Posts by careful

11

How long until some of the Biblical apocrypha will be inserted into the WT teachings?

by nonjwspouse in

i have read through some of these, though not in complete, but enough to see some of these writings could fit into the wt views, such as arian beliefs of jesus.

it would also help separate themselves quite a bit from "christiandom" and their bible.

the "new light" of books not accepted in the canon.

careful

Not quite sure what you mean by Apocrypha. Do you mean the books of the Septuagint that are not accepted in the canon by traditional Jews and Protestants, but are by Roman Catholics and Eastern Orthodox churches?

I remember a WT QFR back in the 50s or 60s that asked whether Jehovah had a hand in restoring the temple during the Maccabean revolt in the 160s BC (recorded in 1 and 2 Maccabees). Freddie Franz wrote the reply, clear from his strange writing style. What he said was that the temple had to be standing in order for the prophecies about Jesus to be fulfilled. I don't recall him citing or quoting any specific passages from 1 or 2 Macc., but it may be the closest the WT publications have come to utilizing the Apocrypha in any sort of "positive" way. I also remember reading in the WT publications, much later than the above QFR, some author putting down some of the elements in the book of Tobit as superstition. The context was a general condemnation of the Apocrypha as a whole.

You seem to think that there are some passages in the Apocrypha that the GB could use "to keep up the Organization and the $ flowing in." What part of the Apocrypha do you have in mind that would help them do this???

15

So when will the Society produce a comedy video on JWorg?

by stuckinarut2 in

so according to 1 tim 1:11 jehovah is supposed to be a "happy god".. so when will we see "his people" produce a comedy video of some sort for the website?.

if you could propose an idea or storyline, what would it be?.

careful

Stuck, what have you been smoking?

32

Have any ex-jws considered joining the Bible Students?

by Rainbow_Troll in

their fundamental beliefs are much like jehovah's witnesses sans the paranoia, authoritarianism, stifling rules, and end-times enthusiasm.

you don't even have to become a bible student to be saved, you could be an idol worshipping heathen and still get resurrected in the milenium.

if i still believed in the divine inspiration of the scriptures, i would be a bible student.

careful

Thanks, Vdh7, for the info. So is Jim Penton in Illinois? I had heard that he had moved to Mexico and then back to Canada.

12

Article: A Look at Canada's 12 Most Wanted Fugitives (Look who is #2)

by AndersonsInfo in

jw
friends

http://www.vice.com/en_ca/read/a-look-at-canadas-12-most-wanted-fugitives.

december 6, 2016. by sam cooley.

careful

Might the guy be dead, having been killed by someone who had personal vendetta against him for hurting some kid who was dear to the killer? Or perhaps McLean just pissed off the wrong criminal in the shadowy world of fugitives?

32

Have any ex-jws considered joining the Bible Students?

by Rainbow_Troll in

their fundamental beliefs are much like jehovah's witnesses sans the paranoia, authoritarianism, stifling rules, and end-times enthusiasm.

you don't even have to become a bible student to be saved, you could be an idol worshipping heathen and still get resurrected in the milenium.

if i still believed in the divine inspiration of the scriptures, i would be a bible student.

careful

SBF, if you look at this link from four years ago and scroll through it, you'll see multiple announcements of local and national meetings here in the USA:

http://www.bbschurch.org/news/2012/Mar_2012.pdf

It looks like they are doing at least moderately well. They are definitely Bible Student types, even with Russell's cross and crown logo.

45

Why Did JWs Abandon Brooklyn for the Sticks?

by Room 215 in

i may have missed this, but can anyone tell me what was the pretext the gb concocted to justify their abandonment of a perfectly suitable, high-profile, high-visibility complex in what is arguably the world's greatest metropolis for the bucolic isolation of upstate new york.

any how does the move square with their purported belief in the imminence of armageddon?

.

careful

As others have said, money was obviously a factor—leaving the city has been a real money maker for them. Likely another factor was the success (in their eyes) of Wallkill and Patterson. So why not finish the NYC exodus?

36

WTBTS' corrupt translation - to elevate elders!

by The Searcher in

the wt march 2017, p.11, par.

13 quotes ephesians 4:8 as saying, "the bible refers to them as 'gifts in men.

however, the org's own kingdom interlinear translation (and every other bible translation) gives a truthful translation of the verse: .

careful

Thank you, Searcher, for this post. Knowing that Fred Franz loved to take an oddball position with some frequency, I checked some of the lesser known translations since others have stated in their replies that they checked the major ones. The only ones I could find without "to" were a small group (Stevens, Way, Schonfield) who rendered the verb as "bestowed" and therefore used "on" or "upon" for the English preposition instead of "to," but that rendering means the same as "gave ... to." I can only wonder what was going through FF's mind back in the late 1940s, long before the WTS had the "elder arrangement," when he came up with this translation. The natural way to take the dative case here is as an indirect object with a verb of giving, "to...". Chalk up another mystery of the ever eccentric FF...

It is of interest that the revisers of the NWT let his rendering stand.

As for your statement,

These couldn't be the gifts which Paul spoke about at 1 Corinthians chapter 12, could they?

don't you think the following verse (11) in Eph. 4 is germane? "He gave some as apostles, others as prophets, others as evangelizers, other as shepherds and teachers." That is, of course, the same concept as at 1 Cor. 12:28, right?

16

The Metropolitan Museum Oasis Bible Tours in NYC

by Beachlover in

jw
friends

i just came home from a day in nyc and was taken to the met for the the woman and her offspring tour i went to keep peace and just enjoy my family.

i've been to the metrpolitan museum of art on many occasions and have enjoyed spending time wandering thru the exhibits appreciating the art and history.

since all family members wanted to do the tour by the wts entitled a woman and her offspring, i thought i could just follow along and just enjoy the art and exhibits.. in all honesty, i'm still amazed at this whole tour.

careful

Sorry I missed Listener's post. I was trying to answer rebel8's question which was posed after Listener's post. Hopefully I served to condense it.

16

The Metropolitan Museum Oasis Bible Tours in NYC

by Beachlover in

jw
friends

i just came home from a day in nyc and was taken to the met for the the woman and her offspring tour i went to keep peace and just enjoy my family.

i've been to the metrpolitan museum of art on many occasions and have enjoyed spending time wandering thru the exhibits appreciating the art and history.

since all family members wanted to do the tour by the wts entitled a woman and her offspring, i thought i could just follow along and just enjoy the art and exhibits.. in all honesty, i'm still amazed at this whole tour.

careful

Fortunately, I have never experienced such "tours," but my immediate guess is that "the woman and her seed" (old NWT) or the "the woman and her offspring" (rev NWT) has to do with Gen. 3:15. The WTS publications have long held that those cryptic lines are the theme of the entire Bible. That is, those words were spoken in Eden and then this seed or offspring was gradually revealed piecemeal down through the history of God's dealing with the patriarchs, Israelites, Jews, and earliest Christians. According to WT theology the woman is Jehovah's heavenly organization (the angels) and the offspring is mainly Jesus and then his 144,000-member bride.

Since this is one unique religious belief among JWs—most of them can be found in other religious groups (a point Ray Franz made in CofC)—it should not be surprising that whoever runs this tour service would latch onto it for a theme in their tour. It would fit the viewpoint, that the supposed 90% of the museum's holding are pointless, which the OP related. I suspect that it might also be an attempt to catch the attention of women who might initially think that the tour would highlight women in general down through history as testified by the art in the museum's holdings. Obviously such an expectation would end in disappointment.

14

Jehovahs Witnesses and Marijuana

by NikL in

jw
friends

i live in california where pot just became legal for recreational use very similar to alcohol.

my wife who is a very active jw has had her medical card for cannabis for a couple of years now.

and i know several in our congregations around our area who are using it medically.

careful

Well, sounds like the GB will have to make a pronouncement on this one! Does anyone know what has been the WT procedure in countries where it has been recreationally legal for a some time (Uruguay, the Czech Republic) ?

Loved these comments:

Getting high probably would make the meetings and conventions go by much quicker.

Okay, now I'm picturing a California congregation all happily buzzed during the public talk...

One bro. I know who quit going years ago once said that he'd ever go back, he'd have to go drugged in order to tolerate the meetings.

Allowing it may up the meeting attendance, memorial statistics, baptisms, etc. Sounds like a win-win Tony, Sam, Mark, David, Geoffrey, and Gerrit, if you're listening. Better than a "door-step Bible study"?

Can you imagine Stephen Lett high? Whoah, would that be something!!!