Posts by belbab

when i was a kid....i used to look at the wt illustrations of paradise conditions and would day dream about life in the new system....i later used this same technique (shame on me) to brain wash bible students.

however...as i grew up lol (apparently!

) the illustrations changed....and became more modern.

belbab

With all those animals lolling about on the grass, who picks up the doggy doo, lion doo, cattle doo? Seems we would always be stepping in it.

belbab

24

ARE YOU INTERESTED?

by D8TA in

jw
friends

hello watchtower monitors and people of the board....here's the game.. somewhere, in the united states, there is going to be an apostate showing up at one of your district assemblies, he will be sporting a rainbow wig and a john 3:16 sign.

inside the convention.. now now, before apologists and dissents come my way.....i got a protest permit to be on said premis, and also, once i wear the wig and show the sign....as soon as they tell me to leave, i will comply...therefore i cant go to jail(saaay all you want, i already have an "ace up the sleeve" on this, so guess what?

you're wrong if you even think otherwise hehheheheheh).

belbab

D8TA

Your contemplated action reminds me of what someone (reliable source, name will be provided if need be.) told me of an incident that took place some decades ago in the Canary Islands. I may have posted this last year on this board, but can't remember.

Dietlieb Felderer was a dissident JW, I believe from Sweden, who is renowned for his research about the Holocaust, in which he disputes much of the Societies claims about JWs in Nazi concentration camps. He was disfellowshipped for it and also Jewish organizations were on his case.

If you look up his name in a search engine, you will find many references about him. One site: http://revisionists.com/revisionists/felderer.html gives some of his biography

Now for the story. After he was disfellowshipped he spent some time on the Canary Islands. The WT had a district assembly there and he picketed and passed out pamphlets starting from the first day. Each day the Witnesses became more and more hostile, and by Saturday it came to scuffle and fisticuffs. The Police were called, and hauled him in for interrogation. He was told the Witnesses have a permit to have their assembly. He asked if he could see it. The permit authorizor was called in and it was found out there was no permit issued. So Dielieb asked, how much a permit costs. He was told it the amount, not much, about one hundred dollars. So, Dielieb paid a hundred dollars for a permit for Sunday, and on that day showed up and picketed again. It ended up the Witnesses had to move their assembly for that day, because Dietlieb had the permit for the premises.

Now, according to your post, it seems you have covered your bases. However, it seems to me, that you have revealed too much info. The various conventions are going to be on the look out, check legallity of your projected actions etc. Make sure you sit, in the middle of a long row of people where they can't get at you easily. One thing your post may do; verify whethe Brooklyn reads what is written on this discussion board.

Maybe you could use another text or subject, the one you have chosen has been worked to death, somewhat like Math 24:14

The name of the person who told me this story is a lawyer, who testified at one point in a case that also included testimony from Dietlieb Felderer. If you want to verify it, e-mail me and I can give you further details. This person, one time while picketing Brooklyn Bethel, tripped Brother Bert Shroeder's big afro body guard who was trying to get between him and Bert, while they were walking from Bethel to one of the factory buildings.

One

I wish you success, gives the Jaydubs something to talk about.

belbab

d8

Edited by - belbab on 11 June 2002 12:13:13

2

Topics You Will Never See on Witness Zone

by belbab in

jw
friends

following reborn 2002s post earlier with a link to witness zone, i came to an interesting thread there.

it has 574 replies to it.

this thread was started by hey jude 2222 and is called what are some topics that for a certainty we will never see posted here on the witness zone?.

belbab

Following Reborn 2002’s post earlier with a link to Witness Zone, I came to an interesting thread there. It has 574 replies to it. This thread was started by Hey Jude 2222 and is called What are some topics that for a certainty we will NEVER see posted here on The Witness Zone?

One of the topics that will never be seen was posted by Hey Jude herself : Examples of people you know who married out of the truth and it turned out just well.

http://www.jwzone.org/forums/showthread.php?s=d99ccd07572167d8c40d4f0bf6efc604&threadid=3074

This thread reminded me of a thread I always wanted to post, and just didn’t get around to it.

The WT always uses the text, Do not become unevenly yoked with unbelievers as a constraint that always forbids JWs from marrying out of the truth

Like many other doctrines of the WT let’s look at this one a little closer.

Does Paul say, Do not become yoked with unbelievers? No. He says, Do not become UNEVENLY yoked. He was discouraging uneven yokes.

Can someone who is a believer endeavouring to follow the principles of Jesus Christ be in a contract with a non-believer and still not be unevenly yoked? He would only be unevenly yoked if he were caught in a bind and was being influenced to engage in unlawful activities. Two JWs can be in a marriage or business contract and still be unevenly yoked when one of the partners follows a wrong course, alcoholism for example.

Paul says elsewhere,

1Cr 7:9 But if they do not have self-control, let them marry; for it is better to marry than to burn with passion.

What if the person lacking in self control, can’t find an available marriage partner within the WT association? Too bad sister, burn baby, burn? There are many examples of faithful people of old who obtained marriage mates from outside their immediate society.

Paul allows for believers and unbelievers to be yoked in marriage.

1Cr 7:13 And a woman who has an unbelieving husband, and he consents to live with her, she must not send her husband away.
1Cr 7:14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified through his wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified through her believing husband; for otherwise your children are unclean, but now they are holy.
1Cr 7:15 Yet if the unbelieving one leaves, let him leave; the brother or the sister is not under bondage in such cases, but God has called us to peace.

1Cr 7:36 But if any one think that he behaves unseemly to his virginity, if he be beyond the flower of his age, and so it must be, let him do what he will, he does not sin: let them marry.
1Cr 7:37 But he who stands firm in his heart, having no need, but has authority over his own will, and has judged this in his heart to keep his own virginity, he does well.
1Cr 7:38 So that he that marries himself does well; and he that does not marry does better.
1Cr 7:39 A wife is bound for whatever time her husband lives; but if the husband be fallen asleep, she is free to be married to whom she will, only in [the] Lord.

Only in (the) Lord does not necessarily mean that one must marry only those who are of like faith, within an organization like the WTS. Only in Lord can mean only within the instructions of the Lord, that is don’t go and steal someone else’s wife, do not commit adultery, do not capture a woman against her will.

There are many people in the world who love what it right, love their neighbour as themselves, feed the poor, the orphans and the widows.

Paul says:

Rom 2:14 For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves,
Rom 2:15 in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them,

Summarizing then, if someone has a burning desire to get married or to have children, and their is no one available within one’s own community, then go and seek others who have the law of what is right written in their hearts. and remember what God has yoked together let no man, including elders, not break it apart.

Can any of you here give examples of people you know who married out of the truth and it turned out just well.

We know that in the last days, there will be those who forbid marriage. We know that on JW Zone board it is forbidden to post examples of JWs who marry non JWs , certainly it is not forbidden here. Let’s work to set the people free. Let’s provide HeyJude the answer to her secret question she can’t ask openly.

belbab

edited for clarity

99

Dateline discussed openly in our congregation

by TheMatrix in

jw
friends

yesterday, the presiding overseer (elder h) read the letter from the christian congregation of jehovahs witnesses (us branch) regarding their policy on child abuse.

all scriptures were also looked up and read.. elder h is a very prepared brother.

he is a gilead graduate and served as a missionary for about 7 years in kenya before coming home because of illness.

belbab

One more thing,

I don't trust any goddam person, male or female, using a logo that is pointing a loaded pistol at me.

belbab

99

Dateline discussed openly in our congregation

by TheMatrix in

jw
friends

yesterday, the presiding overseer (elder h) read the letter from the christian congregation of jehovahs witnesses (us branch) regarding their policy on child abuse.

all scriptures were also looked up and read.. elder h is a very prepared brother.

he is a gilead graduate and served as a missionary for about 7 years in kenya before coming home because of illness.

belbab

My thoughts about this "discussion".

There is a differnence between spoken word and written word.

This post, supposedly reporting words from the platform, delivered by one of the glorious ones, gilead grad, loving etc. is too pre-packaged, wrapped up in pretty red ribbons and handed over to us.

Nevertheless, the originator of these words, may have given someone a manuscript and they are posted here for our consumption, or he prepared the speech, written verbatim, and posted them here himself.
He may never have delivered them to a congregation. The words may be only what he would have like to have said.

If his position on child abuse is genuine, yet feels he can not publicly profess them, so he posts them here in an effort to create some positive answers to the problem, then even if his methods are clandestine, they are commendable.

Another possibility though is, this is just a Pulic Relations stunt, to white wash and and launder, to soothe and put to rest anxieties within the congregation. This is just another experience from the platform, using a hypothetical situation, to demonstate to all elders and congregations the procedure they wish to be followed.

Whatever, the motives, good or not so good, for this post, in the end
it will lead to the exposure of the crimes of child abuse.

belbab

1

Legalism?

by FRUSR8TD in

jw
friends

ok...i sat and read the letter from bill's lawer to the elders and something struck me as...well...odd.

since one of the things jesus was so hot about during his time on earth was "legalism" in the church, does anyone think he would look kindly on any church/org.

that claims to speak his truth yet needs a whole legal dept.?

belbab

Frus trait,

Legal departments and court systems, have been developped over the centuries to take conflict and wars from the realms of actuality, and isolate them in a less disturbing environment.

It is similar to taking collective rivalries, and allowing resolution of them to take place in a sports arena.

The Universe does not need a virual video type scenario to accomplish its ends. Reality itself is the battleground.

Instead of relying In repentance and rest, The WT leaders say, we will ride on swift horses, therefore those who pursue will be swift (paraphrased from Isa. 30:16

The WT has gone down into Egypt for its One Hundred Horse Cavalry and Chariots. They are meeting their demise, from the far swifter chariots, of public opinion spread at the speed of light through the Internet.

The Universe uses the weak things of the world[/i] to accomplish its purposes.

The legal department is already showing signs of being mired in overwork, and unsolvable dilemas.

The jury is the outraged victims of abuse, backed up by angry public opinion, and is now proclaiming the verdict: Guilty as Charged

And That Which Is and Comes to Be, will soon announce the sentence.

belbab

5

WHY OLD AGE IS DANGEROUS IN GB MEMBERS

by Liberty in

jw
friends

after reading a topic critical of our poking fun at the watchtower society's ancient governing body i could not help but be reminded of the stupid pronouncments that this aged state induces when the gb claim to be "spirit directed" by god.

most of the goofy "the end is near" disappointments which have ruined so many lives over the years among the watchtower's cult members are due to the desire of those in charge to see their "end time hopes" fulfilled before they died.. russel was an old man near death as he pushed hard that the end must be in 1914. rutherford was dying of cancer in the 1940's as he pushed hard for wwii being the sure sign of armageddon's start.

fred franz pushed 1975 for the same reasons knowing that his own time was limited.

belbab

Liberty,

People in power believe that they are the center of the universe.

This is idolatry.

There is another aspect of idolatry.

They believe that the times they live in are the most important, the most critical, in history.

We are the center. We live in the TIME OF THE END! This is their self important cry.

belbab

11

My letter to the Governing Body

by Unclepenn1 in

jw
friends

dear brothers, in promulgating your esoteric cogitations or in articulating your superficial sentimentalities or amicable philosophical or psychological observations, beware of platitudinous ponderousity.

let your conversations and communications possess a clarified conciseness, a compact comprehensibleness, a collated, concatenated cogency.

eschew all conglomerations of flatulent garrulity, jejune babblement and asinine affectations.