because on another thread questions about just what the hell jews believe kept taking us off topic, i decided to start this new one.
that's why, as you will notice, it has that new thread smell.
i will do my best to give thorough and concise answers, but be warned: i do not take myself very seriously.
At this point we are having a musical interlude, including two of the latest hits:
1. I Beat Dat Bitch With a Bat (rap and slow dance versions)
2. Pinot Noir (Ode to Black Penis, kosher version)
A "continental" breakfast is being served in the green room. ("Continental" is French for "truly sucky.") Coffee is supplied free of charge courtesy of the Rock Badger Co., makers of Mama's Fried Fruit Pies and Killem Roach Spray. ("If you can't join 'em, kill 'em!")
because on another thread questions about just what the hell jews believe kept taking us off topic, i decided to start this new one.
that's why, as you will notice, it has that new thread smell.
i will do my best to give thorough and concise answers, but be warned: i do not take myself very seriously.
Why observe Shabbat if you are a secular or agnostic Jew?
Becuase observing Shabbat is a mitzvah, an act that brings redemption or healing to the world. Rest is important to the body, the family, society. Periods of relaxation are a real part of what brings relief to society. Your observance of Shabbat is not a mental belief but a physical action, a mitzvah.
One does not require a literal belief in G-d to perform a mitzvah or to bring healing and redemption into the world. In fact one does such things as if there were no such thing as G-d and therefore left as our responsibility to perform for the world's benefit.
Mentally adhering to a concept, believing in something, does not perform an act of redemption in the world. Belief is not mitzvah. Action is. When you perform mitzvah you "bring a little of G-d" into the world, and to a Jew that is more important that merely believing that G-d exists.
because on another thread questions about just what the hell jews believe kept taking us off topic, i decided to start this new one.
that's why, as you will notice, it has that new thread smell.
i will do my best to give thorough and concise answers, but be warned: i do not take myself very seriously.
C0ntr013r,
What you don't get or keep getting lost about is what you essentially grasp to live as a Jew. It is the opposite of your constant questions about belief. It's not about identifying with points of doctrine or making claim to or denying belief in this or that concept. It's about doing, responding, living, and enduring as a Jew.
Smiddy actually has a closer grasp, whether or not there was just humor behind the intention. It is indeed often said that a rabbi answers a question with a question. It is not actually so, but it can seem like that.
What you are not grasping is something you obviously need to learn, and that is grasping the ideology that what you believe about something is NOT the point to Judaism. It's the opposite. It's want you DO, not what you believe.
That does indeed take some training for some converts due to the fact that it is Eastern thinking, backwards in comparison to what you might be used to. There is no central body that makes decisions, no faith or salvation concepts, instead you will find transcendent and intangible facets that combine with tangible and very sense-driven ritual. Like I said in the very beginning, which you did NOT take heed of was that you would have to let go of your preconceptions you are used to. Your questions aren't helping, not because there are no answers. There are indeed answers. You are just wanting things to be there in Judaism like belief, things that don't matter in the way you keep asking about.
because on another thread questions about just what the hell jews believe kept taking us off topic, i decided to start this new one.
that's why, as you will notice, it has that new thread smell.
i will do my best to give thorough and concise answers, but be warned: i do not take myself very seriously.
Maybe this will help:
CHRISTIANS...What you believe is what matters.
JEWS...What good you bring into the world is what matters.
CHRISTIANS...Your personal salvation is a priority.
JEWS...Bringing healing to where it is needed is the priority.
CHRISITANS...If you believe in the wrong doctrines it can cost you eternal life.
JEWS...Beliefs hold no power to give you something you don't possess or have the power to achieve on your own.
CHRISTIANS...You are more enlightened with your convictions than that of others and must convince or even bring down those who disagree with your views.
JEWS...You are enlightened by all you meet for all are created in G-d's image (so to speak), and you must protect and fight for the right of freedom of conscience for all.
because on another thread questions about just what the hell jews believe kept taking us off topic, i decided to start this new one.
that's why, as you will notice, it has that new thread smell.
i will do my best to give thorough and concise answers, but be warned: i do not take myself very seriously.
And for the umpteenth time, it's not about belief. We are not Jews because we believe in doctrines or concepts. There is no creed to celebrate Sabbath or hold a Seder. We are Jews, period.
We do not believe in the concept of G-d, we respond to it and in various ways.
because on another thread questions about just what the hell jews believe kept taking us off topic, i decided to start this new one.
that's why, as you will notice, it has that new thread smell.
i will do my best to give thorough and concise answers, but be warned: i do not take myself very seriously.
I, like a distant relative of mine once wrote, believe that essentially there is good in all people. If you want a creed and/or a belief system, then there it is.
I believe in facing bad with good.
I believe in answering ignorance with patience.
I believe in answering war with solution, anguish with peace, to try to hear others more than make them hear me, to live not only for me but also to fight for the rights of others who cannot.
I believe it is important to keep our traditions alive, to find the value in all cultures, in all the good that everyone has to give. I believe in preserving humanity, that even the unforgivable can be redeemed and forgiven, of seeking ways to heal instead of inflict.
These are the values of my culture, and I as a Jew believe in them. Whether I believe in a deity or not changes this not. Does any of that help?
because on another thread questions about just what the hell jews believe kept taking us off topic, i decided to start this new one.
that's why, as you will notice, it has that new thread smell.
i will do my best to give thorough and concise answers, but be warned: i do not take myself very seriously.
My answer above was not directed at you, C0ntr013r, but...
For everyone's information I have actually been considering labeling myself as an atheist Jew for a while. The fact is that it still leaves me a Jew.
I would still do the same things I do today, still treasure my culture and engage in its ritual, still observe Shabbat, still hold a Seder every Passover. "Belief" is not an important facet to the Jewish experience.
I am a Jew, and whatever you feel about me, say about me, state about me, my people, our culture and beliefs, you are saying about a real man with struggles like you, desires and hopes like you, and questions just like you. In many ways I am you.
Some of us are born Jews, some join the tribe, some are part of a synagogue, some have no affiliation. But we are united by a common origin and destiny. We all engage in some sort of public act that tells us and the world: I am also a Jew. It's not a creed you have in your mind. It's someone you live as.
because on another thread questions about just what the hell jews believe kept taking us off topic, i decided to start this new one.
that's why, as you will notice, it has that new thread smell.
i will do my best to give thorough and concise answers, but be warned: i do not take myself very seriously.
Second I am not trying to weasel out of the answers. If all you want are answers to those questions they are on the Internet.
Third, I am happy to answer each and every question and I will.
Before I do let me say I am happy to do so, Viviane. Judaism is about acknowledging there is more to life than having answers. And it is also about the struggle to find them.
It's about fighting and struggling against the "angel" like Jacob did all through the "night" of ambiguity, of unknowing, of being the object of hatred, Inquisitions, people who want to hurt you, disbelief, genocide, and being called out as something we are not.
Since some of us are atheists your views of me cannot be based on religion. We are a Tribe of theists, atheists, agnostics, believers, unbelievers. Some of us believe in prayer. Some of us don't believe in prayer.
What we do believe, Viviane, is if you hate one of us then you hate us all. If you respect one, you respect us all.
Jews are not a religion. We are not a race. We are a Tribe. A tribe of various beliefs, of multiple convictions, of one origin, one path, one destiny.
Ignorance is not knowledge, Viviane. Ignorance is what the United States and other countries showed us when the Saint Louis, a ship filled with Jews trying to escape the Nazi regime showed us when they were seeking asylum. No country would have the Saint Louis. They played ignorant to our cries for help, played ignorant to our reports of the concentration camps and the gas chambers and the Shoah. The Saint Louis ended up going back to Europe, its passengers back to Germany, and most all on board to their death in the ovens. ignorance is not what people did for the Jews or to the Jews. Ignorance is what people feigned so they did not have to help the Jews. Ignornace is doing nothing, and as such I would never offer ignorance up as a solution for anything. To claim such of me is the greatest sign of ignorance anyone could ever show.
A non-answer is never a solution. Silence kills. Giving a non-answer killed over 2 million of my direct relatives in camps like Aushwitz. So am I right that you are saying that I believe in not giving an answer, or trying to weasel out, of being silent like all those who were silent about my family as they were forced from our homes and sent to die?
Guess what. You just did.
because on another thread questions about just what the hell jews believe kept taking us off topic, i decided to start this new one.
that's why, as you will notice, it has that new thread smell.
i will do my best to give thorough and concise answers, but be warned: i do not take myself very seriously.
There are actual answers to the questions I asked, C0ntr013r. Agreed upon answers, and those you provided aren't them.
because on another thread questions about just what the hell jews believe kept taking us off topic, i decided to start this new one.
that's why, as you will notice, it has that new thread smell.
i will do my best to give thorough and concise answers, but be warned: i do not take myself very seriously.
@Viviane
Clearly you don't know the answers to my questions.
