Posts by TheListener

1

new year fade is tough

by TheListener in

jw
friends

god, this is the worst.

the new year is a tough time around the ole watchtower cult.

first it's the dpa cards and filling them out with your cong.

TheListener

God, this is the worst. The new year is a tough time around the ole watchtower cult.

First it's the DPA cards and filling them out with your cong. bookstudy overseer watching over you like a predatory bird and dealing with loved ones who know or don't know you're fading and asking you to sign there death warrant and like it.

Second, it's the whole "where is our District Convention this year?" and "What are the DC dates this year?" nonsense. You'd think they were announcing the place and time of armageddon itself.

Hopefully by the end of the week all of this nonsense will be over and things will slowly go back to the normal cult like flow.

13

WT Letter about elders' sins

by IT Support in

someone recently posted a topic which included a link to a wt letter to bodies of elders.

the letter stated that if an elder confessed to having committed a serious (i.e.

disfellowshippable) sin a number of years ago, and nobody knew about it, he need not be removed.

TheListener

The letter to the body of elders was not one specifically dealing with child abusers. It dealt with any member of the servant body who committed a sin some time in the past. This would include fornication, drunkenness, loose conduct, etc.

The KM from Pillsbury seems to be the closest thing to the letter. It actually spells it in much more detail than I would have expected in a KM article. I wonder how many dubs even know this exists.

I have also seen this provision used on a servant body to excuse someone from serious sin and allow them to keep serving. Even the elder who had sinned (several years in the past) was taken aback at the decision. It was decided by the committee that because Jehovah obviously forgave him, the body would follow the holy spirit's lead. Actually, quite progressive for the dubs.

Althought he KM article is great (and public info.) the U.S.A. letter to the body of elders would still be useful. It should be on file if there are any active elders around.

13

WT Letter about elders' sins

by IT Support in

someone recently posted a topic which included a link to a wt letter to bodies of elders.

the letter stated that if an elder confessed to having committed a serious (i.e.

disfellowshippable) sin a number of years ago, and nobody knew about it, he need not be removed.

TheListener

You didn't imagine it. The letter covers any member of the servant body. That means elders and ministerial servants.

Brings up some interesting ideas: young brother so and so "comes to know" brother farmer's sheep in a biblical sense and keeps hush hush about it for a number of years. In the meantime he becomes a servant or elder (or was already). At some point he feels the need (god knows why) to get it off his chest (so to speak) and all is forgiven because obviously God continued to shower his holy spirit on him (in a good way).

As long as no one turns him in everything turns out ok - in dubland.

If anyone has the actual letter I would love to have a copy myself.

56

Who cares if the JWs are right?

by new light in

this is by no means an original idea, but even if the jws have been right all along, i don't care.

if pleasing god means not knowing what to think or feel without checking with headquarters first, then i don't need him.

who would want to be caught up in an eternal nightmare where the entire population was a braindead mass of clean-cut yes men?

TheListener

I love this thread.

Jez, your comment was right on. I have never thought of it that way before.

When I first began to doubt I thought for sure I would be killed by God. Then when I got CoC I knew for a fact I was gonna die. But, as the mind control loosened its grip on me I realized that I'll just have to suffer through until I am old and wrinkly. Wow, it's actually kind of cool to have free choice and serve God out of desire and not FEAR.

39

I am a newbie....

by sistaintheback in

i posted here a couple of months ago when the site had a little different format.

there was an area for newbies with concerns and that's where i lurked.

i have been in the "truth" for about 30 years.

TheListener

Welcome aboard the apostate train.

I wish you success on your fade. It is nice to hear your husband is fading with you. That makes a major difference when the family pressure really steps up.

Good Luck from TheListener

18

Blood Substitute Vexes Jehovah's Witnesses

by blondie in

http://www.detnews.com/2004/health/0412/22/c01-40027.htm

wednesday, december 22, 2004. .

blood substitute vexes jehovah's witnesses.

TheListener

Hopefully when they pass around our new dpa cards there will be some sort of check mark for accepting non-whole blood substitutes. That is, if you intend to fill their version of the dpa out.

So why does the society say white blood cells are not permissable if they pass from mother to infant in the colostrum? I have never understood this. I have always thought that it was the whole white cell (leukycyte sp?) that was passed in the first few days of nursing a newborn.

Isn't a main reason witnesses can accept blood fractions due to mother/fetus transmission?

13

Lessons require less thinking

by TheListener in

i have noticed something for the last couple of years.

the lessons appear to me much easier and less meaty (this has been discussed at length).

however, something i haven't seen discussed too often is the changes that have occurred in the thinking portion of preparing for the meetings.

TheListener

Tickled PInk I think you are exactly right.

I looked up the word study in two dictionaries and found this:

Dictionary 1: 1 : a state of contemplation : 2 a : application of the mental faculties to the acquisition of knowledge <years of study> b : such application in a particular field or to a specific subject <the study of Latin> c : careful or extended consideration <the proposal is under study> d (1) : a careful examination or analysis of a phenomenon, development, or question

Dictionary 2:

The act or process of studying.
The pursuit of knowledge, as by reading, observation, or research.
Attentive scrutiny.

I believe the average witness fools themself into thinking that they are studying, when in fact they are reviewing (for purposes of memorization) material. I don't believe a thorough study of a subject can occur if only specific viewpoints are considered or if certain viewpoints are summarily excluded.

28

New here (sort of)

by TheListener in

jw
friends

although this is my first post i must say that i feel like i know so many here very well.

your posts have helped me tremendously.

as i become more comfortable i hope to join in the topics and begin to share more about myself.. for now i'll say that i am currently a jw that began researching information about two years ago to improve my faith and knowledge.

TheListener

Thank you all for such a warm welcome. It's funny but after reading the boards for so long and seeing so many new ones welcomed I was worried that I might be the exception. No need to worry - it's amazing how similar many of our experiences are. Whenever I feel frustrated I'll re-read my welcome thread and feel better.

To PanicAttack: I started doubting about two years ago. I totally know where you are coming from. Every witness has things that are just not understood. But, we put that at the back of our minds and press on. One day it dawned on me that the governing body can make mistakes. I know it sounds dumb, I always knew they were imperfect, but somehow this realization was different. I figured I wasn't smart enough to know what mistakes, if any, had been made (doctrinally). So I began to read and read, and read some more. At some point in my searching I decided to buy Crisis of Conscience. Wow!! I was a nervous wreck. I was so nervous I drove over two hours from home to buy it and at that had a worldly friend use their credit card. She was very nice not to say "you're crazy" to me. Then it hit me....I am a grown person and I'm afraid to buy a book. For God's sake what is wrong with that!! I still hide the book - sad but true.

At this point I believe in some doctrines and don't believe in others. I don't believe in unity through coercion. I believe that the scriptures are correct - if more than two people gather to talk about Jesus and what he did for us, you'll receive the Holy Spirit. I don't care if it's a united, organized, efficiently timed meeting of people who all believe the exact same thing. I merely want to enjoy fellowship with people who enjoy studying the bible and discussing its application in our lives. Of course, doing the fade makes that impossible - you know "interfaith" and all that. In due time, in due time.

13

Lessons require less thinking

by TheListener in

i have noticed something for the last couple of years.

the lessons appear to me much easier and less meaty (this has been discussed at length).

however, something i haven't seen discussed too often is the changes that have occurred in the thinking portion of preparing for the meetings.

TheListener

I have noticed something for the last couple of years. The lessons appear to me much easier and less meaty (this has been discussed at length). However, something I haven't seen discussed too often is the changes that have occurred in the thinking portion of preparing for the meetings. Meaning there is less thinking required.

For example, the Kingdom Ministry articles that are question and answer. In the past, if you wanted to participate, you had to study fairly diligently because you didn't really know what questions the brother would ask (except for the easy basic ones). Now, the questions are printed at the bottom of the articles - voila! no more thinking - by speaker or audience.

Another example are the questions before and after the circuit assemblies and special assembly days (not including district conventions). We've discussed the upcoming program for years, but now there are actual questions to be reviewed before and after. Either the friends weren't getting the main points or they were forgotten too fast. Now you can take your KM with you to the assembly and note down the answers to the specific questions in print.

These are just a couple of examples. The friends I speak to always say the same thing: "This just makes it easier for us to get the main points - Satan has us soooooo busy; the FDS is trying to make things easier for us". Then they follow that comment with a "but you still have to study as hard as ever or you'll lose your faith".

Just a thought

28

New here (sort of)

by TheListener in

jw
friends

although this is my first post i must say that i feel like i know so many here very well.

your posts have helped me tremendously.

as i become more comfortable i hope to join in the topics and begin to share more about myself.. for now i'll say that i am currently a jw that began researching information about two years ago to improve my faith and knowledge.

TheListener

Hello everyone. Although this is my first post I must say that I feel like I know so many here very well. Your posts have helped me tremendously. As I become more comfortable I hope to join in the topics and begin to share more about myself.

For now I'll say that I am currently a JW that began researching information about two years ago to improve my faith and knowledge. Unfortunately (for the old me) but, fortunately for the new me I began to realize that some of the things I had been taught all of my life didn't completely make sense to me. This caused me a lot of mental and emotional pain. I began to allow myself to get close to some "worldly" people who helped me in a non-judgemental or "you're in a cult" type manner. My friends along with your posts have helped me navigate through this while maintaining my good mental health.

Due to family committments and pressures I am doing the long fade. For brothers, one of the most dificult parts of fading is getting off the responsibilities radar screen - the more responsibility you have the more dificult it is. Next is immediate family and their personal decisions on how to "deal with you". In the end I have decided that my happiness matters as much as those around me. I am taking each step painstakingly slow.

Thank you all for your openness and candor in your posts - you have no idea how many people just like me you help get through the exiting process.