Posts by Fisherman

46

Does the WTS have a clergy class (yes-no)

by blondie in

jw
friends

wt 2021 october p.20 "in contrast, true worshippers of jehovah have no clergy.

although we respect those who are taking the lead, we accept jesus’ clear teaching: “all of you are brothers.”".

ijbq article 92 point 6: in contrast, true worshippers of jehovah have no clergy.

Fisherman

anybody tries to claim clergy/penitent privilege in a court of law, they are admitting and expecting to be treated like clergy.

There is a difference between minister and clergy members—JW point out. JW have openly declared in court that they are not clergy. The onus is on the Courts to interpret the law in such a way as to determine if and when laws that apply to the clergy also apply to JW elders using a legal standard. It is unconstitutional to exclude JW religion from legal protections that other religions get because they have a clergy and JW do not. So the argument is that the term clergy is broadly used legally to include religions that have ministers that are not clergy members and it sometimes includes JW elder. However, since JW in fact do not have a clergy and that is their position, not all laws and benefits that apply to the clergy also apply to JW elders, so if an when the term clergy legally applies to the JW is a subject of LEGAL dispute when laws are not clear.

46

Does the WTS have a clergy class (yes-no)

by blondie in

jw
friends

wt 2021 october p.20 "in contrast, true worshippers of jehovah have no clergy.

although we respect those who are taking the lead, we accept jesus’ clear teaching: “all of you are brothers.”".

ijbq article 92 point 6: in contrast, true worshippers of jehovah have no clergy.

Fisherman

At NO time did I ever see myself as an employee of theirs when I was in the Jehovah’s Witness religion. I saw myself as a guest/sometime volunteer.

My point was the distinction between a manager and employee compared to elder sheep and not that JW are employees like managers and employees in some employment setting.

Also, I think that the point Blondie is showing is that there actually is a class distinction between elder and sheep which I didn’t dispute. But elders are not like the clergy of christendom and that’s the difference.

Pioneers don’t get paid and those volunteers don’t do it for money but for God they believe

46

Does the WTS have a clergy class (yes-no)

by blondie in

jw
friends

wt 2021 october p.20 "in contrast, true worshippers of jehovah have no clergy.

although we respect those who are taking the lead, we accept jesus’ clear teaching: “all of you are brothers.”".

ijbq article 92 point 6: in contrast, true worshippers of jehovah have no clergy.

Fisherman

The JW don’t have a clergy class like christendom but in reality there is a class distinction between the elder class and everybody else. Elders lead and manage and shepherd the congregation members compared to everyone else. Like in an employment setting there is management and employees although everybody works for the company and are employees except JW don't get paid. And that is a fact.

20

Curtailing zoom

by road to nowhere in

co visit, so right from the horse's mouth ( or somewhere).

too many are staying on zoom, missing face to face encouragement.

look for the elders to implement changes.. also people at the door are so receptive and glad to see us.

Fisherman

Blondie

The people had to ask the elders, and then the elders had to check into whether those people had a "valid" reason

Well, nowadays if they don’t qualify for zoom it means they won’t be going to meetings at all. Like I said, some people want to attend the meetings but they can’t or don’t want to go in person and that is that. If they could or wanted to they would— so they won’t be going at all if they shut down zoom. and they can’t get it on youtube. I don’t feel the shepherding wants this to happen. Sure ideally they want everybody to go in person but if that is not possible they must allow zoom access or those people ain’t going.

20

Curtailing zoom

by road to nowhere in

co visit, so right from the horse's mouth ( or somewhere).

too many are staying on zoom, missing face to face encouragement.

look for the elders to implement changes.. also people at the door are so receptive and glad to see us.

Fisherman

they are doing away with Zoom

I really doubt it but who knows. It would stop those zoomers from the meetings all together because that won’t force them to go in person. At least with zoom people that can’t or don’t want to go in person can get the information via zoom. But if you shut down zoom and force people to have to go in person to the kh, sadly you will lose a lot of people

207

Scholar and Fisherman

by Jorden in

scholar and fisherman, i started this thread because i didn't want to highjack the one in regard to 588/568.. i just wanted to ask if you were both current active jw's that believe the jw's beliefs?.

do y'all believe the gb are the f&ds?

if the answers are no, then why do y'all defend so passionately the date 607?

Fisherman

It was the period from 66-70, from the Roman response to the Jewish revolt until Jerusalem’s destruction. According to the gospels, Jesus said the ‘appointed times of the nations’ aka the ‘great tribulation’ would happen within a generation of his death, and then Jesus would return shortly after. Of course, Jesus didn’t return and Christians have been making excuses ever since, leading to nutters reinterpreting passages from Revelation to conveniently apply to ‘our time’.

Non-sequitur: first you say Jesus prophecy was fulfilled then you say Jesus failed to return. Your fallacious style.

A heavenly Messianic kingdom cannot be trampled upon. Jesus was alluding to heavenly Jerusalem. The word trampled is a literary device. It is your fallacious style to first interpret Bible prophecy and then to attempt to invalidate the Bible and your interpretation of fulfilled prophecy with it. Ergo your interpretation cancels out and becomes invalid. If the Bible is not valid, prophecy is meaningless and your interpretation is also nonsense. Whereas, we have shown consistency.

362

Just read that Carl Olof Jonsson died yesterday

by slimboyfat in

for newbies, who was carl olof jonsson?

he was a jw in sweden who was challenged by a householder in the 1960s, who pointed out to him that secular history books don’t agree with watchtower that jerusalem was destroyed in 607 bce, but instead place the event 20 years later.

the reason the date is important is because it is the starting date for jw chronology which leads to 1914 as the end of the gentile times, and the beginning of the last days, as jws understand it.

Fisherman

Fallacy: Straw man attack. I have provided a great deal of information specifically indicating why the JW position is incorrect. The claim that I simply ‘don’t like JW’ is therefore an obvious lie.

Abdolutely not. The only information that you have provided is solstice. Just about everything else are fallacious remarks as scholar keeps pointing out to you and commentary. It has been shown by scholar that wt interpretation of chronology is valid. And that’s that.

5

When did Jesus die Nisan 14/15/20 or other?

by eyeslice in

often as witnesses, we were told of people who started studying the bible (in reality wt literature) and were amazed at what they learned.

you know the sort of thing i mean i have been going to church for years and never knew that.. .

however, in my recent studies, particularly of the book of john, i have felt the same way.

Fisherman

Last Supper was on Thursday eve Nisan 13 (= Friday morning Nisan 14) Then Jesus was arrested later that night. He went back and forth and was executed on the same day of Friday Nisan 14 ( sounds like 1914 when you say it) before sundown. So three days latter he was resurrected.

207

Scholar and Fisherman

by Jorden in

scholar and fisherman, i started this thread because i didn't want to highjack the one in regard to 588/568.. i just wanted to ask if you were both current active jw's that believe the jw's beliefs?.

do y'all believe the gb are the f&ds?

if the answers are no, then why do y'all defend so passionately the date 607?

Fisherman

lol Discussing/arguing JW "Chronology" is about as useful as discussing how many buttons Santa Claus has on his jacket.

Shoe is on the other foot. Scholar has done an amazing job showing JW interpretation of Bible chronology is valid.

207

Scholar and Fisherman

by Jorden in

scholar and fisherman, i started this thread because i didn't want to highjack the one in regard to 588/568.. i just wanted to ask if you were both current active jw's that believe the jw's beliefs?.

do y'all believe the gb are the f&ds?

if the answers are no, then why do y'all defend so passionately the date 607?

Fisherman

wanna

Non JW are always telling me what I should do to be a JW.