Posts by tmo

20

Fish & Chips He Said Crisply..

by Englishman in

jw
friends

americans call 'em chips.

we call them crisps.. .

now..these are fish and chips.

tmo

Thanks little witch for clearing that up! I have to go - time to fill up the petrol then get a spot of tea.

16

A letter to my sister

by jwbot in

i got some help from someone on the board in composing a letter to my parents, but i am presenting a letter i wrote just now to my sister johnna.

she has probably been the most rabid in shunning me.

she is also one that i felt very close to.

I think you wrote a very touching letter. Hopefully it will not fall on deaf ears although you cannot underestimate the mental bondage your family is under. I do not think it would help to add info regarding how it may be a bad "witness" for your family for her to continue shunning you. I would add something like, "You know me and you know that I am not a wicked person. I agree that you may need protection from wicked people - but in your heart you know that does not apply to me." Also, it might help to ask a little more about how she is doing - how her life is going. Let her know that you are someone she can share her life with without any reservation.

Anyway - hope this helps and good luck.

17

Just got back from the YMCA

by Atilla in

jw
friends

i went to the y last night just to relax and go swimming.

the y near my house is pretty clean and after 8 p.m., not very crowded.

i find it very relaxing to go work out, play basketball, go swimming and then sit in the sauna after a long shower.

tmo

I grew up as a "Y" member. I spent many enjoyable hours as a youth playing basketball, etc. When I became a witness (I was 21), I had to give up my membership. What a great day to join again after 20 years. I forgot what a great feeling going to the gym was. I also now have time to work out, etc. This is what JW's take from you - your life! I am so happy to be free from that bondage and have time to have a life. Belonging to the YMCA was a matter of universal sovreignty - as is everything.

21

Can I withdraw a Disassociation?

by Woman know your place in

jw
friends

i'm new to the site, and wonder can anyone advise me..... two years ago i decided to leave the jws, and when i met with the elders to inform them, they told me they had grounds to disfellowship me (i told them i doidnt believe in god and had slept with my boyfriend.....for full story see my profile).

at the time i thought that telling them would just mean that i could get on with my life and they would know that i was not a jw... i thought that you could only df a person who wilfully sinned against god.... well i didnt believe in god, so how could i wilfully sin against him?

anyway, as i said, the elders wanted to df me, and, not wanting to be seen as a sinner, i wrote a letter of disassociation detailing my reasons for not believing ahead of the dfing.. so did the elders have grounds to df me?

tmo

Your situation is not an easy one and I agree with the majority that it would not be beneficial for you or your family (in the long run) to try and get reinstated.

Re: your question as to having your baptism declared invalid.

When I was an elder, I personally dealt with a woman who, at the time was in her 40’s and had not been a JW for 30 years. She never really believed the WTS doctrine . She was baptized (the act that makes the elders have jurisdiction over you) when she was 14 years old because her friends were getting baptized at a summer convention of JW’s. She was disfellowshipped as a teenager for an act of premarital sex. She was later married and had a family and tried to live as a Christian. None of that mattered. She was prevented from having a normal relationship with her mother. The reason for her inquiry to the elders was that she wanted to have her baptism declared annulled because according to her it was not genuine. With this organizational declaration, she would no longer be viewed as disfellowshipped and she would be free to have a relationship with her mother. After writing the WTS in Brooklyn, NY, I received instruction on what to advise the woman. It was decided (on what basis I still do not know) that her baptism was considered valid and she was still to be viewed as disfellowshipped. The religious authority ruled and had spoken – from Brooklyn, New York and having never met this woman. After informing this woman of the decision not to grant her request, she broke down and cried. I will never forget the effect this had on this woman. This was her mother. She essentially lost her mother. This was not a wicked woman. She was even willing to meet with an ecclesiastical authority that she did not even recognize in hopes of having her mother associate with her. There never was any question in her mind that unless the elders or WTS approved her request, her mother would not have association with her. What a tragedy that I can only hope God will forgive me for participating in this and not speaking up for what was right and just. I do not think that a persons' baptism can be declared invalid by the organization, so this probably is not an option for you.

I think that if you continue to show them love and support that is the right thing to do and hopefully in time you will be able to have a relationship with your siblings. Someday thay too may begin to doubt the religion and you will be in a position to help them.

24

Hey! Did you ever wonder how to use a piece of plastic to cover the mags?

by joenobody in

jw
friends

here's a truly weird flash animation demo of "how to use magazine covers".

this is waaaay too bizarre... if anyone is good with shockwave or flash they should do a parody (although the self-parodying nature of this is too much!)..

http://www.mckennabookcovers.com/first_page.html

tmo

The covers actually prevent the barf from hitting the mags when the song is sung.

31

Just got Crisis of Conscience

by bull01lay in

just got my mail order copy of crisis of conscience... got to chapter 2 in the first 20 mins!!!.

who else has read it, and what are your thoughts ???.

i've enjoyed it so far, and am glad to see how respectful ray franz was in his writing, with no 'outright attacks' on the wtbts.. bull!

tmo

MJ

I would suggest you read the book and try to understand the arguments with a view to presenting them to your wife. Ask her questions designed to show the shortcomings of the WTS doctrine. Perhaps this way you could prepare her mind to accept what is said. It will take time. Good Luck!

31

Just got Crisis of Conscience

by bull01lay in

just got my mail order copy of crisis of conscience... got to chapter 2 in the first 20 mins!!!.

who else has read it, and what are your thoughts ???.

i've enjoyed it so far, and am glad to see how respectful ray franz was in his writing, with no 'outright attacks' on the wtbts.. bull!

tmo

I have read both Crisis of Conscience and In Search of Christian Freedom and they are excellent. I could not put them down. I began reading so called "religious" books after 20 years in the WTS. I did not start with these so called apostate books or apostate websites. I read many books by noted religious writers and learned many ideas that contradicted WTS beliefs and interpretations. Books on why God has permitted wickedness, is the bible inspired, etc. I think this prepared my mind when I finally broke down and got these two books. I was in the right mental state to honestly evaluate what was said. These two books are amazingly truthful in content and if a JW reads them with the right frame of mind they can accomplish alot of good. It takes time for some to come to grips with the arguments presented, but I think they are required reading for all JW's or family members of JW's.

22

satan fears

by cuddlepie in

this is a paragraph out of an email my mother sent me.

this doesnt help.

why cant they see that its this talk that attributed me to needing therapy in the first place!

tmo

I think for our relatives who care about us it is very difficult when someone leaves the WTS. Your mothers response is typical in that blame has to be put somewhere. So it is Satan's fault or you have let a few "bad eggs" cause you discouragement. It can never be the fact that this is a bad organization with bad, unscriptural teachings. A JW must characterize it this way - it allows them to not address the real problem. The problem is the organization. Not Satan and not just some bad people in the organization. I think it is helpful to keep reminding them of the real problem, the real issues that need identified. The WTS is a messed up organization - that is to blame.

25

Do you still get embarrassed by it?

by Mr Ben in

the other night in the pub a guy pipes up, "hey, how you doing mate?

then proceeds to inform everyone that i used to try and convert him to jwism about 8 years ago.

i say, "how you doing dave?"...

tmo

Good thoughts for Jedi Master. It is something to proud of - to be willing to stand up for the real truth.

25

Do you still get embarrassed by it?

by Mr Ben in

the other night in the pub a guy pipes up, "hey, how you doing mate?

then proceeds to inform everyone that i used to try and convert him to jwism about 8 years ago.

i say, "how you doing dave?"...

tmo

Yes - I do get embarassed by it. I too am embarassed by the fact that I was so easily led astray. I have spent many introspective hours trying to figure that one out. It does make for some interesting conversation with my friends who find out about my religious background. It is amazing how many people can relate to certain elements of this. I work with a woman raised as a Catholic. Many similarities. When a person is a witness, there is a certain detachment from people - they are worldly. Now, I am able to have a real relationship with people if I choose to do so. My "unusual" background only makes for some common ground or insights as to my personality. I still get embarassed by it and have had a similar experience to the one you describe. All you can do is be honest - most people will respect that.