as a jw, i was taught the wrong idea of what the trinity is.
the concept of the trinity does not teach that the father is the son.
Hi wonderer, welcome!
Yes, that is still what the wt teaches. They have lowered Christ to being Michael the Archangel. Hebrews clearly states that Jesus is not an angel of any sort. He is the creator. Thanks for your suggestions and you are of course welcome to jump in at any time.
Gumby,
Lol....no
Heathen,
I'll post the creed so you can read it, tell me if it interferes with the bible or..... if it puts into words what it really does teach.
as a jw, i was taught the wrong idea of what the trinity is.
the concept of the trinity does not teach that the father is the son.
Heathen,
If you notice in Collosians the word [other] is stuck in there. That makes it say something different. This word [other] was never in the Greek scriptures. The wt added it in order to make it say what they teach. It is a lie. Check your Kingdom Interlinear if you want to.... At Colossians 1:15 "He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. For by Him all things were created that are in heaven or on earth...."
Keep in mind when you read "firstborn" in the bible it does not necessarily mean the first one born. If you read Psalm 89:27 you see that it is speaking about King David, who was the youngest son of Jesse. He was last born. Yet, notice what God says about him: "Also, I myself shall place him as firstborn...." It is clear there that God isn't speaking about changing literal birth order, but He is speaking about an elevation in rank, above the others to the preeminent position. The same wording is used for Ephraim.
The verse where Job claims that God has stretched out the earth alone or by himself is Job 9:8 Also Isaiah 44:24 alone. Yet.......Collosians and Hebrews and John place Jesus as the creator.. In John 1 it says that nothing came into existence without Him. How could he be created if NOTHING came into existence without him? NOTHING>>> These verses all fit together with Hebrews 1:1-10. If we ignore them them and make Jesus the master worker or helper in the creation then we call God a liar because He said that he was alone.
may you all have peace!.
i had opportunity yesterday, to peruse the thread entitled, "john 1:1 - good information" and there were some very... ummmm... "intriguing" responses.
some were very close to what is true; others, pure speculation.
Job 9:8 :He ALONE stretched out the heavens, and treads on the waves of the sea.
hello :) i suppose this is my introduction to the forum, though i am not sure if i will actually post and read much here.
i did go through several posts, and didn't find anything helpful, though i did find many posts interesting... anyway, i am not a jehovahs witness.
i hope this doesn't immediatly diqualify me from posting this question here... but basically, i was wondering just what is jw?
http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/10/52140/746836/post.ashx#746836
John....this thread has been going on forever . It is concerning John 1:1 You will need patience to go thru this one but you will see error on both sides and then you will see where the mistake is clarified. Grap a cup of coffee because it's along one........ Take care dj
as a jw, i was taught the wrong idea of what the trinity is.
the concept of the trinity does not teach that the father is the son.
Hamas,
If Jesus was only a prophet then he must only be a man like Moses, right? How do you reconcile the fact that the bible has declared Jesus as the creator of the heavens and the earth in Hebrews 1:10. Do you discount what is said of the Son in the bible or do you think that a man created all things? Thanks....dj
Ravyn,
That stuff is out there to me
Francois,
Interesting. I don't know any other Gods. The creator is the only one that I believe in.
StarScream,
Good catch and thanks. I can't edit for some reason.
hello :) i suppose this is my introduction to the forum, though i am not sure if i will actually post and read much here.
i did go through several posts, and didn't find anything helpful, though i did find many posts interesting... anyway, i am not a jehovahs witness.
i hope this doesn't immediatly diqualify me from posting this question here... but basically, i was wondering just what is jw?
Hey John,
What bible do you use anyway? love, dj
hello :) i suppose this is my introduction to the forum, though i am not sure if i will actually post and read much here.
i did go through several posts, and didn't find anything helpful, though i did find many posts interesting... anyway, i am not a jehovahs witness.
i hope this doesn't immediatly diqualify me from posting this question here... but basically, i was wondering just what is jw?
John,
Ok. I give......just do yourself a favor then and find out everything that you can about the jw's....that is if you are still interested in them (sorry, I didn't read all of the posts...lol.) They are a destructive manipulative cult. I was raised in it since I was a young kid of 11 and I left in my late thirties. I do know what I am speaking about!!! THey are deceptive and you will never know it until it's too late.
As far as the trinity goes.......I'm basicaly new at this but I do see it being taught thru-out the bible just not in so many words that some would like there to be.. Trinity or no trinity....the jw's are liars.
I cannot see your reasoning and you cannot see mine obviously. So we can agree to disagree for now. Maybe someday our paths will cross again, who knows. Take care Love in Christ Jesus, dj
in the newspaper today there was an article on pope john paul's visit to crotia.
this is his 100th pilramage, in his 83rd year.
in 2 weeks he is scheduled to go to bosnia, where i doubt he'll get as warm as a reception as he did in croatia.
Ravyn,
wow. quite a link. I'll check it out. I never understood the rosary because of the redundant prayers. I thought that Jesus taught not to do that (like the heathens) lol, He said that! I was baptized Catholic as a baby and made my first holy communion but I'm afraid that all I remember are the jw teachings since around age 11. I don't think that I would ever be able to be Catholic again....too much brain clog from the past but it is interesting how the jw's seem to hate them the most. I've never actually met a devout Catholic. I have laughed a few times at Mother Angelica? on tv late at night when I can't sleep. She is a trip. Thanks again....dj
in the newspaper today there was an article on pope john paul's visit to crotia.
this is his 100th pilramage, in his 83rd year.
in 2 weeks he is scheduled to go to bosnia, where i doubt he'll get as warm as a reception as he did in croatia.
Hi Ravyn,
I understand it now....but I still question the idea of my Catholic friends who seem to pray to their dead loved ones. To me, it is assuming that this loved one is with God or in any of the mansions...lol..because most of the time we are talking about people who when alive were not exactly Christian in thier behaviors. Does the church teach them that it is ok to pray to anyone who died or just these Saints? thanks, dj
as a jw, i was taught the wrong idea of what the trinity is.
the concept of the trinity does not teach that the father is the son.
Heathen
How unusual to meet you here if you were never a jw and have no family in it. Anyway, the "Athanasian Creed" is what you are referring to, right? This creed speaks of One God in three personal distinctions. Yes, Jesus is God and the Father is God and the Holy Spirit is God. The trinitarian doctrine holds that God is a single infinite being, transcending the bounds of space and time, having no body either material or spiritual (except the body that the Son assumed when He came in the flesh). The distinction between the Father and Son is made by using the term 'persons'. This is one God. Jesus was on the earth the Son of God and the Son of Man because He was man borne through Mary and God, as His Son. The trinitarian faith does not allow for dividing the substance of God nor confounding the persons.
You didn't read the link I supplied to you and I regret that because you are missing the fact that the YWWH in Isaiah 44 declares that HE ALONE created the heavens and the earth and also in Job, he says that God did it by himself. How then can you justify the declaration in Hebrews 1:10 that the Father claims that the Son created the heavens and earth? It is a quote from Psalms. How do you justify that there are TWO Firsts and Lasts? In Rev. Jesus is clearly the First and Last and yet in Isaiah YWYH is the First and Last. The A to Z. Alpha and Omega. The heavens and earth were made by the WORD. "Let there be Light". If you are not a JW then what bible do you use? John 1:1 the Word was GOD and he was also with God....that is what the trinity is. Check out the link if you get a chance, ok? dj
ps What bible do you use?
