Posts by adelmaal

40

moral question

by rwagoner in

jw
friends

just read a thread about a child born with two heads and read some, well meaning but disturbing posts... .

here is the question: .

you and your spouse are expecting...a test is available that will reveal if your unborn child may have a physical disability... .

I always refuse the screening tests when I am pregnant. I am on my third pregnancy and just refused the quad screen. I do not take these tests because an amnio is usually needed to confirm the defect if detected. There is a higher chance you will miscarry from the amnio than there is of your baby having the defect detected by the quad screen.

If the results were positive should the pregnancy be terminated ?

No, I would never end my child's life regardless.

What is your decision based on ?

My baby could just as easily be disabled after birth in an auto accident and I would love it and care for it just the same. It all comes down to love for my child (born or unborn) and respect for that life I helped to create.

Can people with disabilities lead "productive" lives ?

Yes. I have seen plenty of disbled children who are happy and content. I believe the will to live is strong regardless of the circumstance and it is not up to me to decide that someone else not have the opportunity to live.

What if race was a random characteristic at birth.....should parents be allowed to make the same choice ?

No. Granted, I do not believe abortion should be a choice at all. Even so, in regard to this question specifically, if I adopted a baby I would not care what color it was. I can't imagine ending a life purely for the sake of skin color. God created many different races and varieties of people. Who are we to put a limit on that. P.S. I believe I read someone saying this is something that should be discussed as a couple before you plan to have children. I wholeheartedly agree. My husband and I discussed this very issue when he spoke of wanting to have a baby (this pregnancy is my third but his first). I let him know I would not terminate regardless of whether the baby had downs or any other disability. He was shocked and felt differently. He would have wanted to consider termination if there was a defect so we decided to look into adoption instead of getting pregnant. After considering having a child vs. adopting one he eventually decided he could love our baby regardless and we decided to get pregnant. He definitely knew what the stakes were in getting into it though and adoption was not something either of us had any issues with.

37

Gods and the Trinity

by the_classicist in

one of the claims against the trinity that the wtbts makes is that "[s]ince the bible calls humans, angels, even satan, "gods," or powerful ones, the superior jesus in heaven can properly be called "a god.

in the old testament, the hebrew employs elohim to signify what the wt says above.

but it is interesting to note that psalm 82 (81 in the septuagint, and i will be using septuagint numbering from now on), in which the judges of israel are called "gods," is a satire.

adelmaal

I found the following information at: http://biblicalunitarian.com/html/modules.php?name=Content&pa=showpage&pid=77

The original Greek texts were all written in what scholars call ?uncial script,? which uses all capital letters . Thus, although we today make a distinction between ?Spirit? and ?spirit,? in the originals every use was just ?SPIRIT.? Whether or not it should be capitalized is a translator?s decision, based on the context of the verse .

And the following from: http://biblicalunitarian.com/html/modules.php?name=Content&pa=showpage&pid=138

Actually, Bible students should be aware that in both the early Hebrew and Greek manuscripts there were no spaces between the words, no punctuation marks, no chapters and no verses . The original texts of both the Old and New Testament were capital letters all run together, and it looked like this:
INTHEbeginningGODCREATEDTHEHEAVENSANDTHEEARTHNOWT
HEEARTHWASFORMLESSANDEMPTYDARKNESSWASOVERTHESURFA
EOFTHEDEEPANDTHESPIRITOFGODWASHOVERINGOVERTHEWATERS

If this is so, I can now see why it's necessary to take things in context. Can't rely on capitalization!

37

Gods and the Trinity

by the_classicist in

one of the claims against the trinity that the wtbts makes is that "[s]ince the bible calls humans, angels, even satan, "gods," or powerful ones, the superior jesus in heaven can properly be called "a god.

in the old testament, the hebrew employs elohim to signify what the wt says above.

but it is interesting to note that psalm 82 (81 in the septuagint, and i will be using septuagint numbering from now on), in which the judges of israel are called "gods," is a satire.

adelmaal

2 Cor 3:17 reads in part hO DE KURIOS TO PNEUMA ESTIN. The
NRSV translates this as "Now the Lord is the Spirit". Is "the Spirit" the
Father, Son, Holy Spirit or something else entirely?

An article in the Catholic Biblical Quarterly (CBQ, 34 (1972) 467)
quotes a 1915 article by Alfred Plummer,which noted that this "is a
passage, about the exact meaning of which we must be content to
remain in doubt".

I have studied this problem recently with little success. I would
appreciate hearing what is considered to be the modern view of whom
the Spirit/spirit is in this verse.

Found this post elsewhere. Guess he/she was wondering along the same lines I am.

37

Gods and the Trinity

by the_classicist in

one of the claims against the trinity that the wtbts makes is that "[s]ince the bible calls humans, angels, even satan, "gods," or powerful ones, the superior jesus in heaven can properly be called "a god.

in the old testament, the hebrew employs elohim to signify what the wt says above.

but it is interesting to note that psalm 82 (81 in the septuagint, and i will be using septuagint numbering from now on), in which the judges of israel are called "gods," is a satire.

adelmaal

Thanks for all those citations everyone.

Funny how when I look them up the only Bible I can find that does not capitalize the word "Spirit" as though it is a person or as though it is the Holy Spirit and not just the same as saying "the spirit of Chrismas" is the NWT. LOL. [sarcasm] Are the GB yet again the only ones to truly understand direct translation of Greek and Hebrew into English!!! [/sarcasm]

Anyone know off the top of your head how to tell if the original text was meant to be capitalized or lowercase? Is it left up to the reader to discern this or was there some correct grammar that was used to denote a proper noun vs. an improper one in any of these scriptures?

48

Why would you want to kill the org?

by what_Truth? in

i know that there's a lot of people here who have been deeply hurt by the jehovah's witnesses (i have as well).

i also know that the gb are a bunch of lying bastards.

still i have also met a lot of people who have made their lives much better by becoming jehovah's witnesses.

adelmaal

Actually, I thought they were the ones who wanted to kill us at armageddon... The "eye for an eye" concept works for me.

23

When were the dubs last in your area?

by ozziepost in

jw
friends

.

it seems that the visiting witnessing group is becoming an endangered species - rarely seen.. is that your experience?.

when were the dubs last in your area?

adelmaal

They actually worked my street two weekends ago. First time I've seen them in about 2 years.

37

Gods and the Trinity

by the_classicist in

one of the claims against the trinity that the wtbts makes is that "[s]ince the bible calls humans, angels, even satan, "gods," or powerful ones, the superior jesus in heaven can properly be called "a god.

in the old testament, the hebrew employs elohim to signify what the wt says above.

but it is interesting to note that psalm 82 (81 in the septuagint, and i will be using septuagint numbering from now on), in which the judges of israel are called "gods," is a satire.

adelmaal

LittleToe: Things that make me go hmm...

Where does it speak "of the Holy Spirit belonging to Jesus"? I did not see that above? Curios to be able to look it up.

As I said previously, I have no clue as to how the Holy Spirit works into the whole equation. I would love to be enlightened.

19

Has being a JW...

by the_classicist in

... ruined certain words for you?

words like "the truth," "watch tower," "jehovah.

" each time i hear words like these get a strange mental reaction.

adelmaal

I thought they were the ones who wanted to kill us - AT ARMAGGEDON! Eye for an eye

37

Gods and the Trinity

by the_classicist in

one of the claims against the trinity that the wtbts makes is that "[s]ince the bible calls humans, angels, even satan, "gods," or powerful ones, the superior jesus in heaven can properly be called "a god.

in the old testament, the hebrew employs elohim to signify what the wt says above.

but it is interesting to note that psalm 82 (81 in the septuagint, and i will be using septuagint numbering from now on), in which the judges of israel are called "gods," is a satire.

adelmaal

Bear in mind that the Trinity claims as well that the Son and the Father are two separate persons in a relationship with each other, distinguished from each other tho unified

Some definitions say unified, others say co-equal. I don't buy it. The creation cannot be co-equal to the creator. Mighty is not the same as Almighty. Sure their related, sure their unified, they are not one and the same in my mind though. In my opinion, God and Jesus are two separate gods, they are not one Almighty God, which is what I have always understood the Trinity to mean. Correct me if I'm wrong, that's just the impression I always got from Catholicism and from Calvary Chapel (who in my opinion worships Jesus more than God himself).

I can almost buy that God and the Holy Spirit are one and the same because I believe the Holy Spirit emanates (SP?) from God in some way; it is a part of him whereas Jesus is a separate creation from him.

37

Gods and the Trinity

by the_classicist in

one of the claims against the trinity that the wtbts makes is that "[s]ince the bible calls humans, angels, even satan, "gods," or powerful ones, the superior jesus in heaven can properly be called "a god.

in the old testament, the hebrew employs elohim to signify what the wt says above.

but it is interesting to note that psalm 82 (81 in the septuagint, and i will be using septuagint numbering from now on), in which the judges of israel are called "gods," is a satire.

adelmaal

I am so not versed in Greek or Hebrew, I'm not sure whether I believe Jesus is Michael and I don't know whether or not Proverbs is describing wisdom personified in Jesus. I have lots of researching to do... But...

I would have to agree with Zen Nudist and say that when I read through the Bible and take what I can from it I believe it reinforces a personal relationship between Jesus and God, which in my mind separates the two. I can go with John 1:1 saying "The Word Was God" because I do believe Jesus has been placed in a position of authority by his Father. He acts as God in that position and deserves all the dignity that comes with it. I do not believe they are one and the same though, which I don't think takes away from Jesus or God.

JosephMalik: I love the point you made about Jesus being our God in a sense that he created us. So true! Mighty but not Almighty.

As for the Holy Spirit. Got me