hallelujah

Joined

• started 20 topics
• posted 231 times   see topics posted on
• send a message

Posts by hallelujah

• 
  5

  Bible states that Israel didn't have exclusive possession of the Holy Land

  by hallelujah in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i highly recommend to everyone to read joseph wheless classic from 1926, "is it god's word?

  " you can download it for free because it's out of copyright, and read it on microsoft reader.

  here's an excerpt from chapter vii.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  hallelujah

  PS apart from downloading it as an ebook you can access an excerpt at

  http://englishatheist.org/godsword1.shtml
• 
  5

  Bible states that Israel didn't have exclusive possession of the Holy Land

  by hallelujah in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i highly recommend to everyone to read joseph wheless classic from 1926, "is it god's word?

  " you can download it for free because it's out of copyright, and read it on microsoft reader.

  here's an excerpt from chapter vii.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  hallelujah

  I highly recommend to everyone to read Joseph Wheless classic from 1926, "Is it God's Word?" You can download it for free because it's out of copyright, and read it on Microsoft Reader.

  Here's an excerpt from Chapter vii

  But the Jebusites continued to inhabit "Jebus, which is Jerusalem" (Judges xix, 10), until, at least, the time when part of the city was taken by David; …

  And the children of Israel dwelt among the Canaanites, Hittites, and Amolites, and Petizzites and Hizites, and Jebusites [precisely the nations who were so annihilated that "not a man was left of them to breathe"]: And they took their daughters to be their wives, and gave their daughters to their sons, and served their gods" (Judges iii, 1-6)!

  It is a number of times expressly declared: "Nevertheless, the children of Israel drave not out" the very several peoples named, "but they dwell among the Israelites unto this day" (e.g., Josh. xiii, 13; xv, 63; xvi, 10; xvii, 12, 13). Even under the judges they "could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron" (Judges i, 19).
  …
  … This admission that the children of Israel "dwelt among" the seven nations proves that the 600,000 soldiers of Yahveh had not exterminated the 20-odd millions of inhabitants of Canaan, but remained a small and, as is now to be seen, conquered minority among their vengeful enemies.
  …
  
  For these several nations quickly took their turn in conquering and subjecting Israel. First, the King of Mesopotamia kept them in subjection for 8 years (Judges iii 8); then the Moabites for 18 years (iii, 14); then the oft-destroyed Canaanites enslaved them for 20 years (iv, 3); then the Philistines for 18 years (x, 8) ; and again for 40 years (xiii, 1); and so on all but continuously until the time of David, though Yahveh had promised: "Ye shall reign over many nations, but they shall not reign over you" (Deut. xv, 6).
  …
  The sacred record contains many instances, of which but a sample or two will be cited here, of the desperate straits to which Yahveh's heroes of the "conquest" were reduced by their exterminated enemies. In the days of Samuel the judge, the Philistines beat the Chosen so badly that the latter sought recourse to miracle or magic, and brought up the wonder-working Ark of the Covenant of Yahveh out of Shiloh, so that, they said, "when it cometh among us, it may save us out of the hand of our enemies" (1 Sam. iv, 3). It is recorded that the Philistines were afraid when they beard of the advent of the Ark, and said: "Woe unto us, for Gods [Elohim] are come into the camp." Nevertheless, they attacked the soldiers of Yahveh at Ebenezer (which was not then in existence; vii, 12), killed 30,000 of them, and, to their own great misfortune, captured the Ark, which they kept until, to get well rid of it, they sent it back to the Chosen accompanied by suggestive golden images of emerods and mice.
• 
  16

  I just gave blood and I feel great!

  by hallelujah in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  in australia we have only voluntary blood donations.

  it's quite amazing really that people regularly take at least half an hour out of their lives to give blood.

  so i joined them.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  hallelujah

  Thanks folks for the reply. Actually I did feel a little drained for a few days but I suppose that's why they give about ten weeks before sending another invite to the blood bank.

  The librarian looked not a day under 60 giving her 119th donation.

  Once you've given blood there's no point squeaming about taking a blood transfusion if required. So it's a liberating experience.

  Dan
• 
  16

  I just gave blood and I feel great!

  by hallelujah in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  in australia we have only voluntary blood donations.

  it's quite amazing really that people regularly take at least half an hour out of their lives to give blood.

  so i joined them.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  hallelujah

  In Australia we have only voluntary blood donations. It's quite amazing really that people regularly take at least half an hour out of their lives to give blood. So I joined them.

  Dan
• 
  69

  No Absolute Truth

  by Shining One in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  this one is for the politically correct crowd: .

  is there no 'absolute truth'?

  do you want to live that one out?

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  hallelujah

  And I believe that beyond phisical world there is spriritual world and as gravity is very real in phisical world I believe moral laws are very real in spiritual world.

  Bravo Shazard. In fact this is what gives me meaning to live.

  Dan
• 
  37

  Pedophilia with 3-year old slave girls in the Bible!

  by mike87 in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  girls at the age of 3 were forced into sex in both the talmud and the bible.

  also, the age consent in us and europe was as low as 10:.

  http://www.answering-christianity.com/age3.htm.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  hallelujah

  Hi Hellrider,

  I agree. There are universal truths.
• 
  37

  Pedophilia with 3-year old slave girls in the Bible!

  by mike87 in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  girls at the age of 3 were forced into sex in both the talmud and the bible.

  also, the age consent in us and europe was as low as 10:.

  http://www.answering-christianity.com/age3.htm.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  hallelujah

  beksbks

  I think you're right to an extent.

  The Koran is written probably a thousand years after the books of Moses were written (having been written during or after the exile in Babylon). Insofar as it regards the life of Mohammed, it is written contemporaneously and so Mohammed's life is capable of closer examination.

  Determining the age of Asia when she was married by Mohammed seems to be the important thing, i.e. was she a woman as defined at the time (pubescent) or a child (pre-pubescent). If she was pre-pubescent then the question becomes whether Mohammed waited for her to mature or not. I do not know the answer to this but I have no reason to assume that Mohammed had sex with a pre-pubescent girl (committed pedophilia as defined at the time).

  As for Moses and the other biblical prophets, and the actions of the ancient Israelites, these 'records' are older, and generally not written contemporaneously, again subjected to editing and re-writing, (as well as translation). When ancient Israelites were married, we have no knowledge as to what that entailed. Again I would have no reason to assume that pre-pubescent girls would be married and subjected to sexual intercourse, as a rule. I would assume as a matter of logic that amongst the ancient Israelites that marriage would correlate to puberty.

  However in my view, the instruction to the Israelites to kill all but to preserve the virgin girls and take them as their wives, would almost of necessity mean the virgin children, since a woman would be married and hence no longer a virgin. Hence taking the virgin's for wives would certainly mean taking the virgin girls the vast majority of whom would be as a matter of necessity, pre-pubescent.
• 
  37

  Pedophilia with 3-year old slave girls in the Bible!

  by mike87 in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  girls at the age of 3 were forced into sex in both the talmud and the bible.

  also, the age consent in us and europe was as low as 10:.

  http://www.answering-christianity.com/age3.htm.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  hallelujah

  Raphael

  There are many verses in the bible which command the killing by the Israelites of the little children and sucklings, even the children still in the womb. I am not going to bother referencing them because you know they are there.

  As for taking the virgin women, this is of course an English translation and we need to know the genuine hebrew word which was used to know the correct interpretation. Almost by definition, a biblical woman is not a virgin, i.e. when a girl is ready for marriage, she gets married and becomes a woman.
• 
  37

  Pedophilia with 3-year old slave girls in the Bible!

  by mike87 in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  girls at the age of 3 were forced into sex in both the talmud and the bible.

  also, the age consent in us and europe was as low as 10:.

  http://www.answering-christianity.com/age3.htm.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  hallelujah

  Hi Nark

  It is true that we should not judge older cultures by current values and practises. After all, what are current values and practises. During the killing times of Aborigines and Native Americans, everybody knew it was wrong. It was justified by saying that they were pagan, inferior, sub-human, or terrorists (in the language of the day). Current practises have not changed.

  Everybody knew that slavery was wrong, but attempted to justify it anyway.

  Similarly I have not been referred to any injunction against pedophilia in the Bible, and unfortunately given the history of Christian Churches and the Watchtower society, this was certainly needed.

  Nevertheless common sense says that sex with children was unnatural. Of course the definition of adulthood was certainly younger than that which it is today and generally related to puberty. But the same principles were applicable by the standards of the day, notwithstanding that the definition of adulthood may have been a little younger than it is today.

  The bible is crucially lacking in any condemnation of the rape of children, (even as defined at the time, i.e. prepubescent children) which was every bit as horrific as it is today.
• 
  37

  Pedophilia with 3-year old slave girls in the Bible!

  by mike87 in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  girls at the age of 3 were forced into sex in both the talmud and the bible.

  also, the age consent in us and europe was as low as 10:.

  http://www.answering-christianity.com/age3.htm.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  hallelujah

  Just as there is unfortunately pedophilia in the modern world, there was most certainly pedophilia in the biblical times. The fact that it is not condemned by the bible is itself outrageous.