Posts by Check_Your

43

What JW's are saying regarding the downsizing at Bethel

by jimbob in

jw
friends

i haven't posted anything for a while on jwd due to being busy with work and school, but this email was to much of a crack up not to post.

this was sent to my wife today from her old jw friend.

she forwarded it to me and i'm posting it with her permission.

Check_Your_Premises

should we apply that Scripture ( Not trusting Nobles) to them? I think not.

Are you saying that the WT is the same as Bible? It is the inspired word of God? Are you saying the JW are a prophet?

Are you saying we should put our conscience aside when God's ORGANIZATION does something we disagree with, or we think goes against God's will? Is there any example in the Bible where such behavior is condoned/accepted/rewarded by God?

For example, did God reward the faithful sheep who followed Aaron (God's faithful and discreet slave since Moses was busy at the time), in making a golden calf?

When Jesus arrived, God's ORGANIZATION conspired to kill him. Judas obeyed God's ORGANIZATION and betrayed Jesus. Was his obedience to His ORGANIZATION against His wishes rewarded or punished? Help me out. I forget?

CYP

33

Hi ~ new here...

by Riverwatcher in

jw
friends

i'm so happy to have found this site.

i'm not a j/w, but my son is.

several years ago, he became involved with a j/w, although she was being shunned at the time.

Check_Your_Premises

RW,

Looks like you have been given a broad range of advice and info. You have a lot to chew on. Be sure to give us an update in a couple of weeks or so.

CYP

33

Hi ~ new here...

by Riverwatcher in

jw
friends

i'm so happy to have found this site.

i'm not a j/w, but my son is.

several years ago, he became involved with a j/w, although she was being shunned at the time.

Check_Your_Premises

With all due respect to Mr. Van Gogh, I don't recommend Crisis of Conscience as a first read. It is a VERY good book if you are a JW. But I have heard other non-jw's, and from my own personal experience, that COC is kind of hard to follow if you aren't/weren't ever a dub.

First thing you need to do is keep the trust built up with your son.

Second learn about cults. Helping someone out of a cult is a process, and not simply a matter of finding information to refute his belief system. You have to understand that mind control does not allow rational thought processes to penetrate the protective wall of the cult identity.

Next, learn about the JW. I am not sure what is the best choice here for an outsider. I sure haven't read a better one then COC. But there are hundreds of pages that left me with a ? One that isn't to bad for building an argument against the WT being divinely chosen is Captives of a Concept. It has a tight line of reasoning and relies only on JW literature to make it's case. That is nice because you can literally spend years unraveling the JW web of lies. Look for what has the mosts bang for the buck and will matter most to your son. You will find that the WT has been extremely arrogant over the years, and said a great many silly things. There is a site that is dedicated to simply quoting the WT, www.reexamine.org

Some more good info sites are freeminds.org, ajwrb.org, silentlambs.org, brci.org, jwreform.org...

Go to the hall with him. He will just be ecstatic! Meet the folks at the hall. Ask them about their personal lives. Don't let them put you in a charicature. He will try to get you to start a study, try to avoid that!

That ought to keep you busy.

Spend plenty of time here asking questions. Try to enlist other family members. What is the status of her family?

And if you are a Christian, pray. Alot!

CYP

33

Hi ~ new here...

by Riverwatcher in

jw
friends

i'm so happy to have found this site.

i'm not a j/w, but my son is.

several years ago, he became involved with a j/w, although she was being shunned at the time.

Check_Your_Premises

Just adding to what Dave said;

Everything is based on trust. If he doesn't trust you, he won't talk to you. Dubs are teachers, never students. The way to get him to talk to you is to ask questions about his faith in a genuinely interested way. Once you have good trust, you can then ask him questions that might challenge or alter his perspective.

So sorry.

CYP

33

Hi ~ new here...

by Riverwatcher in

jw
friends

i'm so happy to have found this site.

i'm not a j/w, but my son is.

several years ago, he became involved with a j/w, although she was being shunned at the time.

Check_Your_Premises

Welcome aboard.

Sorry about your situation. You will find that you are in good company here. Most are former jw's here, but many are like non-jw with loved ones in the org.

There is hope!

A couple of books for you to get are Combatting Cult Mind Control and Releasig the Bonds, both by Steven Hassan.

They are "help your loved one out of a cult" manuals. Hang out here. Ask questions. And eventually hopefully you can start helping your son to have a different perspective.

Take care.

CYP

43

"Where else are we to go?" - How to answer?

by AlmostAtheist in

jw
friends

hey guys,.

assume you're talking to a faithful, indoctrinated jw that is only now getting some doubts rolling in his head.

let's say that he doesn't have much info yet, hasn't done much research, and is pretty scared of anything that smells "apostate".

Check_Your_Premises

Sometimes it isn't so much WHAT you say, but when and how you say it.

I have found the most damage I have done to the cult mindset is when I am almost apologetic for my statement.

Also the dub goes through natural eb and flow. WHen they are regularly spending countless hours out in service, or studying ALL of the pubs, and taking notes, and .... they are flowing.

Wait for them to get tired. Wait for them to tell you about the things that bother them. If they trust you, they will. A glass of wine helps get them out of dub mode also. Or even just talking while doing normal things like shopping. (plus they can't scream and yell in public)

You can come up with the greatest zinger in the world. If their defenses are up you might as well just scream at a rock.

CYP

43

"Where else are we to go?" - How to answer?

by AlmostAtheist in

jw
friends

hey guys,.

assume you're talking to a faithful, indoctrinated jw that is only now getting some doubts rolling in his head.

let's say that he doesn't have much info yet, hasn't done much research, and is pretty scared of anything that smells "apostate".

Check_Your_Premises

"where else are we to go?"

-

"finding true worship should not be a process of elimination."

I like that one. ONe time when my wife said that to me, I said

"that is not exactly a ringing endorsement"

Fun to say, but lack humility.

Maybe we should break these up into what we should say and what we would LOVE to say.

CYP

23

Dinner with College Professor

by RichieRich in

jw
friends

i went to the circuit assembly last weekend.

we went up friday, so we could have some time to chill before the assembly saturday and sunday.

our "christian convoy" happened to include a very nice family that is new to our congregation.

Check_Your_Premises

Nice work Richie.

It isn't easy to spot the opening or weak spot sometimes. You played that one beautifully.

Oh yeah, that "Angels Watch You Poop" on the WT just killed me. I got home, saw her copy on our dresser and just started laughing all over again. She was like, "what's so funny!?"

CYP

20

need some help plz!

by needsomehelpwiththis1 in

hi everyone i am doing a reaerch report on jehovahs witness and i am a bit stuck on some things.

if you guys could help me it would be much appreciated.. .

1. religiouos rituals and customs.. 2.books and writings used by the religion.. 3. countries the religion is practiced in.. 4. what happens after death(belief).