Posts by Adonai438

8

JW Works?

by jiutman in

jw
friends

i have a jw friend who is constantly telling me he is in the truth.

he always tells me that people will know gods true "organization" by their works.

he tells me about all the door to door stuff.

The JWs don't help with physical needs, silly! Note sarcasm
I am sorry to inform you that while JWs claim love and good deeds they are in actuality, very selfish. They may not realize it but a carful look at them will reveal it. Helping anyones physical needs would be helping a pagan world-- that would be wrong, they think. They must first convert them and then help their brother or sister in the 'truth'. Unfortunately it kind of works as leverage and taking advantage of the disadvantaged too. They preach love and support but only for those in the organization-- anyone who wants that must convert. You are right about Jesus commanding to help peoples physical needs, though, and if you read you will notice that he does not say to only help the other believers-- he says help everyone.

If they truly want to be judged for their works, then fine, lets bring it on
I'm not attempting to be cocky or selfrighteous here myself but JWs don't really mean it when they say to judge the true faith by it's works or fruit. They quickly change tunes when one points out the legions of false prophecies, changing doctrines, scandals, and hypocrisy, etc.... that exist in the Watchtower organization.
If you would like to know about specific works/fruits of the WT I am sure myself and everyone else can enlighten you

As to the specific example of going door to door:
that in and of itself means nothing. Mormons go door to door too but that doesn't make them the right faith. Christians used to go home to home as well but it has become associated with the cults now so we have taken other, less offensive ways to meet our neighbors and share God etc...

Any questions? feel free to email me <>< Angie

24

The Earliest Christians

by Adonai438 in

i am posting quotes from the writtings of the earliest christians to share whether or not the jw statement of.

the trinity not existing until the council of nicea is accurate or not.

so these quotes are relevant to the trinity.

Adonai438

Hi rev
Christians too believe that the OT is just as important as the NT. The OT is very interesting in these matters too. Note also that the Holy Spirit's role in the OT is different than his role in the NT so we do not ignore either OT or NT in the discussion of who he is. A spirit i.e. the Holy Spirit can be (and is ;) ) an actual being-- is this not what basiclly everyone believes the Father is? A spirit?
Satan and his demons are real entities as well. And Satan is certainly refered to in the OT and even spoken to directly. I can site places like Genesis, Isaiah, Zecharaiah, etc... on satan but have the distinct impression that you believe those are only personifications and not literal stories. I urge anyone reading the Bible to take all it's passages literally unless the passage says otherwise-- as it does in many places explain when it is figurtive or symbolic. We may be getting caught up in trying to express it with words like being, person, spirit etc... but the Holy Spirit is 'alive' and well and real.
You know, I think I'm going to go work on that email now instead of jabber on here Bye for now!

4

I John 5:7 question

by apostate man in

i am sure many of you know that 1 john 5:7 does not exist in the nwt as it does kjv.

i need an answer if anyone has it.

read on.... a more serious problem with the king james bible in regard to adding words can be found at 1 john 5:7 where it says, "for there are three that bear record in heaven, the father, the word, and the holy ghost: and these three are one".

Adonai438

Correct, the line does not appear in the originals. I am not sure as to it's origin but in general the KJV is good. Actually, the KJV is only good if you are accustomed to the grammar and speech -- if not then it could cause more problems . I personally use the NIV and the RSV is good also. I have an NIV Scofield and it is very good and reliable-- the historical notes and cross reference systems are great. As with anything, trust the Bible alone for doctrine. I know as an ex-JW we all have to take that extra seriously. Reading the helps is helpfull but is not replacement for study of the scriptures--our knowledge must be based on scripture alone and not someones explanation of what it means. If you have any questions just e-mail me anytime ! God Bless, <>< ANGIE

28

newbie here!

by greven in

jw
friends

hi everyboby!!.

i am a newbie in signing on for this board, however i have been surfing here quite often.

i really like this place so i decided to sign-up.

Adonai438

Welcome Greven---
I guess you've figured we like to joke a bit
Plum's right:
Ditto = Ibid
it's used so you don't have to write out the long source citation when it's the same place as previously quoted from.
Well-- gotta run-- looking forward to hearing more from you on the board!
God Bless <>< Angie

24

The Earliest Christians

by Adonai438 in

i am posting quotes from the writtings of the earliest christians to share whether or not the jw statement of.

the trinity not existing until the council of nicea is accurate or not.

so these quotes are relevant to the trinity.

Adonai438

Willy_Think is correct
Maybe a discussion of what the trinity belief says is a ggod thread to start-- The Watchtower misrepresents it in their attempts to disprove it. The trinity does not assert that the Father, Jesus and the Holy spirit are the same people, persons, etc... They are separate persons but one in being and essence. They are one God. Sounds difficult to comprehend but that alone does not rule it out-- just not understanding the HOW doesn't make it wrong. The belief come from taking what the bible says about Yahweh all together.

In the Polycarp and Justin Martyr quotes the point was not entirely the trinity but that they believed that Jesus is eternal (contrary to JWs) and that the Holy Spirit is a person/spirit -- more than an active force. These help further establish the ground work in the trinity.

What do you guys think? Do you not think that if the earliest Christians wrote and believed such things it makes it more likely to be true?

24

The Earliest Christians

by Adonai438 in

i am posting quotes from the writtings of the earliest christians to share whether or not the jw statement of.

the trinity not existing until the council of nicea is accurate or not.

so these quotes are relevant to the trinity.

Adonai438

HI Rev Bll--- I will be e-mailing you soon with what we discussed earlier but briefly:
The Bible does in fact equate the Holy Spirit with God himself.
The Bible clearly teaches that the Holy Spirit is more than a 'force' but a real spiritual being with a will, a voice, actions and words.
Now the next step is, is he God? It is good to demand proof of this and I will send whoever needs elaboration on it an e-mail with it if they are interested. In Acts 5 it calls the Holy Spirit God.
"You have lied to the Holy Spirit......You have not lied to men but to God".
Also, all over the new Testament it has the Holy Spirit speaking in scripture (OT scripture) that calls the speaker God, JEhovah, Almighty, etc... :

Acts 28:25-27
"They disagreed among themselves and began to leave when Paul had made this final statement: 'The Holy Spirit spoke the truth to your forefathers when he said through Isaiah the prophet:
"Go to this people and say,
You will be ever hearing but never understanding; You will be ever seeing but never perceiving. For this people's heart has become calloused; they hardly hear with their ears and they have closed their eyes. Otherwise they might see with their eyes, hear with their ears, understand with their hearts and turn, and I would heal them"" (quoting from Isaiah 6:9-10 vision of God on his throne speaking)

also see another example out of many in

Hebrews 3:7-19---"So as the Holy Spirit says:Today if you hear his voice, do not harden your hearts as you did in the rebellion, during the time of testing in the desert,
Where your forefathers tested and tried me and for forty years saw what I did. That is why I was angry with that generation, and I said, 'their hearts are always going astray, and they have not known my ways.' I declared on oath in my anger, 'They shall never enter my rest' .............And whom did God swear that they would never enter his rest if not those who disobeyed?....."

And plum:
Yes, I do believe that the Holy Spirit indwells all believers--including myself -- as shown in 1 Corinthians 6:19
(also look at 2 Corinthians 6:16 for reference -- Temple of the Holy Spirit<-->Temple of the Living God)

Gotta go for now--- !

24

The Earliest Christians

by Adonai438 in

i am posting quotes from the writtings of the earliest christians to share whether or not the jw statement of.

the trinity not existing until the council of nicea is accurate or not.

so these quotes are relevant to the trinity.

Adonai438

Hi Plum--
I don't know if you meant to say scriptures or quotes but just in case-- they aren't scripture or trying to be. All I'm saying is that the early Christian believed in it-- that's not a proof in and of itself but it does show that it's not a far removed concept as these people were direct students of the original apostles. If they believed in it then it makes it more likely to be truth--
Hi Utopian--
I also am not saying that merely mentioning them together makes the trinity. If you read the quotes they clearly call Jesus God, Eternal, etc.. as well as prove the Holy Spirit is believed to be the same and a very real person-- not a 'force'. These are not scripture but are historical documents very close to the time of the original events that teach the concept later named by Tertulian around 160-215 AD, the trinity.
The 'trinity' is just a name for a concept found in the Bible.

10

My Story

by DINKY in

jw
friends

after years of hard drug use, my boyfriend (now husband) and i finally quit when i got pregnant.

i went strictly to "marijuana maintenance.

" while staying home with my new baby, a witness started calling on me and eventually offered me a bible study.

Adonai438

Welcome to the board Dinky!
I personally never used drugs but have witnessed many in my family become addicted and stay addicted, Even the JWs. I have witnesses how the elders are really of no help to those with problems and my heart hurts for those seeking their help. I myself was a JW for only about a year and left after reading the Bible for myself and seeing that many of their beliefs were not grounded in scripture. I am now a Christian because of this. I have been through the getting clean act with many friends and I know its not easy. I also know that "cleaning ourselves up for God" is pointless- we'll never be good enough on our own before a holy God-- But whats the upside ?
That God, in his grace, doesn't require that of us. He asks us to put our trust in him and he'll help us with our problems! God has gotten me through some horrible times in my life and I'll be praying for you! If you ever need to talk -email me and again:
WELCOME!!!!!! <>< Angie

19

My Story

by SmokeEater in

i've been going back and forth between this board and other exjw boards, and decided it's time to put my story out.

i think it's theraputic in a way.... well a little background.

my father is black, and my mother native american (this is important down the road).

Adonai438

Nice to 'meet' you! I myself am 22 and been out of the WT for 6+years now...won't bore you with the long story but if you want to talk- email me sometime. I agree with double edge up there-- seek for yourself the truth now that you're 'allowed' to think for yourself. God is still there and very awesome. He's always been there for me. Just a little reminder to all-including myself when I was just out-- Just because God didn't seem to answer your prayers as a dub doesn't mean he wasn't there. We were praying to a false representation of God that the wathtower set up. Not that God 'can't' answer those prayers, but we weren't really asking and loving the true God and may not have recognized the answers given. Just a thought for us all-- Have a great day & God bless!
<>< Angie

28

a little stuff about me, and a request

by flower in

i hope this doesnt come out sounding self righteous or anything like that.

forgive me if it sounds like an attempt to...i dont know..gain sympathy or something like that...its not.. i have been here a lot over the past couple of months since i found out the truth about the truth.

i've used this place as sort of a support system.

Adonai438

Just be encouraged every day that you are cared about and loved.
Not by just us but by God. Not preaching here but want you to try and remember that the JW's 'god' is not the true God-- he's real, he's awesome, and he's always there. I found the truth about the truth 6 years ago and the hurt/indoctrination does eventually heal. It leaves scars but will be better. There is such a great life out there for you now that your free to think for yourself, just be encouraged in that! E-mail me to talk sometime!
<>< Angie [email protected]