Fisherman

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Posts by Fisherman

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  208

  How to debunk the 1914 calculus ONLY using JW publications?

  by psyco in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i remember having read somewhere, but i cannot find it anymore, that it is possible to debunk the 1914 calculus using only jw publications, like "insight on the scriptures" (chronologies) for example.. do you have any sources about that to suggest to me?.

  thanks..

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  Fisherman

  WT scholars have traditionally provided simple and compelling evidence based on the recognition of the 70 years of Jewish Exile and the fact that Judah was desolate for 70 years proved beyond doubt that the only possible date for the Fall of Jerusalem was 607 BCE.

  I agree without a doubt. 1. 539 is a historical fact and the end of the 70 years exile, minus 2 years or so for traveling back and other factors. Nothing could be simpler.
  (What convinces me it is 607 and not 608 or 609 is WWI, Nation against Nation. ) JW view 1914 as a historical fact that Jesus became king. Given the 70 years desolation of Judah, 607 is indisputable. I think that archeology will vindicate the date if gt doesn’t come sooner.

  The Bible never mentions 70 years of exile.

  It does.
  
  
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  11

  Threats in field service?

  by enoughisenough in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  in reading about the 54 year old man being shot, i was wondering if any of you were ever shot at, or threatened with a gun.. i was in a car group where a woman came out waving around, telling us to get off her land.

  in another situation a man told the car group to turn and leave or he was calling the cops.

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  Fisherman

  Usually, in the past, people ran away from someone holding up JW literature or hid when JW rang the bell. Except youths, they could be dangerous. Back in the day, Jewish neighborhoods were the most dangerous for FS even for a Jew who was JW. I remember reading in JW literature about mobs of Jewish fanatics attacking and maiming JW—even JW females. JW could get hit with a stray bullet in poor neighborhoods but I never felt unsafe in a poor neighborhood while holding up the mags in fs. Just let them see the mags and people clear the sidewalk. Things have changed now because people have changed about how they view religion. Dogs, guns, fanatics, youths is fs danger nowdays and mags don’t stop them.
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  43

  Basic Blood Questions For Witnesses

  by Vanderhoven7 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  basic blood questions for jehovah's witnesses.

  where does the bible outlaw blood transfusions?

  (acts 15:29 gen.9:4) .

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  Fisherman

  First impression: I love your style.
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  75

  Is the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses REALLY the "faithful and discreet slave" of Matt. 24:45-47?

  by Roger Kirkpatrick in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  thesis: when someone who is given a responsibility mistakes that responsibility for authority, bullying is very likely to occur.. jesus spoke an illustration recorded at matthew 24: 45-51 which well illustrates this thesis.. jesus asked, “who really is the faithful and discreet slave whom his master appointed over all his domestics, to give them their food at the proper time?

  happy is that slave if his master on arriving finds him doing so.

  truly i say to you, he will appoint him over all his belongings.

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  Fisherman

  Does a slave typically demand obedience from those it serves, as the Governing Body demands from Jehovah’s Witnesses?

  That is the flaw in your logic. Obviously, if they are bullying the church or their conduct is otherwise unchristian it would challenge any delegated authority they have over church. Compare what Jesus said about himself: “The son of man came to minister.” and the voice from heaven: “Listen to him.” validating that authority.

  Somebody is directing the Church, God through JC vicariously by means of the FDS —given that the appointment of the gb really is the FDS. So GB claim of authority doesn’t disqualify them —given they really are the FDS.
  
  
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  43

  Basic Blood Questions For Witnesses

  by Vanderhoven7 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  basic blood questions for jehovah's witnesses.

  where does the bible outlaw blood transfusions?

  (acts 15:29 gen.9:4) .

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  Fisherman

  The JW's could very honestly and truthfully point out that biblical prohibitions against blood are all references to whole blood.

  Off the top off my head, take for example isolated anethole or eugenol juxtaposition major blood components that characterize blood. Could it honestly be said that eugenol is not cloves and one could use it without tasting cloves or experiencing its effects? A legal or chemical argument could be made that it isn’t —same as with blood.
  

  But then what do I know?

  Your reasoning is persuasive. Your information is valued. Your argument also implies that since JW have been wrong about fractions then why shouldn’t they be wrong about the teaching altogether since they claim to be guided by God in which case they logically wouldn’t be wrong about the fractions. And if God is not part of the equation, it is wholly a medical decision. —But we still have the Decree and what it means for Christians. And what God meant in the Decree. Christians in good conscience can’t just pretend they are not bound by it and put anise or anethole or ethanol into their bodies and believe they are only required not to eat it or that they are allowed to by God because it is lifesaving. The Decree says to abstain from blood not JW leadership.
  
  
  
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  16

  Underage child: PIMI vs PIMO parents rights

  by psyco in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  i am a pimo, inactive, parent of an underage child.

  i was wondering what rights i have in regards to avoid that my child will be baptized when still underage, not having read the entire bible and before being able to clearly evaluate all the alternatives and consequences (like it happened to me) whereas the other pimi parent has all the rights to do it.

  any experiences about children in a pimi vs pimo parents situation?

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  Fisherman

  You can tell your kid that you want him to wait until he gets older. And you can tell the elders that you don’t want him to get baptized until he is of legal age because that is your decision.
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  43

  Basic Blood Questions For Witnesses

  by Vanderhoven7 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  basic blood questions for jehovah's witnesses.

  where does the bible outlaw blood transfusions?

  (acts 15:29 gen.9:4) .

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  Fisherman

  Thank you, TD for your kind and valuable information on this topic.

  A person faced with the choice of death or a BT without God in the equation might logically choose a BT because the benefits outweigh the risks. There is really no other choice. You will die without it —trusting the doctor’s medical opinion. Whereas A JW would factor in God seems to me, based on personal experience and trusting that what “God’s Organization” teaches about BT comes from God. Logically, he would figure that even with God not a variable, he would always be in fear and waiting that something would blow up inside his body should he survive with the BT and could never have peace of mind, and would always wonder if he would have survived anyway without the BT. It seems that JW figures that, true violating the Decree ( assuming the teaching is correct) offends God for symbolic reasons but there must also be other health or medical reasons why God gave the command to abstain from blood in the Decree.

  All this assumes the premise that the BT teaching is from God and not just human interpretation of scripture subject to error.
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  43

  Basic Blood Questions For Witnesses

  by Vanderhoven7 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  basic blood questions for jehovah's witnesses.

  where does the bible outlaw blood transfusions?

  (acts 15:29 gen.9:4) .

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  Fisherman

  TD,

  It hard for some JW to realize that transfused blood does not act like food but behaves like a person’s own blood behaves. That is the point. You have helped to clarify this. I enjoy dialogues that bring out the truth like the one’s I have with you. I think it would be helpful if you explained what happens to transfused blood in the body. You mentioned that it is broken up in time and excreted from the body. But if the body absorbs any of it or is metabolized or becomes part of the cellular structure of the body instead of simply being removed —even though a person’s own blood does this anyway- it also nourishes the body and is not only performing an organic function.
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  43

  Basic Blood Questions For Witnesses

  by Vanderhoven7 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  basic blood questions for jehovah's witnesses.

  where does the bible outlaw blood transfusions?

  (acts 15:29 gen.9:4) .

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  Fisherman

  Cofty, I understand your point that the blood of a slaughtered creature is not being used in a BT. It is a good point juxtaposition that blood is intrinsically sacred because the soul is in the blood to begin with.
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  43

  Basic Blood Questions For Witnesses

  by Vanderhoven7 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  basic blood questions for jehovah's witnesses.

  where does the bible outlaw blood transfusions?

  (acts 15:29 gen.9:4) .

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  Fisherman

  the blood is no more sacred than the teeth

  You keep asserting that.

  Without discrediting your point that there is a distinction between the blood of an animal that died on it’s own and the blood of a living animal that was slaughtered for food, I have already refuted your application to BT. Also, whole blood taken from a living organism is not congruent with the blood inside a carcass that cannot be removed because we see tolerances for Christians when eating animals not slaughtered correctly compare to abstaining from blood.