Posts by dorayakii

Yes, that is correct, Russell originally arrived at the date of 1914 through measurements of the Great Pyramid of Giza, (as well as a few other dates which proved to be false... 1874, 1878, 1915, 1917, 1918, 1920, 1925)...

However when 1914 "proved" to be a year of great consequence (WWI), Russell began to try to search for scriptures to prove this date biblically, afterall, something as big as WWI, must be . He assumed that this date was the beginning of Armageddon. (Because he thought Jesus had already come in 1878).

When in 1916, Russell died, in true Adventist fashion, Rutherford assumed that Jesus had come invisibly at that time and that 1914 was the restoration of Jehovah's Kingdom and the date of Jesus' 'parousia'.

Russell and Rutherford made several assumtions based on the dream of the big tree in Daniel 4:

That 7 times meant 7 years in the 1st fulfillment.
That there was a 2nd fulfillment that must reach into "our day".
That the big tree represented both pagan King Nebuchadnezzar's rule AND Jehovah's righteous Kingdom.
That the 7 times meant a 'week of years' (or 7 groups of 360 days) in that 2nd fulfillment
That the 2520 days which resulted from that calculation (7x360), is subject to the day-for-a-year rule (which incidentally is found only twice in the Bible and in two different and contradictory applications at that). http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/12/100182/1725905/post.ashx#1725905
That using the "rule" 2520 days, equal 2520 years.

Counting BACKWARDS 2520 years from 1914 AD, the Watchtower arrived at the date of 606 BC for the 'banding' of Jehovah's Kingdom, and therefore the date when the Jews were taken into exile in Babylon.

Several years later, it was revealed that there was no year zero, so the date of 607 BC was then chosen for the Jewish exile.

The problem is that using the lengths of the reigns of the kings, which are determined from thousands of specimens of archeological evidence, the date of the destruction of Jerusalem was in 586 BC.

So you can see that:

the original reason 1914 was chosen was by measuring the Pyriamid of Giza, a "pagan" monument.
once 1914 was established, the Watchtower attained the date of 606 by measuring backwards FROM 1914 and not the other way around which should have been the case.
the Watchtower later changed the date from 606 to 607 when it didn't fit anymore.
neither dates 606 or 607 have any support in archeological evidence, 586 BC being the historical date for the destruction of Jerusalem.

41

I was reading a post today about the kingdom songs we sang as JW's.

by booker-t in

i was thinking about the kingdom songs we sang as jw's and was wondering about you posters out there that are ex-jw's or still jw's what was you all time favorite "kingdom song" or what was you all time horrible song that we sang from both songbooks (1966 songbook or the later songbook made in 1984 sing praises to jehovah.

my favorite song was song #119 in the 1966 songbook "keep your eyes on the prize".

i like this song because it made me feel that armaggeddon was coming fast and the "new system" would be here to give me the prize.

dorayakii

I also liked "The Victory Song"... the one that goes: "Siiing to Je-ho-vah, for heee has become highly ex-aaaal-ted,

the hooooorse and its riiii-der, he has piiiitched into the seeeeaa"...

and the "But the Bible" one: "DARK DAYS ARE HERE, MAN LIVES IN FEAR,

WITH DIRE EXPECT-AAATION, AS TO ALL CRE-AAATION....

but the bible gives us a hope for the end.... la la la la laa-la, la la la la-laaa"

I really liked the tunes... i never ever paid attention to the words, i just repeated them. I thought about the words of one song once, and i was quite surprised.

41

I was reading a post today about the kingdom songs we sang as JW's.

by booker-t in

i was thinking about the kingdom songs we sang as jw's and was wondering about you posters out there that are ex-jw's or still jw's what was you all time favorite "kingdom song" or what was you all time horrible song that we sang from both songbooks (1966 songbook or the later songbook made in 1984 sing praises to jehovah.

my favorite song was song #119 in the 1966 songbook "keep your eyes on the prize".

i like this song because it made me feel that armaggeddon was coming fast and the "new system" would be here to give me the prize.

dorayakii

I never liked the normal ones we sang every meeting like "God's Promise of Paradise" and "Life Without End At Last"... Even when i was a borg drone, i hated the one we sang at every Assembly: "Make the Truth Your Own"

I was into the ones we sung rarely like God's Own Book a Treasure: "There is a book thats by its many pa-ges, brings peace and joy and hope to human kind"...

and Jah provider of Escape: "Je-ho-vah, provides escape, for... the... loy-al"...

I also liked the one about Lazarus "Lazarus lay sleeeeeeping, in a stone cold grave"... lol...

21

1914How Is It Arrived At? (Daniel 4)

by AuldSoul in

the only chronology in the bible tying anything to 1914, according to jehovah's witnesses, is found in daniel 4.. 1914how is it arrived at?.

assumption #1: luke 21:24 is referring to nebuchadnezzars dream as related in daniel 4, and that indicates a future fulfillment of daniel 4.. assumption #2: the second fulfillment of nebuchadnezzars dream relates to something entirely different than the initial fulfillment.. assumption #3: the seven times of daniel 4 means seven years.. assumption #4: the seven years dont mean seven years, they mean seven years of years, where each day of each year equals one year.. assumption #5: the seven years of years dont mean seven years of years, they mean seven years of prophetic years, where each day equals 360 days.. assumption #6: jerusalem was destroyed in 607 b.c.e.. assumption #7: we should add (7 times x 360 years of 365 (or 366) days each) 2,520 years to 607 b.c.e.

to arrive at 1914 c.e.

dorayakii

This "rule" is not really a rule at all. In the two instances where it occurs in the scriptures, it is applied in two completely different and contradicting ways.

In Numbers 13:34, the crime was 40 days long, and the punishment was 40 years of wandering... for the transgressors the nation of Israel.

In Ezekiel 4:6, the crime lasted 390 and 40 years respectively for Israel and Judah, and the punishment was 390 and 40 days of lying on his side... but for the prophet Ezekiel himself.

"God" has arbitrarily given out a punishment that matches the number of the length of time of the transgression. It is as if a judge has sentenced a serial rapist a saying, "You will serve 27 years, one year for each of the women you raped"... Say the judge made a similar statement only twice in his whole career, will you assume that this is now a "rule" and that the same judge will then give a 2-year sentence to a man who has raped only 2 women?

That aside, applying the day-for-a-year "rule" to the 7 times prophecy gets you in a right pickle.

What was the 7 times a punishment for? Was it 7 days or 7 years of transgressing? Or was it perhaps "7 weeks of prophetic years"...

Who was the transgressor and who gets punished? In Numbers 13:34, the transgressors pay for their crime, but in Ezekiel 4:6 the "righteous prophet" Ezekiel pays for it.

Why is there no specific mention of the day-for-a-rule principle in Daniel, if it was so central to its extended fulfillment? Why does one have to comb through the Bible in order to find some obscure scriptures which have a tenuous link at best with Nebuchadnezzars dream?

8

Guy Fawkes Night...

by Jordan in

jw
friends

.

i love this time of year, it's always fun to buy some big fireworks... any of you guys got your fireworks ready for this year?

dorayakii

This'll be the first time I celebrate Guy Fawkes Night. I'll be taking some friends to Greenwich Village (the original one in London) to eat at a restaurant, then we'll walk up toward Blackheath/Greenwich Park to watch the fireworks on the Heath... then we'll go to my friends house and have a bonfire (or "bone-fire" according to the WT, lol)...

Remember, Remember the 5th of November
Gunpowder, treason and plot
I see no reason why gunpowder treason
Should ever be forgot...

354

Watch Tower sues Quotes for $100,000 plus plus plus...

by Quotes in

court file no.

superior court of justice.

watchtower bible and tract society of .

dorayakii

I wrote to Stephen Bates the Religious Correspondant of the Guardian newspaper in Britain regarding this lawsuit being carried out by the WTS against our friend [Qoutes]... he replied...

Thank you. I hope to write about this case next week.

Good news...

Good news for the Guardian as well... i'll be buying the Guardian everyday next week to find that article... hehe

68

Update: New Governing Body Pics - Have fun!

by Neo in

jw
friends

the twelve men who exert control over the lives of 6,000,000 people and who could put a stop to all the harm caused to families if they wanted to:

as i said in another thread, most of them started partaking the emblems after 1935. that's a clear sign that there's a corrosion of the "remnant" doctrine, because now most of the governing body are considered "replacements" of 'anointed ones who have fallen away'.

i finally found out the new gb members' ages.

dorayakii

It's the cheap ass suits,

Yeah you're right mkr32208... but its also the Stepford Wives-esque constant fake smile that masquarades as the "Kingdom Smile"...
People have to know that Jehovah's people are a "happy people"... I did meet Gerrit Lösch this year actually and he seemed quite nice and quite genuine i must say... its hard to imagine him making these decsisions that affect peoples lifw worldwide for the better or the worse...

25

Quotes site: Bible Quotes????

by ithinkisee in

http://quotes.watchtower.ca/bible_quotes.htm

i appreciate quotes does not add commentary.

but what am i missing from this page?

dorayakii

DAAAYUM!!

Ezekiel 23: 20
And she kept lusting in the style of concubines belonging to those whose fleshly member is as the fleshly member of male asses and whose genital organ is as the genital organ of male horses.

PUTS A WHOLE NEW SIGNIFICANCE TO THE EXPRESSION "HUNG LIKE A HORSE"!!!...