Posts by done4good

64

Mind control.

by New day in

in a recent thread someone mentioned that the wtbts uses mind control techniques.

do you think this is a conscious ploy?

if it is it would mean that the leaders of my religion (i am still an active jw) set out consciously to control people.

done4good

For the most part, it is not a conscious ploy. There are no "books" on how to mind control someone, (at least in a direct and complete manner).

The JW system of belief, is by its very nature, a manipulative system. JWs are "taught" to be manipulative through years of indoctrination and through example. They are rewarded by that very system for doing so. That is how one climbs the JW corporate ladder. The GB are the most manipulated of anyone in the hierarchy, and therefore can bald face lie about anything to anyone. This serves to support their own belief, as well reinforce that belief on others.

This has everything to do with how individuals respond to existential fears. Religions by their very nature play on this inherit human quirk. The more black and white, (read fundamental), the system is, the greater the potential to become addicted to catering to one's existential fear. This is what Karl Marx was talking about referring to religion being the "Opium of the People".

How this principle applies within the context of the WT is unique, and this is where many misunderstand the nature of the leadership. The leaders have long since become addicted to catering to their own existential fear, and this is why they feel no conscious tweak from the cognitive dissonance they should be experiencing. The level of manipulation the leaders exert on the rank and file is directly proportional to the level black and white, narrow minded, fundamental belief, afforded by a eschatological religion. In other words, the world has not ended, (as we said it would), so we need to invent reasons why it has not, and make sure to control everyone's belief that it will end "soon". This is done as much to appease their own belief, as it is to control others. All they have to really "believe" is that they are god's chosen representatives, (technically the most enlightened in all the earth), and the rest takes care of itself.

d4g

70

Wife fully awake.

by cappytan in

i learned this past week that my wife is now awake.

i just shared the pbs newshour segment with her with no comment other than something along the lines of, "jw story on pbs.".

she is furious at the arrogance of these men.. thats what happens when you get a momma angry!.

done4good

Great news, Cappytan!

91

ABC's report on child abuse

by Joyzabel in

nice job!

done4good

Sir82-
JW Talk appears to be pretty somber on this:
http://jwtalk.net/forums/topic/19847-abc-news-nightline-report-3122015/
Not nearly so much blaming the victim as I would have expected, although, of course, there is absolutely 0 sympathy expressed for her, either.

I dunno. That thread seems to go back and forth, from compassion and sensible discussion, to some brain dead drone spouting the company line, to the sensible and compassionate falling back into cult speak after the brain dead drones make their comments. In the end it pissed me off for sure. Not sure why I would have bothered to read a JW discussion on this subject. These people are incredibly dehumanized.

d4g

17

Jehovahs Witness Shunning & the Crusades

by freemindfade in

while discussing being mistreated by my own jw family last night with my wife, i wanted to try to make her think critically about what shunning really is, and at its root what how beneficial it is.

earlier in the day i sent her non-apostate scholarly article on religious shunning being tantamount to psychological torture.

and most witnesses don't think into much about why they do things, its more of a "this is the way we do it, don't over think it" process.

done4good

Good OP

Religion and its effects are very insidious to a person. Otherwise normal, good people will do very hurtful things because of it, to maintain their belief system when that system is threatened. This is the root of where cognitive dissonance comes in within this context, and religions thrive because of it. The WT just happens to be one of the bigger religious offenders today, mostly because socially it has evolved very little since the 19th century. The RC church, and others have had much more time to evolve to a more docile version of themselves. Shunning was considered perfectly normal in 19th century America. It is not today. The atrocities committed during the Inquisition and Crusades were even more atrocious, but unfortunately were also considered "normal" during their period.

d4g

6

The Walking Dead cocktail party reminds me of... me

by undercover in

jw
friends

as fans of the walking dead know, our heros have found sanctuary (or have they) at alexandria, a seemingly normal safe zone from the walkers/rotters/etc.

this past episode had rick's 'family' invited to a 'welcome to the community' cocktail party, hosted by deanna, the leader of the community.. having entered alexandria, we're starting to see the different levels of ptsd in our little group.

rick, carol, and daryl trust no one.

done4good

neverendingjourney-

I'll never forget one of my first jobs in the professional world when I was 22 years old. A pair of female co-workers who were 7-10 years older than me graciously invited me to a baseball game with them. One was married; the other had a boyfriend. They caught me off guard in the morning and I said yes.
Of course, a man could not be alone with women or else an orgy would surely break out. I spent the rest of the day panicking trying to come up with a good excuse to back out. I made up some stupid story and told them I couldn't go after all. They rarely asked me to do anything ever again.

Been that guy...grew out of it rather quickly though, even as a JW

41

What is the basis for authority for the governing body?

by Half banana in

a word to jehovahs witnesses: what is the basis for the authority the seven members of the governing body can claim in controlling the lives of eight million followers?

the organisation they represent has never got one useful piece of information correct in one hundred and thirty five years... so why should they be believed?.

done4good

EndOfMysteries:

Knorr and friend eventually made comments about a GB, and so they had to form one since they talked about it.

Not exactly. The WT had a governing body like most any other corporation, its board of directors. This was not a doctrinally oriented group, but rather one that was responsible for WT business. This group had a fall out with Knorr/Franz circa 1971, (presumably over Franz's 1975 nonsense), and used their executive power to create a group that took ecclesiastical power away from the presidency later that same year. Of course, so there did not appear to be any mutiny, Knorr and Franz were "absorbed" into this group, (however, they did not go willingly). The "Governing Body" came into existence at this time, although did not come into full power then.

It was no coincidence that this group did come into full power January 1, 1976. This action was an obvious symbolic middle finger to Knorr/Franz. (Is that a symbol of a symbol?? )

d4g

35

Behold the face of indoctrination! My moms guilt tripping letter to me.

by BU2B in

jw
friends

i wish i knew what it was like to have an unconditionally loving mother.

i know she loves me and cares about me, but only within her narrow wt spectrum.

if i do not meet her narrow expectations, i am a failure to her.

done4good

BU2B

Sorry to hear this. Yes, they are manipulative and do not even know it. Remember, they themselves have been manipulated for their entire lives if they were born in.

d4g

20

Skills Gap

by M*A*S*H in

the jws have now been discouraging higher education and critical thinking for a long time.

we have all seen the 'dumbing down' of the wt literature.

on a personal level i have seen many of the perceivably intelligent younger members of congregations leave.

done4good

Simon-

Just so you are aware, the quote function is very clunky to edit, (at least in Firefox).

d4g

20

Skills Gap

by M*A*S*H in

the jws have now been discouraging higher education and critical thinking for a long time.

we have all seen the 'dumbing down' of the wt literature.

on a personal level i have seen many of the perceivably intelligent younger members of congregations leave.

done4good

DJS-
They appear to be paying for that. Excellent. But as long as they can outsource what they need or find enough dubs with the intelligence to do their bidding they will trade stupidity and a lack of education for the alternative.
They will continue to bleed the best and brightest. And that is most excellent.
They are indeed paying for it, and the long term prognosis for the WTBTS is not positive from their perspective.

The one issue I still see however, is that the better educated older Gen Xs or younger Boomers amongst the JWs typically still have decent enough lives that they are too comfortable to make a change, and see things for what they really are. They are often apathetic concerning many organizational related ideas, however riddled with cognitive dissonance, so they cannot see the forest for the trees. It usually takes something to make them uncomfortable enough to get them to wake up beyond that apathetic state. For this reason unfortunately, the organization has some life left.

d4g

47

I'm Ready... Thank you

by Garrett in

jw
friends

hey guys,.

so, something amazing happened recently.

i recently met with an old and very good friend of mine.

done4good

Rebel8-

I am not sure if you mean this the way I am taking it, but that sounds like a false dichotomy: Either you DA or you are pretending to be a jw.
Because it is totally possible to "state a view publicly" without DAing, those who choose to DA must have a different purpose. Whatever that is, it's their own choice to make and affects me in no way whatsoever.

Again, I agree completely. No false dichotomy here. My point is that some folks here are very quick to assume that this is playing by the org's rules, and these are often the same very ones who pretend to be JWs, (not you), by what they like to refer as "fading". Fading has an end game, (or it should). That end game should be to live a life free of control by the WTS. If someone chooses to either DA or not, it does not matter, but what does matter is living your own life. A person is not actually fading if they go along with the JW lifestyle while in front of JWs, (family or not), with no endgame to that charade. "Fading" is a bridge, not a destination.

Arguing whether DA is JW ritual or not really is yet a different discussion. I think a good argument could be made for either, (and maybe it simply does depend on the person), but I know in my case, it had nothing to do with wanting to "play by the rules" one last time for old times' sake. It had everything to do with communicating a message to folks I thought deserving enough to know where I stood.

d4g