I agree with the above posts, as I sense a big change and the WT does too. I can’t put it into words only what I observe in my limited view of JWs from the distance.
1) The JWs are quickly and quietly becoming a social club, especially for the younger crowd, hell even for the older crowd. Many of these were born into it or found themselves brought in through family in there later teen yrs. They like to hang out with other people who they consider good people, but it is much more for the built-in friends that come with showing up at the hall. Most of these have little or no ambition to be anything much more than seat warmers.
Some of these can not escape for now due to family or the fear of a total loss of a social system. But don’t be mistaken, this is a totally different JW than the JW of the 70s and even the 80s. In those days you always reached out, never said no to an assignment, didn’t think about going to school, and actually sort of wanted to pioneer, etc. etc.
2) Another late development is the ex-elder. There is a growing group of JW x-elders, men who once were who are now more than content to be seat-warmers too. (Although from what I have heard there are growing reports of COs deleting long time elders for seemingly frivolous reasons). These men have heard it all. They’ve been through the complete cycle and heard every fear and guilt-laden diatribe the WT has spouted. They have heard the Last Days speech over and over and over again. They have not forgotten that the generation of 1914 was not supposed to die before the big A. They still go to the meetings, comment occasionally…but they definitely know bullshit when they hear it now. They know pretty much what lines to say to the CO when he comes around to keep him off their backs about reaching out again, but they have no intention of saddling themselves with that bs again. Oh, and just coming out with another book doesn’t cut it anymore…they have heard it all about the latest and greatest new pub…they are booked out.
I am old enough to remember the late 60s WT as a child. I am old enough to remember the old WT, and young enough to see what it has evolved into. I believe, looking back, the generation change of 1995 and the advent of the Internet will go down as milestones that irreversibly changed the WT. Yes irreversibly, because there is no way the WT will ever have the unquestioning allegiance it had before.
Nic, you are also correct in saying that the WT is creating not just complainers, but bonafide enemies. Why is that? It is because they took our souls. We were really ready to give it all. They may talk about us now and how evil we are, but WT you gave us this measuring stick. The only thing we are doing is measuring with the stick we were given.
Every action we took, every other religion we met, every job we took, who we dated and how we dated, who we married, whether we went to college or not, what clothes we wore and whether it “looked right”, whether we went to the prom or not, whether we got to go on school trips or participate in sports, music, or art. We suppressed every thing we were to support what we were told was the greater good. We suppressed our natural instincts to be good neighbors, to give to charitable causes, to be normal in order to place some magazines. Yes, in some cases we could have made worse choices (as many of us are not in jail or dealing with others problems), but that is not the point. We were ROBBED. And that just sticks in our craw.
The internet is providing the forum to let us know that we weren’t going crazy, that we were not the only ones who sensed something was wrong. The new social JW will not make the same mistakes we did, those days are bye-bye.
WT, yes you have plenty of money and assets to be around for awhile. But what you cherish most is what is vanishing. And ultimately, its not really about the money, its about your credibility.
Axel
Axelspeed
JoinedPosts by Axelspeed
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79
There's something happening here.
by nicolaou inhey watchtower!
can you feel it?
that cold, hard knot in your stomach?
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Axelspeed
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7
Surprise! Surprise! Another CELECBRITY JW!! (almost)
by stillAwitness interrance howard (crash and hustle and flow) wife is a jw including their 3 kids.
not him though, he was quoted as saying in december's issue of essence magazine that the religion is "too strict" for him.
ya think?
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Axelspeed
This was posted earlier.
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42
Getting Busted w/ Love Letters
by OpenFireGlass in.
love letters were the demise for many of the kids in congregations that i attended growing up..... i know i ended up in the library/back room several times for this (hopless romantic/ sagitarius) even put on public reproof for it.
(though i believe it was my dad's idea to have the elders put me on public reproof so that he could have more control over me).
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Axelspeed
Yep! It sucked big time.
And yes, JW girls got the same line just adjusted a little...."how old are you...(waits for response)...well you should know XXXX cannot have girlfriends because he's not ready for marraige."
Yeah, it was rough. But it helps knowing that I wasn't the only one who went through this craziness.
Axel
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42
Getting Busted w/ Love Letters
by OpenFireGlass in.
love letters were the demise for many of the kids in congregations that i attended growing up..... i know i ended up in the library/back room several times for this (hopless romantic/ sagitarius) even put on public reproof for it.
(though i believe it was my dad's idea to have the elders put me on public reproof so that he could have more control over me).
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Axelspeed
LOL...thanks Lisa.
I never got busted with love letters, though a few led me to my most embarassing jw kid moments. In one case I was in a little back and forth with a girl in jr. high. Anyway, this back and forth gave me a little confidence so that I eventually for some reason became temporarily insane (forgot I had jw parents) and gave her my number when she asked for it. I told her the exact time to call (so that I could beat my mom to the phone, as she was the one with the flaming sword protecting the garden). Looking back, I don't know how I expected to carry on a conversation from that point. I guess I considered having a phone an accomplishment.
Anyway now the embarrassing part. Moms answers the phone, and the next words I here are "we're Jehovah's Witnesses and XXXX does not receive phone calls from girls who are not, and you should know that he is in no position to support a girlfriend or a wife".
The words are still ringing in my ears to this day.
Axel
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9
Que, Sara, Sara
by finnrot ini seem to remember when i was a kid that the innocent song que, sara, sara song sung by doris day was considered evil.
i was a kid in the 1960's and i remembered that i thought that song was cool.
but i seem to remember that it was hated by the witnesses.
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Axelspeed
LDH...I would love to someday hear your stories you have to tell...you are hilarious!
Axel
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BETHEL NEWS: Bethel Elder Arrangement to be dissolved as of Aug. 31, 2006
by Elsewhere inhere is some news from a source within one of the wts branches:
hot news from todays morning worship announcement worldwide -- letter from gb being read on 1st of march 2006 to every branch (hopefully we will have a copy of the letter soon.).
as of aug. 31, 2006 the bethel elder arrangement will be dissolved!
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Axelspeed
Well, people only have power over others to the extent that the others allow it...
Unfortunately, JWs are trained and indoctrinated to give
powerer deference to those with position and titles. Some JWs, esp those outside of NY or newer pubs, have never even heard of Bethel Elders. But among those who do know who and what they are, they are given extra props. They are perceived as having just a little bit more holy spirit and just a bit more blessing...esp since they are elders at J's house...Bethel.Some pubs back at the home congregation fawn more over a returning/visiting bethelite than their own local elder. So imagine...a Bethel elder. True, they arent on the Branch Committee, but its all relative.
Axel
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16
A 'Screw the Publishers' GB Strategy?
by metatron inwhile a man might hold a particular office, there is no guarantee that his personal faith will continue.
there are a number of older.
brothers , at bethel and elsewhere, who quietly hold to a 'it's a good life' view of the 'truth' - as opposed to the blind zombie-faith of.
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Axelspeed
I wouldnt doubt it at all. And while you're at it, you can include the WT lawyers and accountants in that lot also. With all of the downsizing, there seems to be a serious retreat and hold what we have mentality. There is enough money for them all to live off of very comfortably for the rest of their lives, even if everything else goes to hell and a handbasket.
I forgot which poster said it, but there is no better time than now to follow the money.
Axel
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256
New Video of DF announcement at door
by inbyathread instarting a new thread so that everyone can find the link.. this is the video of the elders trying to act smart stupid.
http://www.savefile.com/files2.php?fid=5509435.
they will keep the file as long as it is downloaded once every 14 days.. enjoy
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Axelspeed
I wonder why they still used the term "disfellowship" when the new om book uses the phrase "no longer one of jehovah's witnesses". Is there a difference between the terminology used for the public announcement and the terminology used when they inform the person personally ...or are old habits just hard to break?
I actually kind of feel for the guy. If he ever wakes up and finds himself here he will be kicking himself....
Axel
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256
New Video of DF announcement at door
by inbyathread instarting a new thread so that everyone can find the link.. this is the video of the elders trying to act smart stupid.
http://www.savefile.com/files2.php?fid=5509435.
they will keep the file as long as it is downloaded once every 14 days.. enjoy
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Axelspeed
Anyone want to take bets on how long it takes for them to get deleted?
REALLY? Does anyone think this may happen? For what reason?I really don't know if they'll go so far as being deleted...but if the wrong person gets up on the wrong side of the bed I wouldn't rule it out.
More probable though is a serious and humiliating talking to about procedure from the CO. They will be the private joke of some of their peers when word gets around as "the brothers who blah blah...ha ha ha". In future CO meetings with elders across the country there will now be the experience of "in one experience a couple of elders [they will remain nameless] who blah blah blah.....and so brothers, this is what we do not want to do".
This is something the wt has been concerned about and aware of for a while. The last few km schools I went to were 80% about judicial committee procedure..very little scripture and a whole lot of procedure...probably because so many were bungling the whole process and also because they were worried about liability.
Another proof of this is how elders have been labeled as "untrained volunteers" by the WT spokesman, which shows how Bethel really views the local elders - as unsophisticated ya-hoos. They know that the local elders are a weak link, and therefore their recent attempts to distance themselves.
Axel
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256
New Video of DF announcement at door
by inbyathread instarting a new thread so that everyone can find the link.. this is the video of the elders trying to act smart stupid.
http://www.savefile.com/files2.php?fid=5509435.
they will keep the file as long as it is downloaded once every 14 days.. enjoy
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Axelspeed
Amazing. I can't believe they went through with the whole thing knowing the tape was rolling.
Axel