OrphanCrow

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Posts by OrphanCrow

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  52

  Court seizes over one million Jehovah's Witnesses brochures brought into Russia

  by StarTrekAngel in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  http://red.theworldnewsmedia.org/index.php/en/forum-home-page/jehovah-s-witnesses/93-court-seizes-over-one-million-jehovah-s-witnesses-brochures-brought-into-russia

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  OrphanCrow

  Mephis: I really don't think Rasputin had much to do with the authoritarian nature of most Russian governments in the C20th. If you want the parallel, it's in the power of the Orthodox Church once more being harnessed by the state there. It's canny little to do with 'cults' and an awful lot to do with authoritarian regimes finding ways to stigmatise 'the other' within society.

  Politics in early 20thC in Russia were most certainly influenced by Rasputin.

  And yes, the power of the Orthodox Church is being once more harnessed - like it was in the years that Rasputin became a major influence on the Russian Court and was a major player in the politics that led to the Revolution of 1917 and the eventual demise of the last monarchy of Russia.- an event that some historians say was the most important political event of the 20th C.
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  52

  Court seizes over one million Jehovah's Witnesses brochures brought into Russia

  by StarTrekAngel in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  http://red.theworldnewsmedia.org/index.php/en/forum-home-page/jehovah-s-witnesses/93-court-seizes-over-one-million-jehovah-s-witnesses-brochures-brought-into-russia

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  OrphanCrow

  In 1600 Giordano Bruno was brought made grand cosmological claims. Government experts were consulted at his trial and he was eventually burned at the stake. The west has been through this before.

  Yeah...over 400 years ago.

  I think that knowledge has evolved a fair bit since then.

  I will take my chances with the Russian experts.

  If by the "west" you mean a "western" expert like Applewhite, then I can see you may have a point.
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  52

  Court seizes over one million Jehovah's Witnesses brochures brought into Russia

  by StarTrekAngel in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  http://red.theworldnewsmedia.org/index.php/en/forum-home-page/jehovah-s-witnesses/93-court-seizes-over-one-million-jehovah-s-witnesses-brochures-brought-into-russia

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  OrphanCrow

  Saint: Scientology is much worse.
  If governments start banning organizations that have an unpopular view, you end up with only the majority opinion that will be tolerated.

  To borrow a phrase from Justice McClelland, "this is not a competition" to see who is the best of the worst.

  It is not as simple as "banning an organization" in Russia. What has occured in Russia is that the Watchtower Society/JWs is not recognized as a religion. They have not been granted religious status. What is banned is their literature and certain activities. Their belief is not banned but they are restricted in what they are allowed to claim for tax purposes and what kind of propaganda they are allowed to bring into the country.

  This is not surprising. Other countries are investigating the WTS for charitable status. Russia has said 'no". They are ahead of the game on that one.

  Australia is going through a process of examining the harmful policies, that are promoted in the WT literature, and are questioning the WTS on how they may change their policies and literature to reflect a society that respects freedom of speech for its members.

  Russia has already said "no" to the literature that promotes and fosters such a horrific problem that is being exposed right now in Australia.

  If governments start taking a more responsible role in how religions operate in their countries, I think that problems like hiding child sex criminals won't be tolerated.
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  52

  Court seizes over one million Jehovah's Witnesses brochures brought into Russia

  by StarTrekAngel in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  http://red.theworldnewsmedia.org/index.php/en/forum-home-page/jehovah-s-witnesses/93-court-seizes-over-one-million-jehovah-s-witnesses-brochures-brought-into-russia

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  OrphanCrow

  Saint: You REALLY don't want the state to decide which literature is appropriate for you or not.

  The state based their decision on the results of the detailed and comprehensive report submitted by these experts:

  [V].[P].[Belyanin], the doctor of philological sciences, the professor of the department of psycholinguistics HAZE, the professor of the center of international formation MGU [im]. [M].[V].[Lomonosova], the corresponding member of the academy of humanitarian studies, the academician of Moscow psychotherapeutic academy, the member of the international association of applied psycholinguistics, the member of the board of juridical psychologists;
  [M].[M].[Gromyko], the doctor of historical sciences, professor, the main scientific worker of the institute of ethnology and anthropology RAN [Russian Academy of Science]
  [D].[A].[Leontev], the doctor of psychological sciences, the docent of the department of psychology of MGU [im]. [M].[V].[Lomonosova], the substitute the chairman of the council of the Moscow department of Russian psychological society;
  [S].[A].[Nebolsin], the candidate of philological sciences, that manages by the sector of artistic interactions of the division of theory and methodology of history of literature and [iskusstvoznaniya], the chairman of scientific council for complex problem “Russia, the West and the east” of the institute of world literature RAN [Russian Academy of Science], the member of the administration of the union of the writers of Russia.

  Courts call upon expert testimony to make decisions. I am fine with that. I have read the report. I agree with it.

  And....you REALLY shoudn't tell me what I REALLY should or should not think. I do know what freedom of thought is.
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  41

  Did Geoffrey Jackson Commit Perjury, or Just "Spiritual Warfare"?

  by The Searcher in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  mr. jackson was pressured by angus stewart to answer if the org condoned corporal punishment, to which he openly stated that the org does not condone corporal punishment for j.w.

  children.

  this "fact" has never been revealed in the org's literature, in fact, this article which was published under geoffrey jackson's supervision, by definition demonstrates the org's approval of corporal punishment for j.w.

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  OrphanCrow

  SS... "However, not all children need physical punishment......"

  So, by inference, some/most do need physical punishment?
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  52

  Court seizes over one million Jehovah's Witnesses brochures brought into Russia

  by StarTrekAngel in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  http://red.theworldnewsmedia.org/index.php/en/forum-home-page/jehovah-s-witnesses/93-court-seizes-over-one-million-jehovah-s-witnesses-brochures-brought-into-russia

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  OrphanCrow

  Saint: ...if you love freedom of speech you should reconsider your position.

  No, I don't think so.

  My position is that I oppose institutions that take away the freedom of speech and the freedom of thought in the way that the Watchtower Society does.

  I oppose institutions that masquerade as a religion when they are only a business.

  I oppose deceit. The JW religion is the epitome of deceit.
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  52

  Court seizes over one million Jehovah's Witnesses brochures brought into Russia

  by StarTrekAngel in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  http://red.theworldnewsmedia.org/index.php/en/forum-home-page/jehovah-s-witnesses/93-court-seizes-over-one-million-jehovah-s-witnesses-brochures-brought-into-russia

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  OrphanCrow

  Brokeback: The Watchtower literature is rightly banned in Russia because of it's extremism and severe criticism of other religions. So I'm glad they took it,and hope they put it to good use in a incinerator. No Watchtower propaganda for distribution big deal let them cry religious persecution all they want their literature is rightly banned for the garbage it contains.

  I agree.

  In October 2000, several Russian experts presented their reports to a Russian court. The Russian experts had done a comprehensive examination of the Jehovah's Witness literature.

  We, the undersigned, VP Belyanin, MM Gromyko, DA Leontiev, SA Nebolsin designated definition Golovinsky Intermunicipal Court on March 12, 1999 for a comprehensive examination of the case 2-452/99 (presentation Attorney of the Northern Administrative District of Moscow on the elimination and prohibition of a religious community of Jehovah's Witnesses), being aware of the court of criminal liability under Article 307 of the Criminal Code, were of this opinion, set out below on 16 sheets.

  The submitted report can be found on this thread here:

  Jehovahs Witness Ban Upheld

  The reasons the literature is seen as unsuitable are for far more than just "because of it's extremism and severe criticism of other religions". The Russian experts did a detailed and extensive analysis of the text and concluded that it contained harmful material that had the potential to pyschologically damage those who read it.

  The Russian expert conclusion:

  In the literature and the documents of the witnesses Of [iegovy] are contained the signs: A) kindling the religious dissension in the form of the undermining of respect and formation of hostility for other religions, b) encroachment of such rights and freedoms of citizens as right to the life and the medical service and right to leisure, and also to the freedom to manage its time.

  They also gave a detailed response to this question:

  Are the texts of the organization of the witnesses Of [iegovy] the account, which usually is used in the religion.

  And concluded:

  the subjected to the study texts of the organization of the witnesses Of [iegovy] in a number of essential signs differ from the account, which usually is used in the [nesektanskom] religion (in the traditional religions).

  The Russians have taken the examination of the JW literature seriously and have not banned it lightly. The Russian experts who analyzed the text came with these credentials:

  [V].[P].[Belyanin], the doctor of philological sciences, the professor of the department of psycholinguistics HAZE, the professor of the center of international formation MGU [im]. [M].[V].[Lomonosova], the corresponding member of the academy of humanitarian studies, the academician of Moscow psychotherapeutic academy, the member of the international association of applied psycholinguistics, the member of the board of juridical psychologists;
  [M].[M].[Gromyko], the doctor of historical sciences, professor, the main scientific worker of the institute of ethnology and anthropology RAN [Russian Academy of Science]
  [D].[A].[Leontev], the doctor of psychological sciences, the docent of the department of psychology of MGU [im]. [M].[V].[Lomonosova], the substitute the chairman of the council of the Moscow department of Russian psychological society;
  [S].[A].[Nebolsin], the candidate of philological sciences, that manages by the sector of artistic interactions of the division of theory and methodology of history of literature and [iskusstvoznaniya], the chairman of scientific council for complex problem “Russia, the West and the east” of the institute of world literature RAN [Russian Academy of Science], the member of the administration of the union of the writers of Russia.

  I think that Dr. Monica Applewhite would have been laughed out of a Russia court. They would have told her to go back to Kindergarten and get an education.

  
  
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  107

  Brother who works on JW Broadcasting gave a 20 minute talk, said something big is coming next month.

  by wifibandit in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  via /r/exjw.

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lc7vhu8l88k.

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  OrphanCrow

  jw_potato: OrphanCrow, the way he was saying everything makes it seem like it specifically has to do with the website/broadcasting.

  Huh.

  Okay then. I will go with choice number 2.

  Armageddon is coming soon.
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  52

  Court seizes over one million Jehovah's Witnesses brochures brought into Russia

  by StarTrekAngel in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  http://red.theworldnewsmedia.org/index.php/en/forum-home-page/jehovah-s-witnesses/93-court-seizes-over-one-million-jehovah-s-witnesses-brochures-brought-into-russia

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  OrphanCrow

  Mephis: Thing is this is Russia. Where minority groups are targeted for unpleasant behaviour. Where the state turns a blind eye to actions by those who support it. Where censorship and restrictive controls are becoming the norm once more. Where speaking out against the ruling oligarchy is increasingly uncommon and increasingly dangerous. It's not some glorious crusade to show the JWs are wrong about neutrality, it's another case of the Russian state being heavyhanded, authoritarian and deeply unpleasant at its heart. The JW persecution complex really doesn't need feeding by it actually happening eg by the police turning a blind eye to mob attacks etc.

  Yes. This is Russia.

  And Russians have very long memories. This is evident in Putin's honoring of past political heroes such as Pyotr Stolypin and the raising to sainthood of the last Tsar and his family. What runs deep, very deep, in the Russian memory is the role of religious sects on the ruling power of Russia - Rasputin's ghost will always hover in that dark and bloody history and will never disappear.

  Russia has a long history with cults and their influence on political events is an integral part of their past. In fact, there was an Apocalyptic cult that committed mass suicide just outside the edge of Moscow on the eve of the Tsar's abdication.

  I know that this is "old" history to some, but in a Russian's mind, it isn't.

  Fringe extremist religions will never get far in Russia when someone like Putin is in power. He is deeply rooted in the past.

  
  

  
  
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  107

  Brother who works on JW Broadcasting gave a 20 minute talk, said something big is coming next month.

  by wifibandit in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  via /r/exjw.

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lc7vhu8l88k.

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  OrphanCrow

  jw_potato: Just a note: this talk was in Canada.

  Ah...the Canadian Branch changing somehow, maybe closing. Or some big restructuring on the top end of the Canadian Branch.