Posts by Qcmbr

169

Challenge to Athiests - is Religion a Pox on Mankind?

by jgnat in

i've spent the last few years examining my core beliefs to test what still stands.

i've let go of an inviolate bible, demoted jesus to a failed prophet, and god as unable to act against injustice.

our universe made itself.

Qcmbr

Lisa - don't forget a sizeable chunk of the world's religions are atheist so to claim that it is just black and white thinking is to claim atheism is more than it is ( a lack of belief in any god ). Someone like myself posts more from an anti-theist and humanist viewpoint than from an atheist one( since that is summed up in a single sentence.) I would never ban religion since that is a road of totalitarianism and is immoral but I wouldremove all religious privilege and rigorously examine the claims of religionists. I would tighten up laws to protect individuals and I would encourage doctrinal change via fiscal penalties ( worked with early Mormons to get rid of the hell of enforced polygamy) - a good example would be to prosecute the WT society for every death caused by refusing blood and a fee for every person taking blood products for religious reasons, in addition those who turn up at the hospital to ensure blood doesn't get taken would be individually prosecuted for manslaughter in the event of a death.

When people get harmed by a policy it is society's duty to modify that policy.

169

Challenge to Athiests - is Religion a Pox on Mankind?

by jgnat in

i've spent the last few years examining my core beliefs to test what still stands.

i've let go of an inviolate bible, demoted jesus to a failed prophet, and god as unable to act against injustice.

our universe made itself.

Qcmbr

jgnat - I agree that religion is one of many reality distorting ideas and does not stand alone. Teaching critical thinking, logic and rationality early on in life would do much to expand our wisdom and discernment when dealing with tripe ideas.

169

Challenge to Athiests - is Religion a Pox on Mankind?

by jgnat in

i've spent the last few years examining my core beliefs to test what still stands.

i've let go of an inviolate bible, demoted jesus to a failed prophet, and god as unable to act against injustice.

our universe made itself.

Qcmbr

Lisa - the most dangerous and warlike country at the moment is America and the excuse is often based upon religious principles. Why oh why would we not want to legislate against this ? People are dying as we speak because of religion.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2005/oct/07/iraq.usa

243

Giant thread of convince-me-not-to-be-a-theist

by DS211 in

jw
friends

if you could teach me one thing to convince me not to believe what would it be?

for instance what has the wt taught about evolution/science or mans existence that is wrong and could possibly change skmeones mind?

and the more important question, why is it a creator couldnt allow for species to evolve?

Qcmbr

Kate - I find the accepting and giving of apologies a somewhat distracting feature of internet forums (now). I'm not angry with you nor am I fulminating with inner ire and so you don't need seek my approval or not. I find it helpful to simply point out a nasty comment simply to establish a boundary. My time is very limited so when I post I tend to be very brusque and to the point. It is not to most people's taste. I post rarely (by design) and when I do it needs to be very focused. My credentials for posting are simply 1: Global citizen 2: Ex cult member (very closely related religion) 3: This forum was an incredible help in opening my eyes to my own beliefs and in some small way I want to add my voice as a spiritual due to a bunch of people who I feel closer to than they will feel to me.

I may not be the ex-mormon this forum deserves and I'm not the one you need but I do enjoy reading and occassionaly posting dammit.

:)

169

Challenge to Athiests - is Religion a Pox on Mankind?

by jgnat in

i've spent the last few years examining my core beliefs to test what still stands.

i've let go of an inviolate bible, demoted jesus to a failed prophet, and god as unable to act against injustice.

our universe made itself.

Qcmbr

jgnat - telling fantastical tales should never cease - that is fun and a brilliant way to teach moral or social lessons. Its when it is presentd as fact and of greater worth than actual knowledge that it becomes bad. I was taught in my home that the earth was 6000 years old despite what I was learning at school and so I spent a large part of my geography lessons arguing against my teacher who was simply trying to educate me.

169

Challenge to Athiests - is Religion a Pox on Mankind?

by jgnat in

i've spent the last few years examining my core beliefs to test what still stands.

i've let go of an inviolate bible, demoted jesus to a failed prophet, and god as unable to act against injustice.

our universe made itself.

Qcmbr

Laika - while I'm not a lawmaker these would be my markers:

1 - RE would not be mandatory and where taught it would have to be taught by a secular teacher (otherwise conflict of interest.)

2 - No school allowed as a faith school

3 - Critical thinking and philosophy taught earlier

4 - Religion considered as a negative factor in child custody, medical and child welfare cases.

5 - Where a child is taught religion in the home it would be a legal right to sue for emotional damages, once an adult, against both the church and family where teachings of said religion can be proven to have caused distress, fear and/or physical or mental harm.

169

Challenge to Athiests - is Religion a Pox on Mankind?

by jgnat in

i've spent the last few years examining my core beliefs to test what still stands.

i've let go of an inviolate bible, demoted jesus to a failed prophet, and god as unable to act against injustice.

our universe made itself.

Qcmbr

LisaRose - the way we move forward is simple. We make it illegal to teach children religion and we allow them to choose when they are older. The question of religion will soon pass into history as an awkward dark age of reasoning as few people who are not taught religion as a child will seek it as an adult.

243

Giant thread of convince-me-not-to-be-a-theist

by DS211 in

jw
friends

if you could teach me one thing to convince me not to believe what would it be?

for instance what has the wt taught about evolution/science or mans existence that is wrong and could possibly change skmeones mind?

and the more important question, why is it a creator couldnt allow for species to evolve?

Qcmbr

Kate - really? Fine. Please don't ask me to explain why this sort of thing is clumsy verbal power play.

You have been a member 5/6 years longer than Tammy and Cofty. Less time than they have actually been posting for. You have posted much less, and made less of an impact on serious decisions I am making at the moment.

169

Challenge to Athiests - is Religion a Pox on Mankind?

by jgnat in

i've spent the last few years examining my core beliefs to test what still stands.

i've let go of an inviolate bible, demoted jesus to a failed prophet, and god as unable to act against injustice.

our universe made itself.

Qcmbr

Actually religion is one of many reality distorting memes. Religion, unchallenged becomes a monster (my personal interest is in the awfulness that Utah became when it was ruled by one of our currently more benign religions, mormons but you can substitute in medieval Catholicism, Taliban Aghanistan or any other times when religion takes over government.) Religion becomes its less scary cousin when it is tempered by secularism and law. When we are unable to challenge an idea we risk totalitarianism and that is what religion has historically become as soon as it was adopted as a ruling power.

Even those churches FORCED to accept evolution by the facts still teach incorrect concepts based upon a version of the emperor's new clothing story. The moment you take a child and teach them that there are invisible people called angels and demons you are guilty of distorting reality. Snakes don't talk, horses don't fly and your lifestyle choices do not send you to hell.

243

Giant thread of convince-me-not-to-be-a-theist

by DS211 in

jw
friends

if you could teach me one thing to convince me not to believe what would it be?

for instance what has the wt taught about evolution/science or mans existence that is wrong and could possibly change skmeones mind?

and the more important question, why is it a creator couldnt allow for species to evolve?

Qcmbr

Your dismissal of me is fine - a little silly but fine however, Tec is not giving wavering JWs a good overview of the options since she argues exclusively for her personal brand of woo. She has a long history here and yet her posts rarely engage the question but revolve around a simplistic idea (listen to her version of christ). One common worry here was that for a time there was a very strong presence on these boards of the aforementioned preacher and between her and Tec they gathered a few ex-JWs into a new faith built loosley on christianity but with a strong anti-religion undertone. That caused a lot of issues and was, imo, a real problem since so many vulnerable people , desperate to find a port in an emotional storm, can fall for a kind voice and a promise of divine communication and many seemed to. Tec now stands alone here promoting this very exclusive brand of faith. Most believers on this board are very different in their approach and can hold a good conversation without constant recourse to a celestial trump card (god just told me.)