Posts by ithinkisee

27

An Inconvenient Pool - Algore

by Bonnie_Clyde in

jw
friends

this is from the wall street journal (page a12), thursday, march 1, 2007: (sorry i don't know how to scan).

"there is an irresistible quality to the story about al gore's energy hungry tennessee home, replete with a heated poolhouse that burns more natural gas--$500/month worth--than most of us can afford to use while heating houses that shelter people, as opposed to swimming lanes.

did you know that mr. gore's house uses more electricity in a month than the average household does in a year?.

ithinkisee

::Exactly !!! If Mr. Gore is going to lead the rest of us on global warming perhaps
::he should lead by example. Otherwise he is going to take a look behind himself and
::find the followers had disappeared. Rich folks can afford carbon offsets, the rest
::of us cannot and we will get the brunt of the guilt trips. Does all of this sound
::familiar?

read what they are saying or do you simply go by the news blips on the news and opinion posts on JWD?

Let's imagine for a second he wasn't using the renewable energy that he currently does - because of the high cost. If that was the case YOU would say, "Well if anyone he has the money to do it he would - he is a hypocrite."

So I don't think Al Gore can win with you anyways.

I don't think a person is a hypocrite for having a large house. It's the way I feel.

-ithinkisee

262

Global Warming Hysteria

by metatron in

jw
friends

http://cjunk.blogspot.com/2007/02/quacks-cranks-and-junk-science.html.

are global warming skeptics really just cranks?

i don't doubt that we are having some effect on .

ithinkisee

I think skepticism is helpful.

I think certain sweeping claims made by the pro-Global Warming people are extreme.

But I can't deny that humans are affecting the earth in ways we never have in the history of mankind.

My real problem is this:

Say you have one scientist that says "the world is round".

You have another scientist that says "the world is flat".

Journalists and others will say, "Well, we need to give a fair amount of time to hear both sides of the argument." (In fact that is a common phrase FOX News broadcasters use when being accused of lying or employing questionable journalistic practices or broadcasting poorly researched half-truths.)

My personal opinion is, "No, we don't have to hear both sides in the instance where one side is clearly lying. One is right and the other is clearly lying."

Maybe that is the wrong opinion to have, but that's how I feel.

-ithinkisee

46

Told wife that I don't like going to the meeting

by XBEHERE in

jw
friends

finally said it out loud even though my actions have been showing it for quite some time.

a fight ensued and now she isn't talking to me.

the wierd thing is when i just didnt go she didn't say much (she hasn't been for over 2 mos for a medical reason) but god forbid i should actually vocalize that i don't want to go... i didn't want to give her any fuel to call me an apostate so i just blamed discouragement and my dislike of the elders which she already knows.

ithinkisee

Dude, Thanks for the update man. I am glad you guys are on speaking terms.

I would love to know what's going on in her head man ...

You never know if she is finally getting something she has secretly wished for for a long time or what ... you never know. Sometimes when you think they're gonna zig, they zag.

Has she really not gone AT ALL for three months?

-ithinkisee

17

What do you tell your kids about you're exit or near to exit WTS ?

by Ancientofdays in

in the last year i made myself aware of wts.

then i resigned from elder, i stopped service , i stopped family study, but i'm still a formal jw.

my wife is still a convinced jw, and we often "discuss" (really sometime we scream a bit too much).

ithinkisee

The other thing you have on your side is access to information (online and other) that most of us over 30 never had. And it has been reported on this site many times that Circuit Overseers have been telling elder bodies that kids are not staying JWs as they grow up.

-ithinkisee

17

What do you tell your kids about you're exit or near to exit WTS ?

by Ancientofdays in

in the last year i made myself aware of wts.

then i resigned from elder, i stopped service , i stopped family study, but i'm still a formal jw.

my wife is still a convinced jw, and we often "discuss" (really sometime we scream a bit too much).

ithinkisee

Well I guess I killed this thread. :-( -ithinkisee

17

What do you tell your kids about you're exit or near to exit WTS ?

by Ancientofdays in

in the last year i made myself aware of wts.

then i resigned from elder, i stopped service , i stopped family study, but i'm still a formal jw.

my wife is still a convinced jw, and we often "discuss" (really sometime we scream a bit too much).

ithinkisee

Considering they are not very young (i.e. under 5) you have your work cut out for you. Chances are their entire social structure is already centered around their JW friends. If not ... then good for you.

Try not to scream with your wife when you talk about JW stuff.
I know it's easier said than done. But instead of screaming, try to stick with facts. Get two or three iron clad arguments about why the JWs are liars or whatever and learn those two or three iron clad arguments forwards and backwards. Practice them out loud and practice refuting some of the common "thought-stopping" conversation stoppers she will throw at you. For instance, if you guys talk about 1914 and she starts to say, "But you gotta admit 1914 was a momentous year." tell her that you do acknowledge it was a momentous year, but your beef is not with the significance of the year but why the Society feels the need to lie about the claims they were making back then.

Not screaming with your wife will also help show YOUR CHILDREN you are not the one being unreasonable, and that all you would like to do is talk about what you feel are very valid reasons. Even point out to her that you are willing to come back (barf!) if you can get answers on certain things. One of the most striking things for me before I wanted to talk with my wife about it was a Judicial Committee meeting with the Townsends on MP3 (it's floating around the internet). I was struck by his calm demeanor, but it didn't diminish the forcefulness of his words.

Don't plan on this ultimately winning her over, but just reiterate that you would like to stick with facts and not with name-calling. I posted a conversation with my wife a couple years ago regarding 607 that has some decent points in it. You can see it here.

Some things I learned was:

Do not ask a question you do not know the answer to 100%.
Discuss in a way that places the burden of proof on the Society, not you.
Always remain calm and nonconfrontational.
Do not move on to another point until the point you are on is clarified.
Stick with one issue at a time ... don't start jumping around to every JW teaching.
Try to get the issue down to JWs vs. the Bible .... or JW's vs science ... or whatever .... which will you choose?

Show your children there are successful happy people outside of the JWs.
This might involve taking them to visit other families that you might work with or are associated with somehow or getting them involved in sports (see below) . This also may not yield fruit immediately, but when they go to assemblies and hear how awful, lost and confused worldly people are - deep down they will know it is not true.

Be frank with your children.
Let them know that you will love them whether they are JWs or not and that you REALLY MEAN IT. BUt .... also let them know that you have found many instances where the Society lies. Yes, use the word "lies". Don't get into a tizzy about it though. In fact, don't even expect them to ask you to show your reasons them at that moment. Just let them know that you have found concrete instances and you felt like you couldn't honestly pretend to believe it when you found those lies. And how it hurt your feelings even more when the elders questioned your faith simply because you wanted to discuss these facts openly. This reinforces your honesty and desire for truth - contrary to what they are being fed at meetings and in their car group.

Chances are ... as the kids get closer to having to make tough decisions about they path they want to take, they will ask you to show them those lies. Again, learn em forward and backwards for when that day comes so you can have maximum impact.

Be very frank with them, but not antagonistic. This is not wrong. As you know the Society is not wishy-washy with their attitude towards "worldly" people or people like you that left, so don't think you should be wishy-washy about the Society.

Get them involved
Let them know the door is open if they'd like to try something like martial arts, little league, school sports, school clubs, drama, or whatever. Don't feel the need to push them into it, but let them know you would be happy to drive them there and support whatever creative or competitive pursuit they might wish to take up. It might be as simple as asking them, "If you could do ANY sport or take any class, what would it be?"

46

Told wife that I don't like going to the meeting

by XBEHERE in

jw
friends

finally said it out loud even though my actions have been showing it for quite some time.

a fight ensued and now she isn't talking to me.

the wierd thing is when i just didnt go she didn't say much (she hasn't been for over 2 mos for a medical reason) but god forbid i should actually vocalize that i don't want to go... i didn't want to give her any fuel to call me an apostate so i just blamed discouragement and my dislike of the elders which she already knows.

ithinkisee

"You are the only balanced elder."

Shouldn't that tell her something? (I know the answer is no (initially) ... but it might be worth bringing it up.)

Some wives have said that when their husbands told them they didn't want to go to meetings but that didn't mean you weren't leaving the family that made them feel better for a short time. So maybe make sure she knows 100% that you aren't leaving her?

Naturally I'm not a counselor, but if it is possible to tell her you need a break and some time to recharge your batteries.

Tell her you would like to do personal study and verify stuff you never had a chance to look up before because you have always been so busy with elder stuff.

Then be completely honest with her as time goes on (like you have already) with letting her know what you've been researching. This wouldn't happen over a week, or even a month, but VERY SLOWLY.

My thoughts is that you should NEVER tell her that you have been mentally done for years - until the point she is completely out - if that ever happens. (Hopefully it does.)

I feel for you man. Let me know if there is anything I can do.

-ithinkisee

25

ITHINKISEE birthday today!!!

by freedomloverr in

jw
friends

good morning fellow jwd'ers!

it's my hubby's b-day today.

we woke up to a beautiful dusting of snow and lots of time to just chill and go play today.

ithinkisee

Thanks everyone. I have been sequestered to the basement while Freedomloverr and the kids get things ready ... should be fun! -ithinkisee

34

Round 2 disastor

by thebiggestlie in

round two with me and my parents went terrble last night.

my mother was sobbing and my dad had the biggext look of dissapointment on his face.

i couldn't think straight.

ithinkisee

I know this won't help right now, but I just think it is so great you have a forum like this to remind you that you aren't the crazy one. I never had this kind of resource when I was your age (in 1990). For that reason I am very happy for you (even though you feel like crap now).

You will come out of this a stronger person. I guarantee it.

-ithinksee

8

GB is getting better at adjusting the "light" after so many disasters

by OnTheWayOut in

the total destruction of all worldly governments will definitely arrive in 1914, oh wait... 1915.. oops, 1918- sometime in there.. the prophets will be resurrected by 1925, no doubt about it.

well, soon after that, maybe.. millions now living will never die.

change that to "may" never die.

ithinkisee

They do other things to slowly change stuff:

Footnotes
The Society introduces new thoughts and ideas in footnotes. Look at the articles on pinatas, luaus, etc. They have done the same in the past with 1914607 as well.

Hinting about a new thought in a magazine or assembly talk and then referring back to that talk or article when they officially adopt the new idea.
They did this in 1995 with the generation change, and have hinted at some things recently in backing away from 1914. This gives the impression to the unwitting dub that it is something that is not really new ... just the light getting brighter. They are laying the groundwork now for the upcoming 2014 date.

Suggest stuff and see how it takes.
The Governing Body will give talks out in congregations and ad lib at assemblies some new thoughts and then wait for a reaction from the brothers to see how it is taken. Some, like the brother a month or so ago that claimed the preaching work was finished is one example. I have heard other theories tried as well from other GB members.

-ithinkisee