congregational rolls. When "lost address file" members are included in the denominator of total membership, weekly attendance rates as a percentage of total membership would be further diluted by our conservative estimate of the lost address file comprising 10% of total North American membership and 30% of membership in the developing world.

  Read this article written by mormons

  http://www.cumorah.com/index.php?target=church_growth_articles&story_id=13
• 
  42

  Preaching is a waste of time

  by konceptual99 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  before anyone gives me the "bears/wood" similarities, this is a post based on insidethekh's reply on the mormon v jw thread.

  (http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/287545/1/who-is-copying-who-jws-or-mormons) i like to see wt friendly posts on here as some of the wt bashing displays the same logical fallacies as levelled against the wts and it's followers so it's good to consider reasoned debate.. on the one hand i think itkh makes a fair point if you compare the worldwide success of mormons v jws but there is an overall context to the preaching work that is completely ignored by those fully "in" and has been a major factor in my move from being an active witness to one on the cusp of getting out.

  from a statistical point of view there are great headline numbers presented by the wts but if you put them in the context of the number of witnesses, conversation ratios, ratio of new witnesses to birth rates, numbers that must be leaving, growth differentials across the globe, penetration in muslim nations and so on then these numbers become meaningless.

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• 

  insidetheKH

  @theredeeemer there are several independent sources but also the LDS source that i mentioned in a previous post confirms this in one of their studies. Anyway here is a recent reuters news article that confirms it.

  http://uk.reuters.com/article/2012/01/30/uk-mormonchurch-idUKTRE80T1CP20120130

  A quote from the article:

  The LDS church claims 14 million members worldwide -- optimistically including nearly every person baptized. But census data from some foreign countries targeted by clean-cut young missionaries show that the retention rate for their converts is as low as 25 percent. In the U.S., only about half of Mormons are active members of the church, said Washington State University emeritus sociologist Armand Mauss, a leading researcher on Mormons.

  Sociologists estimate there are as few as 5 million active members worldwide.
• 
  42

  Preaching is a waste of time

  by konceptual99 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  before anyone gives me the "bears/wood" similarities, this is a post based on insidethekh's reply on the mormon v jw thread.

  (http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/287545/1/who-is-copying-who-jws-or-mormons) i like to see wt friendly posts on here as some of the wt bashing displays the same logical fallacies as levelled against the wts and it's followers so it's good to consider reasoned debate.. on the one hand i think itkh makes a fair point if you compare the worldwide success of mormons v jws but there is an overall context to the preaching work that is completely ignored by those fully "in" and has been a major factor in my move from being an active witness to one on the cusp of getting out.

  from a statistical point of view there are great headline numbers presented by the wts but if you put them in the context of the number of witnesses, conversation ratios, ratio of new witnesses to birth rates, numbers that must be leaving, growth differentials across the globe, penetration in muslim nations and so on then these numbers become meaningless.

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  insidetheKH

  @konceptual the question is did the world notice the preaching work of Noah? Or did they notice the preaching work of Christ and the first Christians? How well were/was their message known and what impact did their message had on their societies? The problem is not the messenger nor the message.

  The problem is that most people are not interested in the message
• 
  42

  Preaching is a waste of time

  by konceptual99 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  before anyone gives me the "bears/wood" similarities, this is a post based on insidethekh's reply on the mormon v jw thread.

  (http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/287545/1/who-is-copying-who-jws-or-mormons) i like to see wt friendly posts on here as some of the wt bashing displays the same logical fallacies as levelled against the wts and it's followers so it's good to consider reasoned debate.. on the one hand i think itkh makes a fair point if you compare the worldwide success of mormons v jws but there is an overall context to the preaching work that is completely ignored by those fully "in" and has been a major factor in my move from being an active witness to one on the cusp of getting out.

  from a statistical point of view there are great headline numbers presented by the wts but if you put them in the context of the number of witnesses, conversation ratios, ratio of new witnesses to birth rates, numbers that must be leaving, growth differentials across the globe, penetration in muslim nations and so on then these numbers become meaningless.

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  insidetheKH

  @theredeemer most visitors to this church are expats from the united states and a lot of american youngsters. In my country of 17 million people there are officially about 9000 part of the LDS church. About 50% of them show up at their church meetings.

  I live next to the ward for four years now. Before that i lived 40 years in 4 different cities. Never saw one at my door and heard never anyone speaking about having mormons at their door. Contrary to that, all here have had JW's at their door.
• 
  42

  Preaching is a waste of time

  by konceptual99 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  before anyone gives me the "bears/wood" similarities, this is a post based on insidethekh's reply on the mormon v jw thread.

  (http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/287545/1/who-is-copying-who-jws-or-mormons) i like to see wt friendly posts on here as some of the wt bashing displays the same logical fallacies as levelled against the wts and it's followers so it's good to consider reasoned debate.. on the one hand i think itkh makes a fair point if you compare the worldwide success of mormons v jws but there is an overall context to the preaching work that is completely ignored by those fully "in" and has been a major factor in my move from being an active witness to one on the cusp of getting out.

  from a statistical point of view there are great headline numbers presented by the wts but if you put them in the context of the number of witnesses, conversation ratios, ratio of new witnesses to birth rates, numbers that must be leaving, growth differentials across the globe, penetration in muslim nations and so on then these numbers become meaningless.

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• 

  insidetheKH

  @theredeemer i am fully aware of the statistics. I live next to a LDS Ward. Active membership within the mormon world is about 5 million. The number you mention is inflated since it includes inactive members and everyone who is baptised no matter if you still show up or tithe or not.

  If JW'S would count like that they would exceed 20 million (on the memorial alone they had 19.5 million attendants this year)

  Everyone who is really interested in this subject Mormons vs JW's and growth statistics should read some studies and essays of this LDS Mormon website

  http://www.cumorah.com/

  One of their conclusions is :

  The percentage increase in the number of Adventist and Witness congregations has dramatically outpaced growth rates for the LDS Church in nearly every nation where all three denominations operate.
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  25

  Who is copying who? Jws or Mormons?

  by stuckinarut2 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  it amazes me!.

  witnesses go on about how "blessed we are to have the website and all the content from jehovah etc".

  but i have been noticing the parallels between jws and the mormons!.

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  insidetheKH

  the uniqueness of the JW.ORG website is the ever growing and unmatched number of languages wherein a massive amount of spiritual content can be obtained.

  If you look at it on a worldwide scale Jehovah's Witnesses do a much better job. They exist for a shorter period of time but managed to get a much larger number of followers in almost any country outside of the U.S. For example in my (european) country all people have had witnesses at their doorstep but almost none ever saw a mormon show up.
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  6

  JW'S BANNED AS EXTREMEIST IN RUSSIAN REGION

  by NoMoreHustle in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  has anybody else seen this article?.

  http://www.themoscowtimes.com/news/article/jehovah-s-witnesses-banned-as-extremist-in-russian-region/511221.html.

  depends on how you look at this but this can be bad for us that are still in because:.

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  insidetheKH

  the same sort of lies and propaganda tactics that islamic and arabic tv stations use or the Nazis used against certain groups. There are even clear examples of that on youtube. For example a news coverage from the state sponsored Russian Today TV channel.
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  6

  JW'S BANNED AS EXTREMEIST IN RUSSIAN REGION

  by NoMoreHustle in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  has anybody else seen this article?.

  http://www.themoscowtimes.com/news/article/jehovah-s-witnesses-banned-as-extremist-in-russian-region/511221.html.

  depends on how you look at this but this can be bad for us that are still in because:.

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  insidetheKH

  nothing new on the horizon they have problems , arrests, razzia's , confiscations of literature and real estate , imprisonment and much more of that for years now in several parts of Russia and countries that were part of the former soviet union. This ban in Samara is just a part of that problem.

  Russia is becoming a dictatorstate again with no free press and no independent justice system, no independent media. These actions against the witnesses are instignated by the Russian Orthodox Church. The Patriarch of that Church even lives inside the Kremlin since 2011. I have seen television programs full of lies and propaganda on russian state television about Jehovah's Witnesses.

  The Witnesses will appeal to the ECHR but that will not help them, even if they win the case , because Russia does not listen to any institution.

  It's sad for the witnesses overthere because life becomes very hard for them. I have several friends (JW's) in St Petersburg. But in the end it will not change anything. Jehovah's Witnesses will stay there and will continue to do their 'work' nothing can or will stop that.
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  20

  JW's donations going to sexual abuse cases?

  by Ginx in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  i read somewhere on the internet (don't recall what site it was) that jw's donations are going towards sexual abuse cases.. is this true?.

  where can i find solid evidence regarding this matter?.

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  insidetheKH

  Financially the WTS is like the Nintendo of religion.. Nintendo has enough cash in the bank to run a deficit for 38 years