It's hard to say. Being in another country makes it a bit easier for US JWs to ignore. I imagine it will have more of an impact in Australia and the UK. I do think it will have some impact here, and they have had quite a bit of negative things lately, so not good for them. It could be the tipping point, the one thing that starts the exodus. It would sure be nice, wouldn't it?
LisaRose
JoinedPosts by LisaRose
-
37
Watershed moment???
by sparrowdown inwill this rc turn out to be the beginnings of a watershed time in wbts history?.
do you have any thoughts regarding this?.
-
-
-
5
What is a "Royal Commission"?
by AndersonsInfo in.
https://youtu.be/a0f2g7ink9u.
royal commissions- what the *bleep* do i know about them?royal commissions seem to be called into anything nowadays but do you know what they actually are?.
-
-
LisaRose
It sounds a bit like a congressional hearing the U.S..
A Royal Commission is a major ad-hoc formal public inquiry into a defined issue in some monarchies. They have been held in theUnited Kingdom, Australia, Canada, New Zealand, and Saudi Arabia. A Royal Commission is similar in function to a Commission of Enquiry (or Inquiry) found in other countries such as Ireland, South Africa, and Hong Kong.
A Royal Commissioner has considerable powers, generally greater even than those of a judge but restricted to the terms of reference of the Commission. The Commission is created by the Head of State (the Sovereign, or his/her representative in the form of a Governor-General or Governor) on the advice of the Government and formally appointed by Letters Patent. In practice—unlike lesser forms of inquiry—once a Commission has started the government cannot stop it. Consequently governments are usually very careful about framing the Terms of Reference and generally include in them a date by which the commission must finish.
-
14
Aussie Article: The Saturday Paper - Royal commission examines Jehovah Witnesses cover-up
by AndersonsInfo inhttps://www.thesaturdaypaper.com.au/news/law-crime/2015/08/01/royal-commission-examines-jehovah-witnesses-cover/14383512002194 .
royal commission examines jehovah witnesses cover-up.
newsaug 1, 2015. martin mckenzie-murray the jehovahs witnesses fiercely literal reading of the bible has distanced them from the law and politics, but the royal commission into child sexual abuse is ending that..
-
-
LisaRose
Gormless is the absolute perfect definition of that person. Any bit of individuality, intelligent thought and integrity and have been sucked out of him by the Borg, leaving an empty husk of a man, who can only respond to questions with Watchtower double speak. -
449
Labeling one self "Atheist" is Unscientific
by LAWHFol ini have not meet all atheists, and it would be foolish for me to assume that all atheists, share the same prototypical view points.
i am inclined to feel that this classifies the views of a large percentage of atheists.
"atheism is, in a broad sense, the rejection of belief in the existence of deities.
-
-
LisaRose
Explain to me what is unscientific about not believing something because you have yet to see any evidence it exists?
Is lack of belief in the tooth fairy unscientific?
Is it unscientific to not believe in Unicorns?
Is it unscientific to say you do not believe in Buddha?Do you believe in Buddha? If not, is that unscientific?
If I ever saw scientific evidence of the existence of God, then I would believe she exists, until then I don't see thpoint.
If you can honestly answer these questions, then we can have a discussion.
-
16
Back again!!
by Sweetp0985 inback again since about 10yrs ago.
last year attended the international convention in new orleans and was feeling some type of way afterwards.
went to a couple of meetings and then the thrill was gone.
-
-
LisaRose
It is sometimes inviting to go back to the comfort of the familiar. Obviously there are good parts of the JW experience, the fellowship (sometimes anyway), the feeling of belonging, etc. Of course there are all kind of negatives too, or you wouldn't have left.
I have read that people tend to be risk adverse, they fear a negative outcome more than they desire a positive experience. Advertisers use this to their advantage in selling everything from life insurance to security services, the Watchtower uses it too. Our brains are hard wired to that particular thought processes, what if they are right? What if they are right? Better be safe than sorry. But your brain is actually tricking you, seeing the risk as more than it is and minimizing the odds of it being wrong.
So don't accept your brains first, fear based response. What are the odds they are right? Really, anybody can take the bible and make some correlation to current events, and pretend some insider knowledge, it's not hard. People have been doing that since the bible was written. The question is, what makes the Watchtower any different than any other doomsday cult? It's shaky interpretation, based on a date for the fall of Jerusalem that is not supported by the facts. No bible scholar believes Jerusalem fell when the Watchtower says it did.
The Watchtower thought the end would be 1897, 1914, 2925, 1975, and now still says the end is soon. Why would anyone think they are right this time? Don't fall for it.
-
104
Do you feel vindicated by the exposure of the WT Society in Australia? It seems like a feeding frenzy on here! I love it. You?
by Wasanelder Once inare you pleased with the exposure of the society in australia?
do you feel personally vindicated by it?
do you think it gives you credibility with others now that all the things you said were going on, actually are documented?
-
-
LisaRose
Hell to the yeah! It's what we have all known for years, it's nice to see people outside of the ex JW community seeing the religion for what it is, a sham that doesnt care about the sexual abuse of children. They can try all they want, there is no explaining this away. -
40
Is the two-witness rule really unreasonable?
by stillin ini'm picturing a situation in which a savvy 12 year old doesn't like the house rules that mom's new husband has put into place.
or something along that line.
i can certainly agree that protection of children is paramount, but who protects the real victim in those cases?
-
-
LisaRose
Nobody wants to see someone accused of such a thing if it's not true, but on the other hand child sex abuse is devastating to a child, that is why the situation must be evaluated by professionals. The JWs act as if there isn't two witnesses to the act nothing can be done, which is ridiculous.
A lot of things can be taken into consideration, the child can be evaluated by a psychologist who specializes in child abuse, other people in the family can be interviewed, the accused can be interviewed. That is why the authorities should be contacted no matter what. They have the experience and knowledge not to be taken in by the lies of the typical pedophile.
Even in cases where they don't have enough evidence to pursue a criminal case, the elders are not helpless to act. They have a great deal of authority in the congregation, so why don't they use it? They can put restrictions on the individual involved without revealing anything publicly. No contact with unrelated minors, no field service without an elder, etc. They can warn parents in the congregation that they need to be extra careful, admitting a pedophile is among them without revealing a name. But instead they continue to pretend it doesn't happen to them which allows pedophiles to continue to prey on the children in the congregations.
If there is proof or a confession they should be disfellowshipped no matter how sorry they act and only allowed back under very tight restrictions. And they should never, ever be an elder again, these are innocent children, you don't risk it.
-
67
Branch Service Department Manual approves appointing Child molestors as Elders
by stuckinamovement inhttp://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/downloadfile.ashx?guid=7ba22716-556c-43c2-9fc6-76697afad440&type=exhibit&filename=wat.0001.004.0076&fileextension=pdf
-
-
LisaRose
Un-freaking-believable. It's all OK, the pedophile can be an elder as long as the child rape is not well known. WTF?
-
17
Biblical Proof that JW Elders can not have Jehovah's or Jesus Spirit
by GodZoo insomething just occured to me.. like a lightening bolt in fact.
matthew 10:19 just popped into my head... new american standard bible 18 and you will even be brought before governors and kings for my sake, as a testimony to them and to the gentiles.
19 "but when they hand you over, do not worry about how or what you are to say; for it will be given you in that hour what you are to say.
-
-
LisaRose
No doubt they thought if they just explained how everything was based on the bible, and done per the societies instruction, everyone would just understand that they did nothing,wrong and all the problems would just go away because God is on their side after all.
It must have been a bit of a shock to see that they just ended up looking stupid and people seem to think they should have done something more to protect the innocent, big shocker. I wonder how long it will take for them to figure it out.
-
15
Elder Exposed as a LIAR at the Australian Royal Commission
by The Searcher inthe lawyer at the australian royal commission (arc) hangs the elder out to dry on his own statements!.
wonderful to see the org's little dictators being subjected to their very own personal judicial committee hearing - but in front of millions, and not in secret!.
from 43 minutes onward.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xv8ptogc6k0#t=2607.
-
-
LisaRose
John Amos:It is stated that where the law is to report such matters then the elders abide by and do so and where the law does not require to report such matters they (the elders) do not do so, then the question is asked as to why they (the elders) don’t report these matters when it is not mandatory by the law…my question is why are there places that do not make it mandatory law to report all such cases???
Most places do have such laws at this point in time, but this case isn't about the legal system, but about Jehovah's Witnesses, and this is a discussion board about the Jehovah's Witnesses, not legal system. The Watchtower claims to be directed by God, so the question is why didn't the elders do the right thing and contact the police, even when not required to do so? If an elder was told that someone committed murder should he not contact the police? Common decency and morality should prompt any person to report criminal matters to the authorities. The JWs claim to obey Caesars law, they should have reported it even before the mandated reporting laws took effect.
I am not aware of any case where the WTS/GB/elders are said to be guilty of not reporting such matters in areas where it is mandatory to do so…so in that regard they have a 100% compliance record for reporting these cases to the law when it is mandatory to do so. So why should there not be an equal amount of out rage directed toward states/cities/countries, etc… that do not currently require cases to be reported???
So because you are not aware of it it couldn't have happened? That's laughable. I actually personally know of such cases. In any event, why does there have to be a law to make elders do the right thing? This is supposed to be an organization that is God's sole channel of communication with mankind, so why didn't God direct them here? In addition, the "outrage" is on them because they:
A) Codemned the Catholic church for hiding pedophile priests while pretending to all they didn't have any problem with child sex abuse,( or if they do just a tiny, tiny amount, very few, almost unheard of etc.) All while maintaining a database of 47,000 names of the accused.
B) Forced victims to confront their abusers, or accused them of immorality, or ignored them completely and discouraged victims and families from contacting the authorities.
C) Allowed child rapists to be reinstated into the congregation with no effort made to warn parents that there are pedophiles on the congregation and in many cases even allowed them to be reappointed as elders. Why would a man who raped a child ever be appointed as an elder?
Obviously the commission in Australia is outraged, so the question is not why we are outraged, but why aren't YOU outraged John Amos?
People who say they care about protecting the children but have a ax to grind with the WTS/GB only focus in their crosshairs the WTS/GB/elders when speaking of being responsible for policies for protecting children but where are all the voices and rants condemning states/cities/countries, etc… where cases are not reported due to them not being states/cities/countries, etc…that mandate such???
Again, this is not a legal discussion board. Why does the Watchtower only do the right thing when legally compelled to do so? Why do they treat child rape the same as any other sexual immorality? Why do they think elders, who have little education and no training in sex abuse, are qualified to determine if a child has been abused? If we have an axe to grind it's because we see innocent victims and what this organization has done to people, all while pretending they care about victims and hate child abuse. Their words say one thing, their actions say quite another. It's the lying and hypocrisy that is hard to take, especially from an organization that pretends to be the only true religion.
If that were the case and that were done (mandate all) then based on the WTS/GB/elders record for reporting these cases… then there would be 100% compliance record for reporting these cases across the board.
You are delusional that elders report abuse 100% of the time, they don't. From the many cases I have seen, sometimes they don't believe the child, or know the elder personally and can't believe they would do such a thing, or don't want or are not prepared to deal with it, and so they don't even form a JC, so no record whatsoever. My best friend accused her elder father of molesting her many years before, when she was a child. Not only did they not form a JC, she was threatened with being disfellowshipped herself if she talked about it. Who knows how many cases there are like that? The Watchtower knows good and well these policies aren't working, because they have paid out millions in settlements, but they stubbornly stick to their ridiculous two witness rule, based on one scripture in the bible. They could simply change policy and find another scripture to justify it, like any of their other doctrine flip flops, but they refuse to do so.
You have to ask yourself why that is