opusdei1972
JoinedPosts by opusdei1972
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I found this video more spiritualizing than a Bible story
by opusdei1972 inhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_ytm34yvcu
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Revised New World Translation
by FusionTheism ini just wanted to put it out there that i am actually truly impressed by the revised nwt.
i think it's an awesome bible version.. the only issues i have are that it should only have "jehovah" in the new testament when quoting the old, and the alternate translation of john 1:1 in the footnote should be in the main text..
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opusdei1972
FusionTheism :
May be you are unaware about this issue where the NWT Committee showed great dishonesty. In koine greek jews and christians established two different words to denote the whole temple of Herod, and the inner part of it, which was only for the priests. The first one, is IERON (which means temple) and the second one is NAOS (which means the sanctuary of the temple). Of course, in latin versions there is no such a difference, so both words were translated as templum. However, The NWT Committee knew this difference, because they translated directly from a Greek Version (Wescott Hort). So, convieniently, the NWT Committee chose to translate the greek word NAOS, which means "sanctuary", by the word "temple" in Revelation 7:15
That is why they are before the throne of God, and they are rendering him sacred service day and night in his temple; and the One seated on the throne will spread his tent over them. (NWT, Rev. 7:15)
Nevertheless, the word NAOS was rightly translated as temple sanctuary in Rev. 11:19:
And the temple sanctuary of God in heaven was opened, and the ark of his covenant was seen in his temple sanctuary. (NWT, Rev. 11:19)Note that the NAOS is in heaven, not on earth.
Now, let us read how the Committee, translated Revelation 14:15
Another angel emerged from the temple sanctuary, calling with a loud voice to the one seated on the cloud: “Put your sickle in and reap, because the hour has come to reap, for the harvest of the earth is fully ripe. (RNWT, Rev. 14:15)Also, they rightly translated NAOS as temple sanctuary. But the Committee translated NAOS simply by "temple" in Revelation 7:15, so as to propagate the false teaching that "the great crowd" serves in the "courtyard of the Gentiles":
This beautiful vision presents the international “great crowd” as serving Jehovah in his temple, that is, in the earthly courtyards reserved for those who are not spiritual Israelites, as it were in the “courtyard of the Gentiles.” – The Watchtower, 12/1/1972, p. 722 “The Gathering of All Nations to One Temple to Worship”However, though the temple had courtyards, all the courtyards were out of the Sanctuary (NAOS):
among the Jews, the sanctuary in the "Temple," into which only the priests could lawfully enter, e.g., Luke 1:9, Luke 1:21-Luke 1:22; Christ, as being of the tribe of Judah, and thus not being a priest while upon the earth (Hebrews 7:13-Hebrews 7:14; Hebrews 8:4), did not enter the naos; (NAOS, Vine's Dictionary)Accordingly, the great crowd, according to John, is a heavenly and priestly group.
So, this is a clear example why the NWT is a biased and dishonest translation.
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Was Jesus a real person?
by Coded Logic inwhy didn't jesus ever write anything?
why are there no letters to jesus?
no painting of jesus from that time?
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opusdei1972
Why didn't Jesus ever write anything? Why are there no letters to Jesus?
Because he thought he would not die in that way. So, his disciples had to justify it by using the Old Testament.
Also, his early disciples thought that Jesus would return soon, during his generation, but it did not happen. Then, the next generation felt the necessity to write about him. But they compiled contradictory traditions about him.
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Was Jesus a real person?
by Coded Logic inwhy didn't jesus ever write anything?
why are there no letters to jesus?
no painting of jesus from that time?
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opusdei1972
I believe Jesus was a real person. However, it is difficult to know which were his words, because the Four Gospels are 90% unreliable. So, I believe that there was jew called Jesus, who died by crucifixion, and his disciples propagated the doctrine that he resurrected. Also, they tried to find support for this doctrine in OT passages taken out of context. -
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A Whole New Watchtower Society (Governing Body 3.0 / Simplified Society)
by FusionTheism ina whole new watchtower society (governing body 3.0 / simplified society).
i'm not here to attack the governing body, watchtower society, or the jehovah's witnesses (jw) organization.
the bible says there is just "one hope" for christians (ephesians 4:4).
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opusdei1972
On the contrary, there are many things they teach and do which I agree with, which are based on the holy inspired Scriptures, the Word of God.
This is your main problem. I thought it in the past, after leaving the Society. But a careful reading of the Bible will lead to the conclusion that there was no God behind the writers of its books.
However, I want to analyze some of your statements:
The Trinity Doctrine is not taught in the Bible. It was developed over 300 years after Jesus.
Yes, however, contradictory statements contained in the Bible caused a division between christians, as early as the second century. For instance, in Hebrews 1:10 the author quoted a verse of the Psalms, so as to affirm that God the Father called his son as "Oh Lord!" (Kurie).
The doctrine of eternal torment in Hell-fire is not Biblically-accurate or in harmony with God's justice.
Yes, the doctrine of eternal torment is totally unjust, but the early christians believed in this doctrine because Jesus did (read the story of the rich man and Lazarus). The Watchtower does not want you to know that Pharisees and Essenes were jewish sects who believed in a post mortem place of punishment. So, Jesus believed in it.
The Calvinistic "TULIP" doctrines of Predestination are wrong and make God out to be evil.
The Jewsih God, Yahweh, is very unjust. You are trying to eliminate in him his perversity, but you can't avoid the shameful Old Testament passages:
Now go and smite Am′alek, and utterly destroy all that they have; do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass (1 Samuel 15:3)
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Would you like to live for ever on earth?
by fulano ini was discussing this topic with two friends of mine, ex jws, a few nights ago.
i think it would be boring after a while.
you can't smoke, have to drink with moderation (difficult in europe with all the wines).
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opusdei1972
May be Yes, but not within the rules of the Watchtower Society. Otherwise I would be eternally a robot without brain. -
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List of New Light statements in 2015
by FusionTheism inmarch 15 2015 study watchtower:.
* the parables are all "simplified" now.. * doing away with most type / antitype interpretations (except for prophecies).. * the governing body was appointed in 1919 but will not receive their reward of expanded authority until the great tribulation.. * the evil slave is not a class of people, it's a hypothetical warning for each individual anointed one.. ---------.
may 15 2015 study watchtower:.
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opusdei1972
No significant change. It is the same bullshit. -
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1919 Doctrine no longer exists? (Today's Watchtower Study)
by FusionTheism inquote from today's watchtower study article that's being studied at the halls (march 15, 2015, page 24):.
"understanding the illustration of the talents".
"when the master rewards the slaves.".
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opusdei1972
FusionTheism The updated view, since July 15th 2013, is that Jesus inspected all religions between 1914 and 1919. The past view was that Jesus did his inspection in 1918. The Watchtower has eliminated the relevancy of the year 1918. And for your information, The Watchtower said that since 1918 the holy spirit ceased to function as "The Helper" for the anointed ones, because since 1918 Jesus is in his spiritual temple:
“But when the Lord Jesus comes to his temple and gathers his approved ones into the temple, is there any further need for the office of the holy spirit as a helper and advocate? If not, then the advocacy of the holy spirit would there cease. Jesus, being in the temple and with his chosen ones, would act for them directly.” (Watchtower, September 1, 1930 p. 263)
“It would seem that there would be no necessity for the ‘servant’ to have an advocate such as the holy spirit, because the ‘servant’ to have an advocate is in direct communication with Jehovah and as Jehovah’s instrument, and Christ Jesus acts for the entire body.” (p. 263)
“‘The servant’ is anointed to do a specific work. ‘The servant’ is made up of Christ Jesus the Head, the resurrected saints, and the called and chosen ones on the earth who have been brought into the temple and who have entered into the joy of the Lord. Individually those of the remnant on earth must have their standing before God in the beloved One Christ Jesus, and the beloved One is their advocate. Being in the temple, however, there would seem to be no good reason why there should be an advocacy in their behalf by the holy spirit, since the Lord is now with them.” (p. 263)
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Damned if they do, Damned if they don't
by FusionTheism ini see an attitude among some people here which is not very helpful.
i can understand it, but still, it's not constructive or helpful.. if you condemn the society for not changing, but then you also condemn them when they do change in a positive way, what incentive or motive does that provide for the people at the society to ever want to change for the better?.
also, what does that attitude look like to current witnesses who are having doubts?.
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opusdei1972
Fusion Theism: I have a question for this statement given by you:
* A gradual improvement of their blood policies, including the approval of hemoglobin and many other fractions.
Do you know that when you have a meaningful loss of blood, you urgently need a blood transfusion, and there is no other way to face this problem?? ...however, let's quote how an article in JW.ORG deceives the Witnesses:
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http://www.jw.org/en/jehovahs-witnesses/activities/living-bible-principles/blood-transfusions/#?insight[search_id]=76f20549-788b-42a9-959f-144552f7753d&insight[search_result_index]=0
For decades, Jehovah’s Witnesses have been criticized because of their refusal to accept blood transfusions. That refusal, based on the Biblical directive to ‘abstain from blood,’ has at times clashed with what doctors thought to be in the best medical interests of their patients.—Acts 15:29.
Increasingly, however, experienced voices within the medical community have been pointing to medical reasons for using clinical strategies that avoid blood transfusion.
The Spring 2013 issue of the journal Stanford Medicine Magazine, a publication of the Stanford University School of Medicine, contained a special report on blood, part of which was entitled “Against the Flow—What’s Behind the Decline in Blood Transfusions?” The author of that article, Sarah C. P. Williams, states: “Over the past decade, a growing body of research has revealed that in hospitals around the world, donated blood is used more often, and in larger quantities, than is needed to help patients—both in operating rooms and hospital wards.”
The author quotes Patricia Ford, M.D., founder and director of The Center for Bloodless Medicine and Surgery at Pennsylvania Hospital. Dr. Ford said: “There’s this idea ingrained in the culture of medicine that people will die if they don’t have a certain level of blood, that blood is the ultimate lifesaver . . . That’s true in some specific situations, * but for most patients in most situations it’s just not true.”
Dr. Ford, who treats about 700 of Jehovah’s Witnesses each year, also said: “Many physicians I talked to . . . had this misperception that a lot of patients just can’t survive without receiving blood . . . I may have even thought that myself to some degree. But what I rapidly learned was you can care for these patients by just applying some easy strategies.”
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So, as you read, the Watchtower has partially quoted the article “Against the Flow—What’s Behind the Decline in Blood Transfusions?” , which apparently says that some physicians have a misperception that "patients just can't survive without receiving blood". However, The Watchtower omitted to quote meaningful statements of that article:
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In some emergency situations, though, patients will always need blood transfusions. Despite years of research, no safe substitutes for real human blood have been developed that can help patients in cases of blood loss......And for many trauma patients, and others who need a transfusion in an emergency, it’s still true that blood is a lifesaver. The more than 50,000 blood donations through Stanford Blood Center each year are key to saving many lives.
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Note that "in cases of blood loss.....blood is a lifesaver", but most of the witnesses who died for the blood ban were in that case. So, the Watchtower intentionally misses the main point. -
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Damned if they do, Damned if they don't
by FusionTheism ini see an attitude among some people here which is not very helpful.
i can understand it, but still, it's not constructive or helpful.. if you condemn the society for not changing, but then you also condemn them when they do change in a positive way, what incentive or motive does that provide for the people at the society to ever want to change for the better?.
also, what does that attitude look like to current witnesses who are having doubts?.
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opusdei1972
These three statements of Fusion Theism shows his blindness:
* A gradual removal of the 1914, 1919 teachings.
* A gradual improvement of their shunning practices, especially with their New Convention and Return to Jehovah Brochure.
* A gradual improvement of their blood policies, including the approval of hemoglobin and many other fractions.
But let me quote some recent Watchtower phrases so as to show how wrong Fusion Theism is:
About 1914:
3 About 20 years before 1900, God’s servants began to understand a prophecy that was written by Daniel over 2,500 years ago: “In the days of those kings the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be destroyed.” (Daniel 2:44) For more than 20 years, the Bible Students preached that 1914 would be a very important year. Many people at that time were very optimistic about the future. One writer says: “The world of 1914 was full of hope and promise.” However, later that year, World War I began, and Bible prophecy came true. The food shortages, earthquakes, diseases, and other Bible prophecies that were fulfilled proved that Jesus Christ began ruling in heaven as King of God’s Kingdom in 1914.* (See footnote.) By enthroning his Son as the Messianic King, Jehovah had become King in a new way. (ws14 1/15 pp. 8-13, paragraph 3)
About 1919:
6 What is the larger fulfillment of Malachi’s prophecy? For many years before 1914, C. T. Russell and the brothers working with him did a work like that of John the Baptizer. They studied the Bible to discover what it really teaches. For example, they taught the true meaning of Christ’s ransom sacrifice, showed that hellfire did not exist, and declared when the Gentile Times would end. There were many other religious groups who claimed to be Christ’s followers. But who among these groups were the wheat? To answer that question, Jesus began to inspect the spiritual temple in 1914. Jesus’ work to inspect and cleanse that temple lasted from 1914 to the early part of 1919.*—See endnote.
INSPECTING AND CLEANSING THE ANOINTED
7. What did Jesus find when he began his inspection in 1914?
7 When Jesus began his inspection, what did he find? A small group of zealous Bible Students who had been using their strength and their money to spread the good news for more than 30 years.* (See endnote.) Jesus and the angels must have been very happy to see that the few who were part of the wheat class had remained strong and had not been choked by the weeds. But the “sons of Levi,” that is, the anointed, needed to be cleansed. (Malachi 3:2, 3; 1 Peter 4:17) Why? (ws13 7/15 pp. 9-14)
About Shunning:
All in the congregation can show principled love by avoiding contact and conversation with the disfellowshipped person. (w15 4/15 pp. 29-31)
About the Blood ban:
14 Are you now in a better position to understand why Jehovah commands us not to eat “any sort of blood”? (Lev. 17:10) Do you grasp the reason why God considers blood to be sacred? He essentially views blood as equivalent to life. (Gen. 9:4) Do you agree that we should accept God’s view of blood and obey his command to abstain from it? The only way any of us can have peace with God is to have faith in Jesus’ ransom sacrifice and appreciate that blood has special meaning to our Creator.—Col. 1:19, 20.
15 Any one of us could suddenly find ourselves facing the blood issue. Or a family member or dear friend could unexpectedly be confronted with the issue of whether to accept a blood transfusion or not. During such a crisis, decisions also need to be made regarding blood fractions and medical procedures. Therefore, it is very important to do research and prepare for a possible emergency. Along with prayer, such measures will help us to take a firm stand and avoid compromising on the matter. Surely we do not want to sadden Jehovah’s heart by accepting something that his Word condemns! Many medical professionals and other advocates of blood transfusion appeal to people to donate blood in hopes of saving lives. However, Jehovah’s holy people acknowledge that the Creator has the right to say how blood is to be treated. To him, “any sort of blood” is sacred. We must be determined to obey his law on blood. By our holy conduct, we prove to him that we deeply appreciate the lifesaving power of Jesus’ blood—the only blood that makes possible the forgiveness of sin and everlasting life.—John 3:16. (w14 15/11 págs. 8-12)
So, these quotes show how Watchtower lies and its stupid and harmful policies are still in force.