Posts by rootofallevil

26

Saved by grace or by works?

by rootofallevil in

according to the wts if we do not produce acts of good work (feild service, attending 5 meetings weekly, circuit and district assemblies etc), we are not worthy of salvation.

according to the bible, we attain salvation through god's undeserved grace ( or kindness in jw lingo).

what i am looking for is scriptural proof that will shoot down the first and support the latter.

rootofallevil

Funkyderek,

I may not have articulated my question correctly. I am looking for a particular verse(s) that I can show to friends of mine that have already developed some doubts about the WTS.

As for myself, I have had questions about my beliefs as a JW for the last few years and have "lurked" on this forum for at least 6 months before having enough nerve to post. From what I have read both on this forum and through the Bible verses that have been quoted at times, I have concluded to my current beliefs. I have not just "plucked" them out of thin air. I appreciate your concern about my "baseless" conclusions, but let me be the judge of that. All I asked for was an answer to my question. If you can contribute somehow to it, it would be appreciated.

To everyone else that has posted on this topic, I thank you from the bottom of my heart. Not just for this particular topic, but for being there many times as I struggled to set things straight in my head. Especially after 30 years of WT brainwashing.

Everyday I look forward to logging on and "associating" with all of you through this forum. Even though I may not post as often as most of you, I read through every single post on a daily basis.

Thank you.

26

Saved by grace or by works?

by rootofallevil in

according to the wts if we do not produce acts of good work (feild service, attending 5 meetings weekly, circuit and district assemblies etc), we are not worthy of salvation.

according to the bible, we attain salvation through god's undeserved grace ( or kindness in jw lingo).

what i am looking for is scriptural proof that will shoot down the first and support the latter.

rootofallevil

So, works are the result of the grace that has been bestowed upon us.

These works obviously come naturally once an individual is granted grace. They are the result, not the requirement to gain God's grace (fig tree).

These works are in the form of good deeds, and a deep appreciation for God and all that he does for us. They are not limited to that but do they also include the preaching, meeting and assembly attendance requirements etc? I think not.

I beleive these are mechanisms the WTS uses to keep us feeling unworthy and to strive even harder to peddle their literature. After all, isn't that the Great Scheme. Selling the publications of the great printing corporation by the name of WTS?

26

Saved by grace or by works?

by rootofallevil in

according to the wts if we do not produce acts of good work (feild service, attending 5 meetings weekly, circuit and district assemblies etc), we are not worthy of salvation.

according to the bible, we attain salvation through god's undeserved grace ( or kindness in jw lingo).

what i am looking for is scriptural proof that will shoot down the first and support the latter.

rootofallevil

Hello all,

According to the WTS if we do not produce acts of good work (feild service, attending 5 meetings weekly, circuit and district assemblies etc), we are not worthy of salvation.

According to the Bible, we attain salvation through God's undeserved grace ( or kindness in JW lingo).

What I am looking for is scriptural proof that will shoot down the first and support the latter.

Personally it doesn't make a difference. I beleive in the "grace" theory. However, I need the "scriptural evidence" for my friends whom I am trying to help see the lies they have been served all these years!

Thanks for any help

5

Birthday

by rootofallevil in

i know this has been brought up before but can someone remind me how we can explain the phrase "on his own day" mentioned in job 1:4 as meaning "on ones birthday"?

if i remember correctly, in the same book (job) a few chapters later there is a mention of this phrase which clearly shows that it was on their birthday.

also isn't it interesting that job felt obligated to offer burnt sacrifises in case one of his children had "cursed god in their heart".

rootofallevil

moggy lover,

many thanks. Job 3:1-3 is exactly what I was looking for. Thank you for the detailed hebrew explanations as well.

Almostatheist,

thanks for that link. Very logical thoughts on why birthdays should at least not be condemned if not celebrated.

5

Birthday

by rootofallevil in

i know this has been brought up before but can someone remind me how we can explain the phrase "on his own day" mentioned in job 1:4 as meaning "on ones birthday"?

if i remember correctly, in the same book (job) a few chapters later there is a mention of this phrase which clearly shows that it was on their birthday.

also isn't it interesting that job felt obligated to offer burnt sacrifises in case one of his children had "cursed god in their heart".

rootofallevil

I know this has been brought up before but can someone remind me how we can explain the phrase "on his own day" mentioned in Job 1:4 as meaning "on ones birthday"?

If I remember correctly, in the same book (Job) a few chapters later there is a mention of this phrase which clearly shows that it was on their birthday.

Also isn't it interesting that Job felt obligated to offer burnt sacrifises in case one of his children had "cursed God in their heart". Sounds to me like a banquet with a serious overindulgement of alcohol!

Thanks for any help.

27

Can a divorcee remarry scripturally?

by rootofallevil in

i have been visiting this board for the last six months and it has opened my eyes!.

i feel like i was tricked into this religion - since 1975.

i would like to say thanks to all who post on this forum.

rootofallevil

LT and Earnest,

This is the point.

If the vow has been dissolved by husband or wife - for any reason except porneia, why should the other party still be obligated to honor it?

Where does God's undeserved kindness kick in?

27

Can a divorcee remarry scripturally?

by rootofallevil in

i have been visiting this board for the last six months and it has opened my eyes!.

i feel like i was tricked into this religion - since 1975.

i would like to say thanks to all who post on this forum.

rootofallevil

While both homosexuality and bestiality are disgusting perversions, in the case of neither one is the marriage tie broken. It is broken only by acts that make an individual “one flesh” with a person of the opposite sex other than his or her legal marriage mate.

Although it seems there is no scriptural way around it, this quote helps with shooting down the credibility of the WT. This alone may help my friend undestand that he shouldn't put much stock in what the WT teaches.

Imagine that.

According to the WT, if you fornicated with another person of the same sex, this would not constitute grounds for a scriptural divorce, because the marriage tie is only broken by acts that make an individual "one flesh" with someone of the opposite sex to whom they are not married to.

Am I understanding this correctly? This is too crazy!!!

27

Can a divorcee remarry scripturally?

by rootofallevil in

i have been visiting this board for the last six months and it has opened my eyes!.

i feel like i was tricked into this religion - since 1975.

i would like to say thanks to all who post on this forum.

rootofallevil

Thanks for the welcome.

The individual has not gotten a scriptural divorce. There was no porneia. His wife decided to leave him after many years.

He did not initiate the divorce, and neither of them have comitted porneia after divorcing.

Hoe can he scriturally remarry?

27

Can a divorcee remarry scripturally?

by rootofallevil in

i have been visiting this board for the last six months and it has opened my eyes!.

i feel like i was tricked into this religion - since 1975.

i would like to say thanks to all who post on this forum.

rootofallevil

Hello to all.

I have been visiting this board for the last six months and it has OPENED my eyes!. I feel like I was tricked into this religion - since 1975.

I would like to say THANKS to all who post on this forum. The information has been extremely valuable. I have shared everything that I have read with my best freind who also has OPENED his eyes and my family, wife and son who are more and more accepting all this.

I beleive there are a great number of "visitors" to this board like myself, who just read and become informed, without ever posting.

And now to my question.

The WT teaches that someone who has gotten an unscriptural divorce (no adultery committed), may not ever remarry. If he/she does, they will be DFed.

Does anyone have any scriptural proof (bible verse) or scriptural reasoning to prove that this is wrong? I am insisting on "scriptural" because the freind I want to help will only listen if this is through the bible.

Thanks for hearing me out, nice to be here!

9

JWs at The NGO Fair!

by Voyager in

jws at the "ngo" fair!.

previously, dogpatch (randy) had requested some further checking into.

the 2003 georgia ngo listing of jehovahs witnesses.. .

rootofallevil

the main Watchtower corporate entity may have cut the ties FORMALLY while another of its corporate tentacles continues the UN ties FORMALLY (or even informally) as an NGO more on the quiet.

Does anyone know if this is a fact? If so, under what corporate name are they an NGO?

This is pretty damaging stuff, since the WBTS has written letters to the congos stating they have fully disassociated themselves.