Posts by OnTheWayOut

33

Christians Know Who God Is

by Loi_241 in

many of us christians have a good question for you to ask, “who is god?” there are more than six scriptures to share with you.

you know the bible itself a true message for all the people on earth.

the bible explains ‘in the beginning god created everything: heaven, earth, animals, people and everything.’ thus, you notice god created humans, adam and eve.

OnTheWayOut

The Bible explains............God created everything.............. If you are an Atheist or worshipper of false god, then how can you be existed in this planet?

I will let the "false god" slight go, but I really shouldn't.

Anyway, there are many creation stories. And there are even non-creation stories. Yours is just one among many.

I like the one from the philosophy of Jainism. I probably won't ever support Jain because the swastika is so prominent in their symbols, and despite it's pre-Nazi existence, I really don't want people thinking I am a Nazi.

Anyway, Jainism does not support belief in a creator deity. According to Jain doctrine, the universe and its constituents—soul, matter, space, time, and principles of motion—have always existed. All the constituents and actions are governed by universal natural laws. It is not possible to create matter out of nothing and hence the sum total of matter in the universe remains the same (similar to law of conservation of mass). Jain text claims that the universe consists of Jiva (life force or souls) and Ajiva (lifeless objects). Similarly, the soul of each living being is unique and uncreated and has existed since beginningless time.

I could go on and on within your thread (and I may do so later) about the creation myths that are almost as strange, sometimes stranger than the myth from the Bible. But they all have this in common- they either say that something came from nothing or that something always existed without being created- all of them.

Many have outgrown Santa Claus and the tooth fairy and many have outgrown creation myth.

19

I'm a Non-JW looking to ask a few questions re dfing

by RocketQueen in

jw
friends

someone close to me has been brought up as a jw since a very early age.

he's now looking to exit.

he was baptised as a teen and is now early 20s.

OnTheWayOut

He can try to fade away quietly without revealing any violations of Watchtower rules to any JW relatives. It is possible that he may fail to fade away because of a number of things- family spying and turning him in, zealous elders seeking to get rid of him, participation in holidays or elections or whatever.

But he may be successful and keep family from shunning him. Whether he succeeds or fails, he will still be out of that cult and free. Or he may choose not to try to hide things. He's still free.

You just never know. I successfully faded and maintain JW family contact, but my JW family is minimal where most are not JW. I am already married and have no kids, so I don't really have to hide things.

Regardless, he will be free of the cult. If he loses family to shunning, he will need others like yourself involved in his life.

23

Drifting what i've feared has started already...

by pale.emperor in

im in the process of drifting out.

my entire family are jw's.

my wife and her family are too.

OnTheWayOut

You call it drifting away. I like that. Most here have called it fading. They probaby want your time from you to prevent your status from going to "inactive" which happens at 6 months with no recruiting reports.

If you want to drift away, sooner or later you must become inactive. If you aren't ready, give them a fake 1 hour. If you are ready, either accept their shepherding visit or not. They cannot take judicial action for inactivity or for avoiding their counsel.

I wish you well.

27

Divisions among ex jw activists

by Truthexplorer in

i just watched a youtube discussion between marc & cora and unwitness.

it was regarding their unhappiness over a few prominent individuals in the ex jw community, one individual in particular.

this individual who on the one hand produces excellent videos highlighting wt issues, yet has been known to peeve a lot of ex jw activists off.

OnTheWayOut

I don't keep up with the latest spewing out of jw broadcasting, so I don't tend to watch any of the videos. I have liked Cedars' videos and very much liked Marc and Cora's videos for the personal touch on issues.

I might tend toward avoiding Cedars and siding with anyone against him because of past issues of outing on facebook, but really don't care to be involved in any organized efforts.

I would have to agree with those that say to appreciate whichever videos help ya and ignore the rest. I get why people felt a need to speak out about issues in the ex-jw community but I hope they all just move on to their own path. A great example in that would be Barb Anderson who moved on to her own agenda and just stays away from divisive activity.

21

Suppose I ought to introduce myself.....

by Andy Dufresne in

jw
friends

i've left a couple of semi-"humorous" remarks, but not yet said a proper hello....but firstly thank you, to all, for this site and all its comments.i have been lurking on this site for 4-5 years, awake for 5-6 years and seriously fading for the last 4 years.

i am now "out" and widely considered "out" by the congregation but due being very cautious and playing a very long game, (and having a wife who understand the repercussions of blowing the whistle on the few viewpoints i have discussed with her) i have not been df'd of da'd.

this forum has been a crutch and guide as well as helping me wake - and the humour many on here use has been a welcome relief.

OnTheWayOut

Hello Andy.

We have much in common. I faded with no DA/DF actions taken and my wife is an active JW.

I used to get the "Sister Jones said hello, Brother Smith says he misses you" statements from my wife and I would say "They know my phone number hasn't changed, so they could have called." Heck, I waited outside the Kingdom Hall in the parking lot to pick my wife up a few times and the "friends" would see me and turn and pretend they didn't see me, then say at the next meeting to my wife, "Tell OTWO we miss him."

I have also wanted to say things to JW's about TTATT, but you are right- it's not worth risking the relationship you have. It's especially not worth it when those same JW's probably won't listen anyway.

So stick around if it helps. See you around the threads.

103

NEW BLOOD CARD w/ FORCED COMPLIANCE also LEGALISM

by apocalypse in

i have looked around and i don't see this covered, so i am starting a thread.. 1) the new "blood card" goes beyond being just a "blood card".. 2) a new edict concerning compliance.. pay attention to the changes.. first, the new card is termed "advance decision to refuse specified medical treatment".

the big change with the card itself is that it includes an 'override' of your "power of attorney".

this is huge.

OnTheWayOut

There is always a large number of jws in each cong that don't get them filled out. Be one of those... there is only so much the elderdubs will do before they give up.

I must agree with RichardHaley. And if you are in a congregation with elders that pester you until they have a copy, just refuse. Just say, "I will have to run anything by a lawyer before I hand over legal papers to anyone."

If that's not enough deterrent, say "I have everything on file with my lawyer. He advised me not to leave documents with non-medical non-legal people. So everything is good with me."

30

"508 Million Year Old" Exceptionally Preserved Embryos Found

by Perry in

actually, they we found over 100 years ago.

but because so many dinosaur bones have yielded soft tissue, blood cells, dna fragments etc.

, many have predicted (including myself) when all this really broke loose in 2005, that many more similar discoveries would be made simply by going back and cracking open old fossils and having a look inside.

OnTheWayOut

If there was video similar to Geraldo Rivera opening Al Capone's vault, and being embarrassed on live television that it's empty, I might give some high fives to the people who opened up this "fossil" and dipped a stick or dry fountain pen directly into the fossil in order to draw from it.

But that isn't what happened. I am confident that the terms are exaggerated and that the dark pigment used to draw was derived from grinding the dry dark fossil that would have developed from the "ink" and putting it into a new vehicle- some kind of oil.

Perry, I actually worked in a printing ink factory as a lab technician. Anything ground up can be used for color. Black was typically derived from soot in the past.

And considering Perry's sources, I also have no doubt that most things in his articles are misquoted or exaggerated or directly lied about to bolster a creationist agenda and ignore real science.

15

How Corrupt Is WT?

by thedepressedsoul in

how corrupt do you think they are?

if so, in what ways?

i've been compiling my own list and thoughts.

OnTheWayOut

While it may not be asked so directly, it is a huge question for discussion here.

We all have thoughts on whether the men in the governing body are victims or victimizers or both.
My personal thoughts tend toward them adjusting their thinking more in line with the way lawyers sleep at night after getting guilty clients out of prison or the way politicians adjust their thinking toward learning to say almost anything (or nothing) in order to get votes.

They learn to think that the preservation of the organization is way more important than anything else, things like kindness and full disclosure of information. This thinking allows them to manipulate, coerce, and even directly lie.

7

Where Can I find Jehovah's Witnesses and the Problem of Mental Illness Without Paying $100+?

by jacobm in

jw
friends

any cheaper ways of getting a copy?

i won't want to steal.

OnTheWayOut

I know you aren't asking for opinions, but I just can't resist.
Dr. Jerry Bergman is the author of JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES AND THE PROBLEM OF MENTAL ILLNESS.
It does seem to be over $100 at Amazon.

I attended some sessions of BRCI in Illinois and Jerry Bergman spoke at one about how evolution is impossible. Rather than spend a whole thread telling you how much I disagreed with him, and why I wouldn't spend even $20 on a book written by him, this article can demonstrate what's wrong with his thinking:

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Jerry_Bergman

To be fair, it seems that this book was written when Dr. Bergman was an active JW, and there might be other reasons beyond agreeing with him or enjoying his way of thinking that a person might want this book. But it does seem that Jerry has abandoned JW's without examining his deep-seated "Young-Earth-Creationist" beliefs.

Good luck to you.

43

WT Resurrection Hope Absolutely Ridiculous As Illustrated In Their Publications

by JW_Rogue in

saw this while browsing through the good news brochure:.

is it any wonder people aren't listening to jws anymore?

what an absolutely delusional scene!

OnTheWayOut

The hidden subliminal message is that all people who died before the Great Tribulation can have an opportunity to be resurrected and learn "the truth." So you all better stay in "the truth" in case the Great Tribulation comes in your lifetime, and then you can see those loved ones who died already. This message takes on more and more importance as everyone dies "in this system of things" when the Great Tribulation continues to delay.