Posts by cellomould

11

A few bibical/religious questions

by Leander in

jw
friends

i've had these questions on my mind for a while and i was just curious as to what some other people's thoughts might be.. .

first off is the issue of the flood and noah.

in the bible account noah was commisioned to preach to those around him about the coming flood.

cellomould

Hey Pomegranate (et al), I thought for a second you had come around to seeing the truth vs untruth in the bible:

Noah was NEVER commisioned to preach by God.

You are right about that. Genesis does not say that Noah was commissioned to preach. But, in the New Testament, that inference is clearly made:

2 Peter 2

4 For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but sent them to hell, [1] putting them into gloomy dungeons [2] to be held for judgment; 5 if he did not spare the ancient world when he brought the flood on its ungodly people, but protected Noah, a preacher of righteousness, and seven others; 6 if he condemned the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah by burning them to ashes, and made them an example of what is going to happen to the ungodly;

There you have it. The New Testament writers constantly reframed Old Testament events in terms of their own current beliefs. So it looks like either blatant contradiction or an evolution of belief.

However you try to define the word 'preacher', it still implies actively communicating with others. (Humans need to hear preaching, not angels, right?) How could anyone have taken note of Noah's passive example? As you stuggle in vain to stay afloat, seeing the ark floating by would be of no significance if Noah had not first told you that he was building an ark. How do you surmise that 7 souls are safely aboard, while you are drowning?

Does Noah stick his head out of the ark and bare his buttocks in contempt of your evil ways?

Does 'God count that as righteousness on his part'?

cellmould

22

God's channel withholding information

by ballistic in

over the history of the watchtower society, they have published numerous medical articles with warnings of dangerous substances such as aluminium and others promoting quack medicines which never worked.

is it not strange, that the people choosen as "god's channel" would get these things wrong?

even stranger is the lack of information on truly dangerous substances.

cellomould

Matty,

While it is true that there were societies back then (around the time of Mosaic Law) that were entirely ignorant of hygiene, etc., it is a gross misrepresentation to say that all societies were equally ignorant. See for example Hammurabi's code of laws:

http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/ancient/hamcode.html

(If you are ever in Paris, you can see this for yourself at the Louvre Museum.)

Another important fact to mention is that large civilizations, like Babylon or Egypt, could not have achieved high population densities without consideration of hygiene and disease management. Both Babylon and Egypt had civilizations predating the Mosaic Law code, of course (...by the way, circumcision was practiced in ancient Egypt.)

So the key issue is not divine intervention, but rather, pragmatism. For example, a child is more likely to die if his foreskin is cut too early. You would have to expect some bleeding (not to mention gangrene and casualties) when you are using flint or crude iron blades. Eventually, you learn to cut the foreskins on or after the 8th day, when it is most likely the child will survive.

I wrote a post a while back about building roads (why different parts of the world used the same methods); I had discovered a common sense reason for this:

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=22681&site=3&page=2

I am jealous, by the way, since there are people who e-mail you with brain-dead letters asking why you question things. I have never received such an e-mail. <huffs and puffs> I have been publicly turning the bible on its head for 8 months now. Maybe today will be my lucky day!

cellmould

62

Anyone ever rub elbows with a Celebrity?

by RubyTuesday in

when i was in the sixth grade in roswell n.m. i met this girl whos father had recently died.my father had also passed away recently.we were both very shy and haveing the lose of our fathers in common we stuck together that year.we never did anything outside of school however, not sure why,she never invited me over and now i think it was because of her horrible home life.but we ate lunch together everyday and chated in a class we shared.i never saw her again until..... when i was in my 20's my cousins wife told me that my friend demetria guynes was....... drum roll..plz.

demi moore.

please share simular stories.

cellomould

How could I have forgotten Bill Gates?

He gave a talk at my university and came out of a building with his entourage just as I was passing. The funny thing is that there was a guy who looked a lot like Bill Gates just before I saw the real Bill Gates. Maybe he was a decoy (or a relative); I am not sure he was with the group of bodyguards and groupies though.

cellmould

5

The people and the tower

by A Paduan in

thought i should post this here too.

the watchtower.

once there was a man who lived in a village where some villagers kept some of the ancient things.

cellomould

Yes, I enjoyed the analogy very much until about halfway...that is when the analogy ended and the audience was led to the conclusion. But I think that the comparison to the Tower of Babel is quite interesting and quite unexpected!

Keep the mystery going!

cellmould

9

Can we be gods channel / out WT the WTS?

by Simon in

just wondering.

the wts makes a big fuss about being 'god channel of communication' and the only ones able to provide proper spritual food yada yada yada.

i wonder how easy or difficult it is to some up with something that sounds reasonable and sensible from the bible that the wts has never picked up on?

cellomould

Re: "Anyone else want a go?":

How could it have escaped the notice of the WT that the breasts of a woman were described as 'towers'? That is found in the Song of Solomon (although I am not going to bother to reference it either). Compare that with the verse (I forget where) that says the righteous 'run to a strong tower' for protection...

Whose breasts would you rather cry on... Brother Macho, or Sister Supple?

There you have it! Women will be appointed as elders. It was all prophecied long ago in the bible!

cellmould

9

Can we be gods channel / out WT the WTS?

by Simon in

just wondering.

the wts makes a big fuss about being 'god channel of communication' and the only ones able to provide proper spritual food yada yada yada.

i wonder how easy or difficult it is to some up with something that sounds reasonable and sensible from the bible that the wts has never picked up on?

cellomould

Very interesting Simon.

I think that the Egypt travel was just hyperbole. Kinda like when my friend Dave used to tell me I lived in 'B.F.E.' [insert expletives at your own discretion] when I really only lived about 2 miles from him.

Have you ever read Jose Saramago's Gospel According to Jesus Christ? You must. He makes a bunch of interesting observations and inferences about how Jesus' life must have really been.

cellmould

27

The Final Solution...

by happysunshine in

how could anyone feel good about a paradise built on the bodies of 6,000,000,000 massacred people?

how could you join this religion and feel like you are doing "the right thing", be happy about such a paradise, rejoice in its righteousness, goodness, and wholesomeness?

i can understand being raised (forced) in it, but joining it?!

cellomould

There is ample evidence against god ever having destroyed anyone anywhere on this planet for supposed wrongs...which puts future destruction at the level of distinct impossibility.

cellmould

11

Save a prayer, I'll be droppin' bombs...

by happysunshine in

jw
friends

.

if you have a chance, wish me luck or whisper a prayer for me.

i'm going to "address an issue" with my family (drop bombs) this weekend after 7 years of silent tolerance.

cellomould

Be patient. But say what you have to say.

Good luck!

cellmould

20

on the subject of sex

by Vivamus in

i am being very serious here, i am having some thoughts on the subject of sex.

what is it that determines the way you view sex?

is it upbringing, or genes?

cellomould

Okay, on the subject of sex...

The 'world' is not nearly as sexual as the JW mentality would tell you. To the contrary, JW beliefs on sex are just amplifications of how society feels about sex. Of course, we all know this already. Just sometimes we forget that the JW beliefs are not all that wacky.

So how does 'the world' feel about sex?

Here are some points that reveal a lot:

1) Nakedness is automatically equated with sex

2) Sex is considered selfish

3) Sex strictly within marriage is considered commitment

I think that these are 3 reasons to be vary wary of the traditional approach to sexuality. In reality, the traditional approach serves to enhance sexual desire, not stifle it. Here is the (undeclared) goal: reproduce as much as possible! That explains the commitment, eh? 'Keep at it until she's pregnant, boy!'

Thinking about it this way helps put things into perspective. So what is my view of sex? I am not having a terrific amount of sex with multiple partners (just one for now). But I'll tell you what I do not want.

I do not want to get shoved into a thoughtless marriage because I am curious about having sex with a female.

I do not want to be involved with a girl who has replaced most of her sexual desire with a desire for high social status.

I do not want to feel ashamed of my desires.

cellmould

48

Tiring of Anti-JW causes?

by ashitaka in

jw
friends

i'm kind of burnt out from being pissed off at jws.

tonight, while talking to a friend who left at the same time i did (several years ago), we both spoke of our apathy towards the whole anti-witness movement.

recently i helped in several anti-jw actions, and i thought i made a difference, although it was a pittens compared to others who have come before.

cellomould

Hey Ashi, Larc, et al,

I am not sure how you may relate to this, but everytime I find myself in a new or unfamiliar situation, I have a small epiphany. I have to remember all over again just how far I have come and how my thinking has changed.

I walked 5 miles to come home last night, which was a much needed pensive ambulation.

Suddenly, I was struck by the novelty of the idea: 'I think for myself!' But this same epiphany has happened many times already, always in a different time or place.

I do think that our minds are very sensitive to physical boundaries. I think that, like computers we use different algorithms to solve different problems; let's call it that way. So it is good, even if you have left 'God and religion far behind' to have something to remind you of where you have meandered since then.

One of my disfellowshipped brothers always resists when I invite him to think about something JW related. He always insists that people should be allowed to think for themselves. But it is well known that in many ways, they do not. I think it is the responsible and respectful thing to talk about even our differences with JWs. If they can have a civil discussion without feeling their beliefs are compromised, then they just might be thinking for themselves. By opening communication (and the ex JWs will usually have to be the initiators), we grant them that freedom.

So my stance is not anti-JW, but I certainly will insist on being honest, open, and free.

Isn't my worldview perfectly acceptable?

cellmould