Posts by careful

26

Anyone explain the generation idea!

by Witness 007 in

i don't understand we went thru a phase where we down played the generation so now it's the generation that knew the 1914 generation???

is that correct?

how does that even work.

careful

Splane and his ideas make me think of that TV show from the 1960s, LOST IN SPACE.

29

Applying the facial hair change in New Order portrayals

by careful in

i have a hard time watching the org's vids and reading the publications.

however, that's not the case with others here.

hence this post.

SBF, I don't think any informed person would doubt that just about all ancient Jewish men had facial hair. Your quotation just bears out this established fact. Fred Franz, Nathan Knorr, and their lackeys were for decades standouts against this informed view with a clean-shaven Jesus.

The two groups from the ancient Mediterranean world who were clean-shaven were the Egyptians and the Romans, in other words, the enemies of God's chosen people.

Thx George for the info!

81

Japan closes 638 Congregations!!!!! Why???

by Witness 007 in

japan since the 1970''s has had amazing publisher increases!

every year the number of witnesses shot up by many thousands.

this peaked in 1998, since then the number of witnesses and congregations has continued to drop!.

careful

SBF:

If Japan is experiences secularisation in any way similar to that in western countries

Doesn't secularization require a prior state of non-secularization? How would Japan of the pre-1990s qualify? Haven't they been "secular" for a long time already? By attempting to compare it with westernized, i.e., European and N. American countries, aren't you comparing apples and moon rocks? Japan was never religious like those westernized countries which have gone secular from the effects of nominal Christianity. Sure the Japanese have had Shinto and Buddhism for a long time, but did those religions have any effect equal to the eastern Orthodox, RC, and early Protestant ones where many European governments were run by devoted religionists, had state churches, and so on? No way.

It's still apples and moon rocks.

28

Why "Removed" instead of "Disfellowshipped or Shunning"

by blondie in

jw
friends

i was mulling this over last night...too much free time, i know.

both disfellowshipping and shunning indicate the action of avoiding someone, taking them out of your sphere of associates.

probably is a better sound bite to say "removed.

careful

Whatever the legal motive, don't you think that "adherent" is more descriptive than "member"? That is, "adhere" means something that sticks, like tape or some other adhesive.

Isn't the real litmus test for a loyal Witness that he/she sticks to whatever the GB says about anything? Thus I can't help but think that any change to "adherent" from "member" has some element of this thinking behind it, whether such thinking is overtly conscious to the GB themselves or not.

2

Not on JW.org: JWs in Pro Basketball.

by 3rdgen in

how many ex-nba players are jehovah's witnesses?

who are ex-nba players who are jehovah's witnesses?

careful

Elmore Smith (Lakers, Bucks, Cavs) converted back in 1975—mentioned in the Dave Meyers 1985 Awake! life story:

https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/101985368

and was active for a while but seems to have dropped out. He owns a take-away restaurant in downtown Cleveland now — with his own recipe BBQ sauce.

29

Applying the facial hair change in New Order portrayals

by careful in

i have a hard time watching the org's vids and reading the publications.

however, that's not the case with others here.

hence this post.

careful

Thx to blondie, SBF, et al. Maybe the org videos in the future will show more New Order non-ancient Israelite men with beards.

29

Applying the facial hair change in New Order portrayals

by careful in

i have a hard time watching the org's vids and reading the publications.

however, that's not the case with others here.

hence this post.

careful

So, SBF, does that mean that the resurrected OT prophets who used to be portrayed with "indiscreet" beards in the New Order will have to learn to be discreet in the current publications?

29

Applying the facial hair change in New Order portrayals

by careful in

i have a hard time watching the org's vids and reading the publications.

however, that's not the case with others here.

hence this post.

careful

I have a hard time watching the org's vids and reading the publications. However, that's not the case with others here. Hence this post. It used to be that in the portrayals of New Order male residents the only men with beards were ancient Israelite prophets, kings, and so on. But now that the GB has allowed facial hair, have the New Order portrayals of male residents changed? Do non-ancient Israelites also have beards? It would seem such a thing would follow, but with the org, as we know, such logical thinking does not always follow.

2

How does the Watchtower Society find Deaf People in the community?

by blondie in

jw
friends

i saw this article online today from a woman concerned about conversion tactics used by religious groups, specifically jehovah's witnesses, to find deaf people to convert.

it made me go back and see what the wts uses.. https ://limpingchicken.com/2025/06/12/rebecca-a-withey-concerns-about-deaf-people-being-targeted-by-religious-groups/.

deaf in wts.

careful

The deaf community, Witness and non-Witness, in a given place is pretty well-known by others within that community. They have attended the same hearing-impaired support groups, and the deaf tend to associate with other deaf people, since few non-deaf know their sign language—the KM "suggestions" notwithstanding.

84

Zechariah 12:10 Corruption in the NWT

by Sea Breeze in

here's a question for those who still support watchtower on this forum.

why did watchtower leave out the word "me" in zech.

zechariah 12:10 reads like this: .

careful

A belated thought since I seem to have missed the discussion here as it occurred.

The following translations, none produced by the WTS, have "to him" or "the one/the one whom" here:

James Moffatt (1935), Smith-Goodspeed (1948), Jerusalem Bible (1966), New Jerusalem Bible (1985), Today's English Bible/Good News Bible (1976), New English Bible (1976), Revised English Bible (1989), New American Bible (1970, rev. 2010), Contemporary English Version (1995), English Standard Version (2001), RSV (1952), NRSV (1989), NRSVue (2023), Common English Bible (2013).

Surely these translators, trained in the ancient biblical languages, in the problems of translation, and in the ancient world in general did not feel they were doing anything questionable or blamable.

Of course, a few do render the Heb here as "to me," but they are the minority (KJV, Rotherham, NIV, NASB, HCSB), and while The New Jewish Publication Society Tanakh Translation Study Bible (2007) has "to Me" in the text, the commentator clarifies that rendering by the following note on this verse:

"The Heb is ambiguous, because it may refer to a person or group whom they have pierced. Although the identity of the pierced one/ones is unclear, if the text is read as the continuation of v. 9—as the structure of the section set by the in that day openings suggests—it is more likely that it points to an individual or group from within the nations." p. 1264.

It is wise for someone who is beginning to study the Bible seriously, obviously outside of what is spoon-fed at the org's meetings, to be cautious and not quickly jump to any conclusion about the org's mistranslating/corrupting this or that passage when some inconsistency is first perceived by simply looking at different translations. There are so many passages with difficulties and ambiguities in them that the wise course is to find out first whether a given passage is one of the many that has problems. Certainly this is one—as history has made clear.