I don't reject the idea of the existence of superior beings yet (whatever be their nature). However, the idea of a loving poweful god which is preached by the churches is false.
Read "The God's Problem" by Bart Ehrman, I strongly recomend it.
hello, i asked a new but old friend how many people are still christians after leaving the watchtower's mind control agency, for statistical purposes do you mind if i do a survey and see how many of you are believers?.
please don't post if your not a believer out of respect for this poll, we need to sharpen each other's sword and help build each other up and meet new friends over the internet with faith in god or some other force of the universe.
i asked another person how we can still manage our faith after getting burned by the high group mind control, he had a few ideas but he's not really involved with god because of how life burned him.
I don't reject the idea of the existence of superior beings yet (whatever be their nature). However, the idea of a loving poweful god which is preached by the churches is false.
Read "The God's Problem" by Bart Ehrman, I strongly recomend it.
a talk was given by gb member david splane in the february 2015 jw broadcasting video.
he talks about unity and sings the praises of jws.
he points his finger at the catholics and says this about them (39.32)-.
1sa 28:3-25 (nwt - not revised version).
7 finally saul said to his servants: seek for me a woman who is a mistress of spirit mediumship, and i will go to her and consult her.
then his servants said to him: look!
Magnum:
I started to see the big problem of interpreting the Bible when reading the Church Fathers. I began to read them, because I wanted to find the "pure" teachings of the Society in the early christian writers. However, I found the opposite, and I began to understand that the Septuagint differs from the Hebrew Bible, and it caused a great problem between christians and Jews. So I wondered why Jehovah let "His Word" to be changed. So, I concluded that each word of the Bible can't be the word of God, because we have two versions of the Old Testament. This was the beginning of my surprises.
1sa 28:3-25 (nwt - not revised version).
7 finally saul said to his servants: seek for me a woman who is a mistress of spirit mediumship, and i will go to her and consult her.
then his servants said to him: look!
1sa 28:3-25 (nwt - not revised version).
7 finally saul said to his servants: seek for me a woman who is a mistress of spirit mediumship, and i will go to her and consult her.
then his servants said to him: look!
Hi Magnum ,
I have to say that the early church fathers were divided on this point. Justin Martyr thought that he [the spirit] was Samuel, whereas Tertullian held the Watchtower's view. Nevertheless, Tertullian's view was weakly argued like the Watctower.
I am currently not a Bible believer, however, I like to do some "textual criticism". So, I currently admit that the Bible teaches contradictory views, because each writer had his own agenda.
Regards,
opus
1sa 28:3-25 (nwt - not revised version).
7 finally saul said to his servants: seek for me a woman who is a mistress of spirit mediumship, and i will go to her and consult her.
then his servants said to him: look!
I did my own research on this issue, and I concluded that this passage is simply against to the Watchtower's soul-sleep doctrine. The book of Ecclesiasticus says:
And after this he [Samuel] slept, and he made known to the king [Saul], and shewed him the end of his life, and he lifted up his voice from the earth in prophecy to blot out the wickedness of the nation. (Ecclesiasticus 46:23)
This was the interpretation that ancient jews (like Josephus) held about that reading. They did not think that a demon was speaking, but the spirit of Samuel himself. Also, this is the natural reading.
underpinning all the claims of the jw org is a belief in the sanctity of the bible as gods word.
this holy assumption is certainly never challenged by the watchtower and neither does the believer dare to use critical thinking to evaluate the source of his or her beliefs.
the watchtower org, for obvious reasons would not do this as they would need to sell up and hand back the money were they to admit that the bible is just a piece of literature and not divine in origin.
Phizzy: I am not against religious beliefs per se. However, I am against to authoritarian institutions which use religious dogmas to dominate people. Of course, christian institutions are not unique in it.
I was a Jehovah's witness, and then I was active in a christian forum of ex-witnesses, not long ago. Interestingly, when I noticed the Bible frauds, I shared the Bible contradictions in that forum, and some people of the forum showed their actual christian face by insulting me. One of them, studied theology in a christian seminar, and was very angry by my posts. He could not resist my arguments, and wrote that I am dangerous for those of faith, and he would not chat with me anymore. So, I understood that some ex-witnesses are still mentally witnesses because they are still following some shunning policies of the NT. I also noted that these seminars of theology are intended to teach and defend lies by using scholarly terms, but they are all academic baloney!!!.
I remember when AlanF was invited to that forum for a while, and I enjoyed the debates, though at that time I was still a christian believer.
I am not saying that all christians are fanatic, but if they want to follow strictly the Bible, they had to be.
i am 6th generation.
i have been out for a few years.. back story on the situation:.
i had a co come by while going door-to-door in the neighborhood.
i am 6th generation.
i have been out for a few years.. back story on the situation:.
i had a co come by while going door-to-door in the neighborhood.
The video "Faith in Action" tells many half-truths. One of them is the scene in which Rutherford presented the Finished Mystery for the first time at Bethel before many members, then some of them became angry on account of the book, and showed angry against Rutherford. This was a lie propagated by Rutherford and his friends, but if you read the transcription of the 1918 trial, Rutherford confessed that the book was not an issue initially in the dispute with the Society's directors. So, that scene is not historical. However, it was after some time that some Bible Students noted the rubbish written in the Finished Mystery, then some elders rejected its use. Accordingly, Rutherford imposed the acceptance of the book as a requisite to be an elder candidate. This was published in the Watchtower of that time:
...the Society has published and is wirlely distributing "The Finished Mystery"-Volume Seven of STUDIES IN THE SCRIPTURES. There is nothing in it out of harmony with the divine plan as revealed. The doctrines there taught are wholesome and clearly in harmony with that of the Lord Jesus Christ and the other six volumes of STUDIES IN THE SCRIPTURES. It is a part of the work of the SOCIETY to give this volume a wide distribution, because it is believed the due time has come for the message to be given against Babylon. A teacher that is opposed to the Seventh Volume, therefore, would be opposed to the SOCIETY'S work, out of harmony with the SOCIETY; and, as a leader, such an one would breed discontent and trouble, rather than establish harmony and peace and development among those of the Lord's people who had already expressed themselves as being in harmony with such Seventh Volume. Hence such an one should not stand for election to the position of elder.(The Watchtower, may 01, 1918, article: "Qualification of Elders", page 6220)