Posts by AllTimeJeff

87

DOES THE BIBLE really really EXIST?

by Terry in

the bible did not exist in jesus' day nor in the lifespan of his apostles.. people didn't walk around with one (bible) tucked under their arm.. christians didn't carry one (bible) door to door for preaching and teaching.. the closest thing to the bible was the septuigint greek translation of hebrew scriptures which not one person in a 10,000 had ever seen!.

creation of the septuagint (wikipedia article).

...in the third century bce[6].

AllTimeJeff

So XJW4EVR, lets hear it. What do you disagree with from Terry's Wiki reference? Be specific, and tell us how it is factually incorrect.

I expect better from you then to do hit and run ridicule on an essay that is clearly researched and reasoned.

28

My world has come to an end.

by is there help out there in

jw
friends

.

my name is o`mar p. clark.

i was born and raised a jw.

AllTimeJeff

Pass the dutchie to the left hand side....

87

DOES THE BIBLE really really EXIST?

by Terry in

the bible did not exist in jesus' day nor in the lifespan of his apostles.. people didn't walk around with one (bible) tucked under their arm.. christians didn't carry one (bible) door to door for preaching and teaching.. the closest thing to the bible was the septuigint greek translation of hebrew scriptures which not one person in a 10,000 had ever seen!.

creation of the septuagint (wikipedia article).

...in the third century bce[6].

AllTimeJeff

I call bullshit XJW4EVER. Be fair, that is a summation of many different works and history and you know it. Would you dare to pick anything out of that article and dispute it, or do you just take comfort in a hit and run ridicule of the facts?

26

Jehovah's Witnesses - The Religion of "Increased Light"

by AllTimeJeff in

in the april 15 2010 watchtower, this quote stuck out to me like a sore thumb.. "this magazine has .

long been used by "the faithful and discreet slave" .

as the primary channel for dispensing increased .

AllTimeJeff

Stephen, I need to be mindful of singling out the GB, which is what I meant. JW's are the victims of GB dogma.

Paul, if you don't mind a geeky Star Trek reference, I don't want to interfere with your personal search for conclusions. You strike me as someone who will find a way to worship god, whether that be "Jehovah" or another name. That should be organic, and I respect the process.

Having said that, I would be lying to you if I told you that the Governing Body's reasons for having Jehovah in the New Testament is true. Yes, they use it when a NT reference is made to the OT. But, there isn't a single manuscript anywhere that shows YHWH translated in the NT. Not one.

JW's use a bunch of "J" references in the reference bible to back up their insertion of Jehovah in the NT. These aren't manuscripts, but translations from 15th century sects of Jewish Christianity who inserted the name "Jehovah" where it was quoted in the OT. These translators had no basis to do this, other then their personal belief that that tetragrammaton should be there.

I could insist that the name "Jeffrey" be there too. It doesn't make it right or accurate.

The original manuscripts had LORD everywhere. There is no evidence that Jehovah was ever used.

You could look it up.

I don't know what this brief summation will mean to you Paul, but it is the truth. For real. A fact.

385

NEW GENERATION DEFINED -- April 15, 2010 Watchtower

by Ultimate Reality in

from jw.org, here is the new definition of the generation from the april 15, 2010 watchtower.. .

article: holy spirits role in the outworking of jehovahs purpose.

13 third, holy spirit is at work in bringing bible.

AllTimeJeff

The greatest trick the Governing Body has pulled off is getting you to think that questioning them is questioning Jehovah.

Look at that chart on how many times the term "generation" has changed and ask yourself, with all thats riding on it, can they be trusted? There is such a thing as incompetence. Some dictionaries define incompetence as "The Governing Body's attempt to define the word generation".]

Not just incompetent, but irresponsible. They did have another option, another opportunity.

They could have said "You know, by now it is clear, we got the whole damn thing wrong. 1914 was just a big coincidence where WWI started. Thats it. We don't know what a generation is as a religion, as illustrated by the fact we have changed it 4 times in 100 years. We also knows this means that Jesus didn't pick us, which is good, because we really aren't the true religion, a restoration of 1st century Christianity as we like to claim."

No. There is only one reason for them to invest in parsing words, to keep their authority and their flock. Too bad for the flock. Lets hope they notice.

26

Jehovah's Witnesses - The Religion of "Increased Light"

by AllTimeJeff in

in the april 15 2010 watchtower, this quote stuck out to me like a sore thumb.. "this magazine has .

long been used by "the faithful and discreet slave" .

as the primary channel for dispensing increased .

AllTimeJeff

Btw Paul, there is only one religion that insists that the tetragrammaton YHWH is in the New Testament. Jehovah's Witnesses. Why do they do that? They go beyond a translator, all because they insist that God's name is Jehovah.

No other bible has Jehovah/Yahweh even once in the NT. It's an interesting item to research, imo.

26

Jehovah's Witnesses - The Religion of "Increased Light"

by AllTimeJeff in

in the april 15 2010 watchtower, this quote stuck out to me like a sore thumb.. "this magazine has .

long been used by "the faithful and discreet slave" .

as the primary channel for dispensing increased .

AllTimeJeff

Paul, if the basis of your authority is false, then whatever you get right is poisoned in my opinion.

JW's would be ok if they didn't insist on unbending unity without questioning. Religions allow doubt and questions, JW's don't. You can't disagree with JW's and stay one, even if you are right, or it simply is a matter of opinion.

These days, their "increased light" is all about keeping their authority. Always about them, never about you. Too bad.

87

DOES THE BIBLE really really EXIST?

by Terry in

the bible did not exist in jesus' day nor in the lifespan of his apostles.. people didn't walk around with one (bible) tucked under their arm.. christians didn't carry one (bible) door to door for preaching and teaching.. the closest thing to the bible was the septuigint greek translation of hebrew scriptures which not one person in a 10,000 had ever seen!.

creation of the septuagint (wikipedia article).

...in the third century bce[6].

AllTimeJeff

I have no problem with a person wanting to base their personal spiritual identity on the bible. Some use the bible, some use comic books. Both are just as relevant to the person who uses them.

What your treatment Terry speaks to me is the fact that there isn't a great deal of intellectual honesty where the bible is concerned. Most people are aware that this information is out there, yet many, in spite of the great stakes involved, are satisfied with their belief system. Which I think speaks to how powerful a person deciding to believe in something really is.

Most theological students these days learn this at college about the bible. About original manuscripts, etc. When they become ministers in a religion, given supply and demand, most of the audience still don't want to hear about how the bible got to us. They want to hear stories in the bible explained. Until the general populace demands to learn more in a scholarly way from these men and women, they will continue to get legends and old stories turned into morality plays. While I enjoy that myself on occasion in what I read (Lord of the Rings for example) its important to keep in mind that one is reading a book of fiction, even if there is some good points to learn from it.

Yes, I believe most of the bible to be fiction regarding its accounts. I do take 6 books for myself that I consider on occasion: Proverbs, Ecclesaisates, and the 4 Gospels. The rest of it is not worth my time personally.

There has to be a difference between a persons spirituality, and the insistence by some that this spirituality be tied into accepting the bible as the unerring word of god.

Terry, as you so eloquently put it, there never was a bible to consult until several hundred years after Jesus supposedly walked the earth. It's a creation of the Christian religion, not the cause of the Christian religion. A study in the history of the cannon and how it got to us is very illuminating. It may not do a lot for your faith, but it will for your honesty, if you value that above a comfy belief system.

I know that faith keeps a lot of people going. I know that many do misuse it, others don't. But a person can have faith while not dogmatically insisting the bible, with all its weirdness, has it right. A study of the bible's history shows why it is so disjointed in its message in the first place, they are a bunch of indivdual books, strung together by religionists with an agenda. Even if some of the writings do have value, and I believe that some do, in now way justifies a belief that all of it is from god, for us, nor does it excuse in my opinion a person deciding to turn off their brain, and not wanting to consider the evidence. I don't respect that too much.

31

An Apology

by XJW4EVR in

jw
friends

as a christian, i would like to apologize for the stupid and insensitive remarks made by pat robertson.

instead of throwing stones from his ivory tower in virginia, he should have taken a que from the one he claims to follow who when asked about the murders of galileans making their sacrifices by pilate said, "do you think that these galileans were worse sinners than all the other galileans because they suffered this way?

but unless you repent, you too will all perish.

AllTimeJeff

Pat Robertson only talks for himself and his hate filled agenda.

I don't judge Christians at all until they make their way into the political arena. When it comes to Robertson, what Jesus (supposedly) said applies: "By their fruits, you will recognize them."

I can smell rotten fruit a mile away.

73

Where is God when the Haitians needed him?

by AK - Jeff in

perhaps a hundred-thousand dead.

millions affected.. how many prayed in vain to stop the quaking, keep a loved one from dying, or for saftey?

all disregarded, all ignored.. he either doesn't care, is dead, or never was.

AllTimeJeff

Cruel.

I still maintain that there is no powerful god, that we are on our own in many respects.

If a higher power exists, which I do think exists, she doesn't want worship and certainly doesn't have the power to stop bad things from happening.

Planet Earth, for better or for worse, we are on our own.

If a parent left a house full of kids alone, abandoned them, left some handwritten notes for instructions, didn't bother explaining what they meant, and then still insisted that they were the bestest, wisest parent ever, we would arrest them.

There are other things that speak to me that life isn't necesarrily an accident, but that is not the threshold I need to ever worship god again.

May Haiti have peace in their time of need.