Yep he’s a dream come true for WT.
Makes you wonder if it is possible he’s a plant or double agent. Not really, but he’s that bad for the “cause” it seems remotely plausible.
slimboyfat
JoinedPosts by slimboyfat
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3176
It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars (continued)
by Simon inuh oh, looks like the mega thread gave up the ghost, so while i investigate / fix it just continue the discussion here .... it's been a long 9 years lloyd evans / john cedars.
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66
Time of the end - a TRINITY puzzler.
by BoogerMan in(matthew 24:36) “concerning that day and hour nobody knows, neither the angels of the heavens nor the son, but only the father.".
(jesus seems to have forgotten to include the holy spirit not knowing either).
(acts 1:7) "he said to them: “it does not belong to you to know the times or seasons that the father has placed in his own jurisdiction.".
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slimboyfat
Your comment:
the eternal Word stoops to become the envoy, yet without surrendering his equality with the Sender.
defies common sense and scripture.
John 13:16 Very truly I tell you, no servant is greater than his master, nor is a messenger greater than the one who sent him.
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Time of the end - a TRINITY puzzler.
by BoogerMan in(matthew 24:36) “concerning that day and hour nobody knows, neither the angels of the heavens nor the son, but only the father.".
(jesus seems to have forgotten to include the holy spirit not knowing either).
(acts 1:7) "he said to them: “it does not belong to you to know the times or seasons that the father has placed in his own jurisdiction.".
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slimboyfat
You claim that early Christian authors who called Jesus an angel didn’t mean he was really an angel but actually almighty God. What a remarkable linguistic trick. But where did the writers themselves ever say that?
Justin Martyr talked about the Son and “the other good angels”, clearly making Jesus an angel, and distinct and subordinate to God. Did he not mean what he wrote either?
Hence are we called atheists. And we confess that we are atheists, so far as gods of this sort are concerned, but not with respect to the most true God, the Father of righteousness and temperance and the other virtues, who is free from all impurity. But both Him, and the Son (who came forth from Him and taught us these things, and the host of the other good angels who follow and are made like to Him), and the prophetic Spirit, we worship and adore, knowing them in reason and truth, and declaring without grudging to every one who wishes to learn, as we have been taught. First Apology 6
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Time of the end - a TRINITY puzzler.
by BoogerMan in(matthew 24:36) “concerning that day and hour nobody knows, neither the angels of the heavens nor the son, but only the father.".
(jesus seems to have forgotten to include the holy spirit not knowing either).
(acts 1:7) "he said to them: “it does not belong to you to know the times or seasons that the father has placed in his own jurisdiction.".
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slimboyfat
When is an angel not an angel? When you need to prop up the trinity doctrine, that’s when!
Clement of Alexandria was clear that Jesus was an angel who became a human.
Formerly the older people had an old covenant, and the law disciplined the people with fear, and the Word was an angel; but to the fresh and new people has also been given a new covenant, and the Word has appeared, and fear is turned to love, and that mystic angel is born — Jesus. The Paedegogus 1.7
This view that Jesus was an angel in heaven before his birth was common in early Christianity until it was declared heretical in the 4th century.
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Time of the end - a TRINITY puzzler.
by BoogerMan in(matthew 24:36) “concerning that day and hour nobody knows, neither the angels of the heavens nor the son, but only the father.".
(jesus seems to have forgotten to include the holy spirit not knowing either).
(acts 1:7) "he said to them: “it does not belong to you to know the times or seasons that the father has placed in his own jurisdiction.".
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slimboyfat
Nobody can teach God anything, (According to the Bible)
Isaiah 40:14 14
Whom did the Lord consult to enlighten him,
and who taught him the right way?
Who was it that taught him knowledge,
or showed him the path of understanding?Yet there are things Jesus doesn’t know that God knows. Therefore Jesus is not God.
If you are saying that both Jesus and God can be called “God”, but that God is superior to Jesus in knowledge (and power and eternity) then that’s actually what JWs believe, not Trinitarians.
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Time of the end - a TRINITY puzzler.
by BoogerMan in(matthew 24:36) “concerning that day and hour nobody knows, neither the angels of the heavens nor the son, but only the father.".
(jesus seems to have forgotten to include the holy spirit not knowing either).
(acts 1:7) "he said to them: “it does not belong to you to know the times or seasons that the father has placed in his own jurisdiction.".
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slimboyfat
Nobody can know more than God. If there is somebody who knows something Jesus doesn’t know, that means Jesus can’t be God.
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66
Time of the end - a TRINITY puzzler.
by BoogerMan in(matthew 24:36) “concerning that day and hour nobody knows, neither the angels of the heavens nor the son, but only the father.".
(jesus seems to have forgotten to include the holy spirit not knowing either).
(acts 1:7) "he said to them: “it does not belong to you to know the times or seasons that the father has placed in his own jurisdiction.".
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slimboyfat
One verse says Jesus has ALL power in heaven and earth, and another verse says that the father is greater than he is. So which is it? It's both.
Interesting misquotation there. Whether it’s deliberate or unintentional, it’s telling. Matt 28:18 doesn’t say Jesus “has” all power in heaven and earth. It says he has “been given” all power in heaven and earth. God cannot be given power by anyone. This verse proves that Jesus is not God just as much as the verse that says “the Father is greater than I”.
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66
Time of the end - a TRINITY puzzler.
by BoogerMan in(matthew 24:36) “concerning that day and hour nobody knows, neither the angels of the heavens nor the son, but only the father.".
(jesus seems to have forgotten to include the holy spirit not knowing either).
(acts 1:7) "he said to them: “it does not belong to you to know the times or seasons that the father has placed in his own jurisdiction.".
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slimboyfat
Absolutely, not only does Jesus nowhere claim a dual nature, nor any of the Bible writers ever mention it, but he talks and acts as if he's either totally unaware of it or else deceiving his followers about it. Of course the simplest explanation is that the theory of dual nature was developed in order to explain away all the inconvenient texts for Trinitarians that imply and flat out state Jesus is not God. The dual natures theory wasn't fleshed out until the fifth century at the Council of Chalcedon in AD 451 and it's still got people puzzling to make it make sense.
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Time of the end - a TRINITY puzzler.
by BoogerMan in(matthew 24:36) “concerning that day and hour nobody knows, neither the angels of the heavens nor the son, but only the father.".
(jesus seems to have forgotten to include the holy spirit not knowing either).
(acts 1:7) "he said to them: “it does not belong to you to know the times or seasons that the father has placed in his own jurisdiction.".
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slimboyfat
Good questions. The obvious answers are that God knows the time because he’s God, Jesus doesn’t know the time because he isn’t God, and the holy spirit isn’t mentioned because it isn’t a person.
A related passage that is interesting to consider is Revelation 14:14-16
14 I looked, and there before me was a white cloud, and seated on the cloud was one like a son of man with a crown of gold on his head and a sharp sickle in his hand. 15 Then another angel came out of the temple and called in a loud voice to him who was sitting on the cloud, “Take your sickle and reap, because the time to reap has come, for the harvest of the earth is ripe.” 16 So he who was seated on the cloud swung his sickle over the earth, and the earth was harvested.
Consider what is going on here. The “son of man”, traditionally viewed as an angelic figure in Judaism of the period, is identified as Jesus in the NT. The text says “another angel” came with a message for “the son of man” from God. Some commentators point out the implication that indeed “the son of man” is an angelic being who is here approached by “another angel”. And what message does the angel bring to the angelic “son of man”? He announces that the time for the harvest has arrived. In other words God conveys to Jesus that the time of the end has arrived by means of an angel entrusted with this message, which is in harmony with Jesus’s own words you quoted that only the Father knows the time, not the angels, nor even the Son, until God reveals it.
In turn this comports with Revelation 1:1 which speaks about a revelation which God gave to Jesus in order to share with John. Again this demonstrates definitively that God is greater in knowledge than the Son because he shares his knowledge with him. In John 8:28 Jesus also states plainly that he says the things the Father taught him, again showing that God is superior in knowledge to Jesus. It is such a clear teaching in the NT and a huge problem for the Trinity doctrine which teaches that God and Jesus are equal in knowledge.
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"Perfect Angels"? A Subtle Shift in Watchtower Doctrine — And Why It Matters
by raymond frantz in"perfect angels"?
a subtle shift in watchtower doctrine — and why it matters.
quoted paragraph from the watchtower september 2025, study article 38, paragraph 12:.
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slimboyfat
raymond frantz, take the opportunity to learn from feedback, especially when it’s from people mean well. There are few things more valuable …