Posts by careful

5

Meetings, Ministry and Modification of the Flesh

by slimboyfat in

sociology of the body is a popular topic for critical analysis.

i wonder if a general survey has been undertaken in relation to watchtower's exercise of authority over the bodies of adherents.

it occurs to me they exercise authority over the body in four main ways: appearance, private practice, public performance, and location.

careful

What does this mean?

Avoid the "pioneer walk".

I know of one CO who set the example of not closing his eyes in public prayer when publishers would take him out to a restaurant for lunch. He would say a prayer in conversation, looking around the table at everyone, and then, along with his wife, would begin eating. We all looked at each other and began eating too. He cited Matt. 6:1, 5 as support. Granted this is perhaps unusual, but at least one WTS authority figure modified the usual practice.

Aren't men, even elders, in the UK allowed to grow beards, or has this changed since I faded? I was in one liberal congo in the States where one young married brother had a beard and the elders used him to read the WT, carry microphones, offer prayer, etc. Everyone knew that he wanted to look older than he was since he'd married a sister who was 15 years his senior.

I used to not sit up straight in my chair as did others and nobody ever spoke to me about it, even in non-liberal congos.

58

I gave the elders some ammo to use

by atacrossroads in

jw
friends

i was having dinner at olive garden with my cousin who was disfellowshipped for apostacy.

a holier than thou pioneer couple saw us.

if that was not enough i saw her take a picture of me with my cousin.

careful

Sorry to say, but if you eat publicly with a DFed or DAed family member or friend, you have go incognito or risk being found out.

5

Asking to reduce the local Bethel family: a know management strategy

by Gorbatchov in

jw
friends

gorby has worked in some management positions and is now an management advisor for a > 20.000 employee corporation.. once in the five years we have reorganizations, integrations and restructures.. one of the used strategy's is to ask the people the following question:.

"if you had to reduce 50% of your work, what priority's would you choose?".

so, we ask our employee feedback for a 50% reduce of their work.

careful

There's nothing like running a religion like a modern business/corporation. Doubtless the way the apostles worked in the first century! And the WTS/JWs are so eager to put down the churches for not being like the earliest Christians...

1

Sound familiar?

by careful in

jw
friends

journalists exposing religious corruption?.

secret documents being leaked?.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/03/world/europe/vatican-arrests-leaked-documents.html?_r=0.

careful

Journalists exposing religious corruption?

Secret documents being leaked?

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/03/world/europe/vatican-arrests-leaked-documents.html?_r=0

Which is worse, jail or being shunned?

26

Oldest Kingdom Song

by Bereano in

jw
friends

which kingdom song (used today by jw) is the oldest one?

careful

Of course, "continuous" is a bit relative, since Booze Rutherford cancelled all songs and singing at the meetings in 1938, because it took too much time away from the preaching, in his opinion. Knorr had his numerous faults, but at least he did re-institute music at the meetings in 1944.

Notblind, would you please provide documentation for this? I'm not doubting but I'd really love to have the source so that I can share it with others.

Thanks!

26

Oldest Kingdom Song

by Bereano in

jw
friends

which kingdom song (used today by jw) is the oldest one?

careful

Give us your money!

Obliette, isn't that one of the rather newer mantras?

211

Where are you from?

by BeautifulMind in

jw
friends

i know we are all anonymous for our own personal reasons, so i understand if you would rather not say.

but if you don't mind sharing that would be cool.

i currently live in georgia, usa.

careful

Pyongyang. Haven't travelled much but I've heard that people outside of our Beloved Leader's land believe that we don't have internet access here—what a lie. After all, I've posted here, right?

Any secret/ex-JWs want to meet up? Only those with a sense of humor though...

49

Dissenters in Watchtower History: Differing Departures

by slimboyfat in

i'm reading an excellent book about defectors from the mormon church called differing visions: dissenters in mormon history.

through a collection of essays from many academic authors it looks at the life stories of dissenters and reasons for departure, as well as analysing the impact of their dissent on the church itself.

fascinating stuff and makes me wish there was a similar volume looking at the key dissenters from jws/watchtower and the impact they had.

careful

Yes, Penton and Jonsson are important.

Here's another non-American example that I recall reading about in the old KH library when I'd escape from the deadening meetings, duck inside, and read the old lit. There was a guy in the early days of the WTS history in Taiwan who was put in charge locally there (maybe under Rutherford?) but who had a falling out with the WTS HQ in NY, was removed as branch servant (or whatever they called it then), but took the vast majority of Witnesses there with him. Something like 90% of the active Witnesses there followed the guy for years. WTS growth in Taiwan suffered for decades. It was almost nil for that long. Once Gilead got going, they kept funneling missionaries in there but with no real effect. All this was written up in one of the old yearbooks from the 70s or thereabouts. I suppose that WTS growth has finally taken off there now, but the guy's effect was huge for a long time. In numbers it's probably more significant than the Bottings or Bill Cetnar.

Another name to ponder perhaps is musician Frank Kavelin, long-time big name elder in Los Angeles whose dad was tight with GB I. The son used to go to NY to conduct the WTS orchestra for assembly and other recordings. I don't know, however, of any big influence he's had in getting others to leave...

His story:

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/180011/dncall-unmasked-part-1-5?page=1

My two cents.

Glad to see you back and posting SBF! Bedazzle us with your intelligent contributions like you used to.

33

Video: "Iron Sharpens Iron"

by wifibandit in

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=joehewofiba.

is this supposed to placate the ones who have been recently fired?

is this a sign of the aging jw leadership?

careful

Or it it just that they are all hardliners and such people are generally unhappy and rarely smile?

33

Video: "Iron Sharpens Iron"

by wifibandit in

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=joehewofiba.

is this supposed to placate the ones who have been recently fired?

is this a sign of the aging jw leadership?

careful

WfB:

Thanks for reposting this vid. I would never had found it and listened to it on the official website (I rarely go there). I can understand the comments of others who were turned off by it, but I think it gives insight into what is going on within the org right now. Surely one purpose of it is indeed to demonstrate "the right attitude" toward being removed from DO positions ("reassigned"), and by extension, to do the same for others being dismissed from Bethel homes. I remember years ago when I was active, one ex-CO telling me how scary it was to leave the full-time work and find secular work in the greater world (he'd been raised in, served at Bethel, then took up the circuit work, so he never had a real job). He was not as aged as these bros., however. He also commented several times on how working in a worldly job, going to meetings in a local congo, and dealing with the real-life problems that faced the average bro. or sister taught him many things he never would have learned as a FT servant.

One of the observations made by some above struck me: none of them ever even smiles. The only one regularly smiling is the one with the secure FT position, who's still having the org pay for everything, the GB-helper interviewer. I cannot help but wonder if these 3 old-timers have some kind of serious internal questions/doubts/feelings of hurt for having been pretty much dumped but are unwilling, of course, due to their lifelong course of loyalty to admit this to themselves. They thus react by overcompensating in their comments and they are put forth as sterling examples, yet they do look extremely unhappy, in site of their claims otherwise. Are we to write off their obviously sad demeanor just to their advanced age and healthy problems, or are there deeper issues here?