I've known of similar stories. "What a protection baptism is for our dear young ones.".
dubstepped
JoinedPosts by dubstepped
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38
Re: New Songs for Memorial
by pixel into all congregations.
re: new songs for memorial.
dear brothers:.
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dubstepped
You have the Memorial, which is supposed to be this uber important dignified occasion, and you release new songs at the last minute to be sung by ordinary singers? Seems very opposed to the importance they place on the occasion. -
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Would you have married your spouse if you weren't both JWs?
by 3rdgen inok, i've had some wine, but i'm curious.
objectively speaking, but for the religion, did you have enough in common with your spouse to have met and married as non believers?
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dubstepped
I would have married my wife regardless, assuming we would have crossed paths, which we wouldn't have. Just celebrated 16 years a week and a half ago. We had some really rough times, but honestly most of that was just getting married before we were whole people ourselves. I was 22 and on my own, she was 19 and had lived a very sheltered life. There were some days where we thought it wouldn't work out for sure, but we have learned and grown up tremendously together. I like that we have that history, as the tough times dish out the best lessons. Today our relationship is truly great. Oh, and did I mention that we work together every day and have pretty much since we got married. We clean together daily, though there was a period in our business where we went separate ways for maybe 6 months while regrouping after a bad business deal. Working together made us have to confront every little issue and caused a lot of drama because we could never get away from the other one if they were having a bad day, but we made it through and we can handle the worst day now with grace. -
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dubstepped
Disclaimer: I am no political guru, I just got out of the Borg late last year but I do listen things and read articles and try to be at least somewhat informed. I have no dog in this race but find Bernie's stance interesting and know and have spoken with some of his vocal supporters. What follows is my experience and opinions based on such.
I grew up poor-ish. We had a cheap house in a fairly bad neighborhood and drove old beaters. My dad worked for a factory and I don't think he ever made more than $10/hour, and mom didn't work. When dad's factory went on strike, things would get really tough. However, there was always a program to get us through and we never did without. We could have been in a better position but my mom chose not to work, and my dad turned down overtime often because of JW responsibilities.
Fast forward to a few years ago. Dad didn't take care of himself. He was told for years to get his blood sugar under control, actually for decades, and didn't. He was wasting away and we got him to go to a doctor and found out that his blood sugar was off the charts. He was put on medication and a new diet. He wasn't very compliant. Within that next decade his kidneys failed and he went on dialysis and couldn't work anymore. My parents still never went without. They got all kinds of benefits, benefits that he paid in for over all of those years, but again there were programs there for them.
Let's talk food stamps for a minute. My mom was appalled by the program. She said that she had more money on food stamps to spend at the grocery than she had ever had. In fact, for the first time she could afford to buy the brand named items and had to in order to even come close to spending her share. She felt bad spending so much because it didn't feel right to her.
So when people say "what will the poor people do as things are currently constructed" I say that some choose that lifestyle. Poor people sometimes refuse to do the things it would take to get out of their situation. Mom could have worked and didn't want to. Dad could have taken overtime and didn't. It isn't like wealthy people are sitting around all day not working. The highest earners I know are usually the ones working the most. They live their businesses. My parents never chose to get new skills or reach out for anything. They were stuck of their own choosing, and even then with bad decisions over the years they always got a big tax return for being low income with kids and there were programs galore to bail them out.
Of course, those programs came with the ulcers that my mom probably has from dealing with governmental red tape for everything. She was sent a summons to court to appear for fraud because the government kept putting money on her account after she no longer qualified for food stamps. She had stopped spending them and told the government that they were on some other program and no longer needed or qualified for them. She was honest and because she didn't spend them the government eventually got their act together and dropped the charges. But dealing with the government was a part-time job for my mom, constantly fighting them tooth and nail for every program they qualified for.
So it surprises me to see so many people advocating for more governmental control. They are inefficient idiots. Why do we want them controlling health care or anything else? They are deeply in debt and yet we want them to have more of our money?
Most of the people that I personally know that love Bernie are rather entitled. They have parents that have worked hard to give them nice lives and they think that everyone should get college paid for and more. But how many people waste their college years on something totally non-productive? Getting a degree in something with no marketable potential, and now we're all supposed to front the bill for that? Drinking and partying is now government sanctioned? What about everyone with student loans now? Are they forgiven? And how many people go to college and get a degree in something just because mom and dad want them to? College isn't for everyone.
I worked my ass off to get out of the situation that I grew up in. I had scholarship offers to engineering school and turned them down to pioneer (ugh). But rather than expecting someone to hand me something I worked hard and my wife and I make roughly $30-35k each cleaning houses after expenses. We work long hours at times, much more than the 40 hours that for some reason we've set up as a standard by which everyone theoretically should be able to support a family based on current rhetoric. We don't run to the doctor for every hangnail, or rarely ever (haven't been in years other than check-ups). We take reasonable care of ourselves, don't smoke or drink or anything and are reasonable weights for our heights. We've been lucky to keep our insurance from pre-ACA so far and our rates are low, but if we are forced into Obamacare our rates will triple and our deductible will rise for service that actually pays a lower percentage of covered events than what we currently have. That is messed up.
So where would Bernie benefit me/us? It looks like I'd pay more so that other people can go to college and run to the doctor every time they get a sniffle on my dime. I'm not averse to helping people, but as a person that's scratched and clawed for everything he's got and that hopes to maybe this year be able to finally put something back for retirement, you're telling me that the government could tax me and take away that money too.
The ACA actually forced my mom to go find a job. She had to work to pay for the insurance that she now had to have because previously there were actually programs that helped my parents that went away with the new system.
I guess I just don't see how more programs funded by my dollars are a good thing. Abuse of the system is so rampant, and the government is too inept to take care of the abuse. You can't just throw money at problems and expect them to go away. You can't out-earn your stupidity. The government will find a way to screw up the programs and probably end up further in debt. Our country goes into other lands and hands out money and programs that cripple communities because they lose any desire or will to improve themselves. I'm afraid that if Bernie is elected we'll just do more of that here too. People like I saw growing up will have less incentive to get out of their situations. They will become more dependent on others instead of more independent.
With that said, I like the ideas that Bernie puts forth on some levels. I just don't think that humans can be counted on to use them wisely. More control just reminds me of my j-dub days with people making my decisions for me and I don't like that much. Maybe in the end it is the lesser of the evils presented for candidacy, but those are my concerns about Bernie. I'd love to know how he's really going to fix things, not just throw money at things, because most issues in life are behavioral and I'm not sure how those things get changed. I've talked to some Bernie supporters and so far the answers haven't been anything more than "feeling the Bern" and I'd love to have more substance as far as how things really benefit and change under him.
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Why ExJW's should care about the FBI vs. Apple encryption case
by juandefiero inmany people that don't keep up with technology news are, at best, vaguely aware that apple is fighting a court order to create a tool for the government to unlock one of the san bernadino terrorist's iphone.. what the fbi is asking for could jeopardize the security of all iphones.
besides the obvious possible slippery slope leading to governmental abuse of this technology they're asking apple to create, there is a more personal reason for many exjw's to be concerned about.. anytime you create a weakness in information security, there is always the possibility of that weakness being exploited.
sometimes, those weaknesses are difficult to exploit, sometimes they are easy.
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dubstepped
Can't one just erase cookies, history, etc. or go incognito on the Chrome browser to cover their tracks? A password protected phone isn't a necessity is it? I'm not an Apple user. Can you not do similar things on the iPhone? -
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if you had the slightest of doubt about leaving leaving the watchtower org. go to to jwsurvey.org NOW!
by nowwhat? inand we are suposed to trust these guys with our lives?
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dubstepped
It just goes with their modus operandi of keeping up appearances. That is all they care about. They are the most vain people, looking good on the outside and lacking any depth whatsoever. -
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Making friends in the "truth"
by Jordandemm inwhat is it about making friends in the organisation am i the only one who had found it tough?
don't get me wrong there was some good people but unfortunately there was also a lot of egotism, back stabbing, jealousy and gossiping.
i could never really fit in any group, everytime i thought i had found a group it was as if i would be sidelined or ditched.
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dubstepped
It always seemed to me that in order to have friends you had to grow up with that set of people. My set all got DF'ed or left and I was the only one left. I moved to other congregations with my wife later and we never could make friends. We always got left out of just about anything social, as those people all had their groups of friends and kept to themselves.
After a decade and a half without any real friends we DA'd and now we have friends in the evil world that actually invite us places and care about us. Last weekend was our 16th anniversary. A client of ours in our cleaning business (and we're friends as well) just happened to invite us to go to an away basketball game for our local team. The had two extra tickets and asked if we wanted to go. Sure! Oh, and they would drive, so we could ride with them. Okay! Oh, and they already had an AirBnb with a separate cottage out back and we could just have that room to ourselves, for free of course. WOW! The only thing we had to pay for was our food, and once we got there the husband paid for all of our meals!!! I couldn't even get an invitation to dinner with other people as a JW and here we get a free three day weekend trip for my wife and I. Tell me again how Witnesses are such great friends.
JW's are just friends of convenience. You're in the same place so you might as well make the best of the time you spend together. You have a similar life in the religion. That's it. They do nothing to foster a sense of community or togetherness. Instead it is backbiting like you mentioned in the OP. Just a bunch of judgmental people trying to one up each other.
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Almost three months since Crisis of Conscience Cease and Desist
by ILoveTTATT2 ini am very interested in getting crisis of conscience being fully available as soon as possible.
march 12th will mark exactly three months since the cease-and-desist letter was written.. i understand that things are slow and that deborah may be sick, but i was just wondering if anyone knew the status.
i have been asked twice already where the book can be obtained in spanish and i have told people that the book is not available.. there are ways to make ebooks extremely hard to share.
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dubstepped
People have wanted the book to be available for a long time, so I don't think there's a great lack of patience. I for one am grateful that it was made available on audio as it was instrumental in helping me cut through the crap of the JWs. Has there been any transparency on this process of getting the book out? Often a lack of patience is more just a lack of information. What's the deal? Can people do something to expedite the process? You mention a lack of funds. Is that the holdup? Are they separated from family because they're investing all of their time in the book or for reasons like all of us have? I don't know the story behind the story but this book is monumentally important. -
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A faded JW about to see the Circuit overseer
by pleaseresearch inso my mum who is in and really is finding it hard that i have left and faded.
shes asked me if i want to the the circuit overseer next week.. i have never met him and this is more my mum wanting me to get my problems i have with the organisation out.
but should i share everything i've learnt or what?.
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dubstepped
Looks like your week just got busy, you came down with the flu, and depression is keeping you down. You have nothing to gain and everything to lose here. Make an excuse and do not meet with them. If you somehow find yourself in their presence, do not tip your hand or you'll be labeled an apostate and disfellowshipped. Run from this "opportunity". -
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This thread is for proof that God exists
by juandefiero inhowever, i haven't found any evidence to support that belief.. have you?
if so please, show me the evidence that god exists, and i will believe along with you.. criteria:.
(1) you must specify which god you are talking about;.
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dubstepped
So let's say that someone here wants to start a thread about Lazarus or Jesus or Superman (who from what I understand died and was resurrected). They believe in it and want to discuss it with others that believe it too. Why can they not get a pass? Why would someone need to go to that thread and tell them they're stupid? Do we all have to believe the same, or is it just that some people get off on putting the beliefs of others down?
I don't think you can hide behind this being a religious discussion forum when there are threads about lots of topics having nothing to do with religion. Some people want to discuss religion, some evolution, some circumcision, some a mixture of all three, whatever. And let's also not call all of the threads here "discussions" when it is more or less people that already have their mind up going at one another and not listening to the other.
But if they make statements of fact, like claiming somebody was raised from the dead, and if they claim their belief is based on evidence, then that evidence should be challenged. Statements of fact don't get a free-pass because they are labelled as "religious".
Why are you the fact police? Why do you think anyone cares what you have to say in the first place? They don't owe you anything. Why do they have to admit to you that their beliefs are just that, "beliefs"? Does that somehow make you feel better? Do you get off on belittling others and making trying to make them feel bad about their ignorance? I don't get it. Are you simply on a quest to cure ignorance and create a society that sees everything like you do and admits that the evidence supports you view? If they don't, which seems to happen often on here, what's the point? Who did you help? Where's the payoff?
And again, "you" in this instance doesn't just mean cofty. I believe in a God at this point in my life. You won't change that. This thread won't change that. You see things only in terms of man's discoveries of the physical realm around us and I think that there is more to life than that, something bigger going on that man can't measure with instruments. So what's the point of trying to convince me otherwise? You will fail. You're wasting your time and mine. That's why I chimed in early on and then exited this thread. I don't need to prove anything to you because my beliefs are mine and don't need your approval.
I've seen you personally post several times that you could prove the nonexistence of the Christian God. I asked you to do so and you never did. I also asked you the question about love and whether you or anyone else could prove its existence, which nobody can do conclusively, yet we as humans believe in the power of it. No progress was made on either front.
So, once again, this discussion is pointless and the only value truly produced is to those that are looking for something internally out of these discussions. Nobody is changing their mind. It is a futile discussion for most. Maybe someone out there takes something away from it. And, since I'm not, it was probably a mistake to jump back in this. I really don't care enough to argue with people for nothing.