Fisherman

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Posts by Fisherman

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  61

  Did the flood happen?

  by BlackWolf in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  so we were talking about noah for our family worship tonight and it ended with a little debate between me and my parents about how the flood was possible.

  you know, where did the water come from, how did all the animals fit, etc.

  of course it led nowhere and my parents came up with some strange theories like that there was "an expanse of water in the sky" and that's where all the water came from.

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  Fisherman

  Did the flood happen?

  Scientific evidence is subject to interpretation. Jesus confirmed that it did by referring to it same as he confirmed the creation of Adam and Eve by referring to them.
  
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  37

  JW Stand On Concealed Carry

  by Cold Steel in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  if a jw wanted to get a concealed carry permit, would the society have any moral or ethical problems with it?

  in other words, if one of your elders noticed you were carrying concealed, would they be apt to just ignore it or would they counsel you on it?

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  Fisherman

  Off the top of my head, prior to 1982, the WT was silent for the most part on JW owning firearms. Seems that some brother carrying a concealed licensed firearm triggered the WT to write a policy on JW owning guns in a wt or awake article-probably wt- banning ownership of guns for self defense by JW. JW should not own guns for self defense, but can they be df'd or da'd? I don't know
  
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  25

  Appealing a disfellowshipping - any experience

  by dozy in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  anyone had any experience of a successful appeal against a disfellowship?

  a friend of mine feels he has been dfd unjustifiably & is considering an appeal.

  he probably has something of a case - the jc was a total shambles - but i'm very dubious that he has any likelihood of success.. my only experience of a successful appeal is when elders in a neighbouring congregation were appointed by the co & overturned a df in our congregation a few years ago.

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  Fisherman

  My impression generally has been that an appeal is usually pretty hopeless

  That ain't true. JC decisions have been reversed- but they ain't legal proceedings.
  
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  218

  Debating With Evolution Deniers is Just Like This

  by cofty in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  arguing with those who reject scientific evidence can be like arguing about football; just as angry and passionate, but the goalposts keep moving, and one team doesn't exist.. read more here....

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  Fisherman

  faith... or exposure to facts

  Facts vs derivative, which is what faith in evolution is all about.
  
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  87

  Think for Yourself: Reform Judaism Uses JW Blood Issue For Shavuot

  by David_Jay in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  as the jewish holy day of shavuot (pentecost) begins this weekend, the reform judaism site publishes an interesting article entitled "judaism teaches: question authority, think for yourself.".

  the article employs a jewish doctor's recollection of a jw patient who refused blood and died as an example of how both religious traditions greatly differ on how they see and apply god's law.. shavuot is the day jews recall god's giving the law to israel.

  the article is significant in that it demonstrates how jews see the giving of the law as a call to questioning authority, including divine revelation itself whereas the death of the jw patient is contrasted as a slavish interpretation that misses the point behind jewish scripture.. for more see the article at:.

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  Fisherman

  It seems to me that the above quoted paragraph is leading the reader to conclude that blood should not be eaten (BT) because it represents Christ's shed blood. That is qualified by "Guided by the Living God"

  By the way, as a side point, the basis for such conclusion is: Leviticus 17:10-12. The WT did not make up the teaching.
  
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  218

  Debating With Evolution Deniers is Just Like This

  by cofty in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  arguing with those who reject scientific evidence can be like arguing about football; just as angry and passionate, but the goalposts keep moving, and one team doesn't exist.. read more here....

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  Fisherman

  You need a lot of faith to believe in the theory of evolution.
  
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  23

  JW charged regarding child pornography

  by Listener in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  http://www.sanluisobispo.com/news/local/crime/article39058014.html#1.

  church shouldn't have divulged child-porn suspect's alleged confession, attorney says.

  elders in the jehovah’s witnesses church violated the confidentiality of steven lindhorst of paso robles when they told police about an alleged confession he made regarding child pornography, according to a defense motion.. .

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  Fisherman

  No color is needed to remind anyone how despicable child abuse is. We know that.

  The following applies to the US
  

  But state law does not trump the Constitution or Federal Law-Take cannabis for example.

  Note the interesting article linked below on reporting child abuse: should an attorney report child abuse and breach confidentiality?
  

  http://scholarship.law.duke.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=3201&context=dlj

  State Child abuse reporting Laws Bulletin below.

  https://www.childwelfare.gov/pubPDFs/clergymandated.pdf

  At this point though, it is not known with certainty whether or not the elders in the case posted on this thread actually reported any confidential talk of the confession to a governmental prosecuting agency. It would be monumental if they did, but very unlikely.
  
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  23

  JW charged regarding child pornography

  by Listener in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  http://www.sanluisobispo.com/news/local/crime/article39058014.html#1.

  church shouldn't have divulged child-porn suspect's alleged confession, attorney says.

  elders in the jehovah’s witnesses church violated the confidentiality of steven lindhorst of paso robles when they told police about an alleged confession he made regarding child pornography, according to a defense motion.. .

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  Fisherman

  Elders in the Jehovah’s Witnesses church violated the confidentiality of....

  Very interesting and informative post, Listener! Thanks. The related article does not state all of the facts about what exactly those Elders said and did but only the accusation against such "Elders." Nevertheless, if it turns out to be true that the Elders revealed church confidential information (a confession) to the police, it would seem to me that it would destroy JW confession to the Elders for good and the seeking of spiritual help. Why would anyone want to come forward anymore? Even if these Elders acted on their own without the WTS, why should anyone risk taking a chance and confess? So, I am very skeptical to believe that the Elders in fact violated "church-penitent" confidentiality, but we will see if that actually happened. Please keep us posted if you hear anything more. And thanks again for this great post!
  
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  8

  How the Need for An Elder to "Preside Over His Household in a Fine Manner" Forces Kids Out

  by TMS in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  twelve years ago, i submitted this comment to the jwd board, relating to the practice of disfellowshipping young people from the congregation:.

  "i am angry at the way jehovah's witnesses treat their most precious endowment; their young, developing, stumbling, exasperating, questioning, experimenting, growing offspring.. at the very most urgent time in their young lives; when they need the most reassurance, nurturing, patience, understanding and forgiveness, witness parents, under the direction of their congregation elders and governing body, toss thousands of these young ones out into the cold, cruel world, allowing them to virtually self-destruct.. many of these castaways are still in their teens.. there is no excuse, biblical, human, parental or otherwise to shut off all the guidance resources these young ones have ever known.

  the human wreckage of this disgusting practice is astronomical.

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  Fisherman

  I think that if an elder is having family problems, he needs to give more attention to his family. Personally, I do not see how I could kick my child out if he was having problems or got df, I would devote my time to try to help my child and cater to his needs. The way the congregation is set up though, it is a disgraceful thing to be deleted and that is one reason why some men choose to kick out their kids- in order to keep their position. But I suppose that if an adult child is just determined to sin and just refuses to submit to parental love and guidance there comes a point where it is just too painful to have the adult child live in the house, but the decision to kick out the adult child (age 25+) should not depend on pressure of being fired from a position in the congregation. The fact is though that a man is pressured to throw out his son or be fired from his position in the church if the son is determined to sin. But if the son tries to repent that is a different story, but it may still may be better for the elder to quit and to spend more time with his family.Too bad though because the way the congregation is set up, when a man is deleted, it usually does not turn out good for him either because it is a disgraceful thing even though the man is doing a noble thing by stepping aside to assist his family.
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  18

  Elders intervening in family issues

  by gatorguy in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  does anyone know of any good scriptures or reference articles that i can show an elder to hopefully have him stop intervening in a family issue?

  i already told him that i am the head of the house and that they're usurping my headship but they didn't seem to get the message.

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  Fisherman

  usurping my headship but they didn't seem to get the message