in numbers 21 the account says that the israelites became rebellious, so god sent poisonous snakes among them.. moses was told to erect a copper image of a serpent, and that all those bitten were to look at it and live.. according to the aid book and the insight books the nation numbered around 3 million.. how big and how high would such an image have to actually be to be visible by members of a "tent city" of 3 000 000 people and their trappings (including livestock)??.
how many tons of copper could make such a giagantic image that would not just cave in?.
is this proof once again of the bible being scientific - after all only tubular metal could support such a huge image.
The copper serpent idol most probably existed at one time. However, the account of miraculous healing is the stuff of myth and legend, much like modern accounts of miraculous healing when the "faithful" make pilgrimages to visit holy sites. Most of the sick never are healed, but anecdotes of those who supposedly have been cured keep these places of business holy places going.
Dave
by 2010 the shut off begins here.
first country areas then by 2013 all the cities will be digital only so....alot of poor people will have to at least buy a set top box to watch tv..
I don't watch TV, except for what I can get via internet. From what I have seen, though, the new HDTVs can be had for pretty low prices, at least in the USA.
Dave
40 million saved in africa by this ministry alone i seem to remember.. there are 1 million at this meeting :).
lagos,reinhard bonnke.
stephen.
They must have made a tidy profit with those large crowds. One thing for sure, the gods never pay the bills. Like governments, they just help redistribute wealth.
Dave
okay, i have to confess, i like star trek.
i like voyager best, of the tv series.. anyway, tonight they had a sneak peek of the new star trek movie and we went.
it was really good!.
I'm definitely going to see the new Trek. I liked all of the Star Trek series, but the original and TNG were my favorites. Now, if we're going to compare sci-fi space dramas, then the only one that ever beat Star Trek in my opinion was...
Dave
last week my wife and i were returning from a trip to the store and she starts talking about how amazing the bible is and how one should really not need to take any science classes, cause everything that one needs to know is in the bible.
she sites the creation story on how it is all in the bible that there was first water, then earth, then vegetation.........i really did not even know how to reply.
i asked her if she ever really critically read genesis for what it said, it is an interesting story, but there are many inconsistencies and even contradictions within the written word.....but of course she attributes that to the mistakes of man recording the information, since every word of the bible is of course inspired by jehovah.
Stellar evolution, brown dwarf stars, galaxies, the periodic table, protozoa, mitochondrial deoxyribonucleic acid...
I must have missed those items last time I read through the Bible.
Dave
i am still active to try and help family and friends, so that's why i say we.
i know i have brought this up before, but i cannot get over the fact that every service group i go in, and every dinner after the meeting, or coffee or whatever, no one seems to be reading the magazines.
no one understands the doctrines of the generation, 1919, not even blood.. when i bring up one of those subjects, one in the group will repeat the phrase we learned at the meetings, such as "blood fractions is not really blood" or "i think the generation refers more to the anointed or something like that.
My mother is one of the few Witnesses I have ever known who really does know the doctrines inside and out for the past 45 years as a completely loyal Witness. She's in for life, but even she has made the observation that there are many who don't keep up with current understanding. Of course, when she brings up points that others don't know, it is never with the intent to subvert their faith, and they are more likely to be in awe of her knowledge and spirituality.
In your case, Bonafide, I suspect that on some subconscious level your intent to subvert is actually getting through to the Witnesses you know. Therefore, they become uncomfortable around you. That is just my guess.
Dave
i don't know if the premises here are provable or not.
but if this video is right - the world our grandkids will inherit will be like a different planet.
please watch.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-3x5hifxyu.
I seriously question the statistics used and the bald assertions made. I have little doubt as to its motivation. It is clearly an appeal to the psycho-sexual fear of WASPs against "brown skinned Muslim terrorists" whose supposed reproductive prowess is a challenge that must be met by "our" inherently superior and egalitarian society. Give me a break! This is pure racist propaganda.
Subliminal message in this video: "Brown people are a threat to my sexuality, which according to my religion I'm supposed to be ashamed of, but Jesus loves me anyway!"
I am white (It's not my fault!). I grew up in the South (USA). The thing I probably hated most about my culture was racism, no matter how it was disguised.
Dave
i never, ever thought i would ever be posting on a board such as this but here i am.
i've been reading the boards for several months and despite my initial conscience twinges, i couldn't help but follow a logical thought process on many issues that were causing me grief.
over this past week, due to the things i've read on here, i've had a massive cloud lift from me and i'm starting to feel joy and love in my heart that i've *never* felt before.
Thanks for sharing your story. It is good that you are feeling better now. It looks like you've come up with your own religion based on your familiar Witness upbringing. I, too, have felt better lately. Not only have I completely rejected the Watchtower Society, but I have come to see the Bible as a mere man made book and Yahweh (YHWH, incorrectly translated as Jehovah) as no more real than Zeus, Thor, or the FSM (Ramen!).
If you hate the Bible and are looking for that excuse, you'll find it.
Fail. If I know the Bible better than you do and well enough to say that it is filled with myths and contradicions, do you think it is because I hate it? I do not. I know it better now than I even did as a Witness. I was raised by a pioneer mother and an elder father. My mother studied with me in the old pink Paradise book. I gave my first talk at the age of seven in 1975. I even remember the scripture that it was based on (Luke 14). I got baptised when I was 14. I later became a Ministerial servant. I was a Watchtower reader. I learned Spanish to reach out to immigrants. In time I was a Spanish book study conductor and Watchtower reader. I wasn't looking at dates. 1975 didn't phase my parents in the least. 1995? Not a problem to me. September 2001 didn't worry me one bit.
In fact the Watchtower Society's interpretation of the Bible never bothered me. It was the Bible itself that failed to make sense more and more as time passed. In 2006 I finally allowed myself to look at the Bible without the Watchtower publications as a guide. I read Who Wrote the Bible? by Richard Friedman, which is an excellent introduction to the Documentary Hypothesis; Is It God's Word? by Joseph Wheless; and Biblical Nonsense by Dr. Jason Long. I can't begin to tell you how much relief I felt when I saw all the absurdities and contradictions laid out so plainly for all to see. I then began to realize that these were the kinds of books that the Watchtower Society and similar religious businesses don't want their customers laity to know about. Without the Bible, they have no claim on authority. Indeed, without the Bible, neither Yahweh nor Jesus stand up to historical scrutiny.
No, I don't hate the Bible. I just see it for what it is. So, Silent, you're not outside the box yet. Enjoy the good feelings while they last.
Being so born and taught, so I naturally believed. For religious belief is all but exclusively a matter of birth and early teaching, of environment. A man takes and holds, though often most indifferently, the religion, or brand of belief, of his fathers, of his family. Born a pagan, a Jew, a Buddhist, a Mohammedan, a Mormon, that he remains, except one time in many thousands, through life...
- Joseph Wheless
Dave
just had a smaller earthquake in los angeles here, no news yet.. randy.
I'm in southern Puerto Rico right on the coast. Last night we had a good tremor that woke me up. It passed fairly quickly and caused no damage that I am aware of.
I didn't get up to check the exact time, but I'm guessing that the one I felt was this one:
http://earthquake.usgs.gov/eqcenter/recenteqsus/Quakes/prp0912204.php
Dave
so after the meeting yesterday we went for coffee, nice group.
two baptized more than 40 years, one baptized 20 years, one baptized 11 years, and one study that was invited.. someone had picked up the 6/15 wt so i said, "wow, what do you think about new light?
" they said, "what new light?
You just witnessed (no pun intended) cognitive-dissonance in action. Is it any wonder why so-called "spiritual" subjects are never discussed. I was going to say that they are never discussed outside the Kingdom Hall or in the preaching work, but very little of what gets said in the way of doctrine can actually be classified as a discussion either from the platform or at the door. It's more like the expression, "If I want your opinion, I'll give it to you!" (Attributed to Samuel Goldwyn)
Dave
