Posts by AllTimeJeff

28

THEY act like the ones who are hurt??!!

by stuckinarut2 in

it really amazes me when jws act like we are hurting them!.

many of us have found that if we stop associating with them for valid reasons, they act all upset and hurt that we would be "so cruel as to limit our association or cut them off".

i know of friends here on the forum who have been told by parents that they "will shun them if they leave jehovah" , and yet when the shoe is on the other foot and our awake friends shun them first, the parents cry and bemoan the situation and say how "cruel it is to deprive them of their company".

AllTimeJeff

It's a cult. We aren't the first, we won't be the last. It's human nature that fringe groups will attract fringe people, to catch, condition, and release us like fish.

I was a born in, so it wasn't my choice to be here, but it was my choice to leave. They took everything I had before though. And yeah, I probably "hurt" them. And to that, I offer a hearty "F**k that S**t" Since I lost my entire family, I know the real truth. They took them from me.

It doesn't matter how they frame it, we know TTATT. That will have to be good enough.

Threads like this make me sad for us all, but I refuse to lay down and die. I don't want anyone who is reading this to give into the bullshit. I love lyrics, always have. (not JW bullshit songs, real stuff). I always liked Billy Joel simply because he fought. So I leave you with "It's All About Soul" Work with the meaning and understand that WE can set our own rules. Have some heart.

This life isn't fair
It's gonna get dark, it's gonna get cold
You've got to be tough, but that ain't enough
It's all about soul

There are people who have lost every trace of human kindness
There are many who have fallen, there are some who still survive

43

Did You Ever Luke ANY Songs From The “Songbook “?

by minimus in

jw
friends

i went on line looking for old jw songs and some of them were pretty good and some were just awful!.

did you ever like any of those songs?

.

AllTimeJeff

When I was very young, "We Thank You JeWhatever" was a favorite. I tried. Frankly, my memories now of those songs involve my ex-wife stepping in beat while she sang at conventions. smh

Needless to say, these songs were propaganda set to very bad music and sang by the delusionally groomed.

49

"You owe Jehovah humility and HONESTY" - an email from a JW

by Wake Me Up Before You Jo-Ho in

hey forum goers.

i'd like your opinions on constructing an email reply to this shocker below.

bit of background about the sender: she is a middle-aged, cheery uberdub whose siblings left when a schism occured in her congregation in canada way back when.

AllTimeJeff

Hey there. Not knowing if you're committed to the fade or not, here's my two cents...

I know plenty of "dig in the heels" type. In car groups, they talk as if YHWH told them to be frank and tell it like it is to you "spiritually weak" kinds... Shake you up, you know?

I think any kind of response is inviting more responses from her. I wouldn't even mess with it. Don't give her anything to one day testify against you with either. Anything less than "I know this is the truth, I believe it 100%, just going through a tough time right now" won't satisfy her at all I bet.

Her reward, whether she has awareness of this or not, is the self righteous high she gets for being right with YHWH, the congregation, and generall, "da troof". It gives purpose to her life. Sometimes, a response will cause her to gravitate your way more. If you're ok with that, respond.

If you are planning to blow up the bridge as I did, tell her whatever you need. But if you are in the middle of playing the game, play this part well.

23

Are You Proud of Your Country?

by snugglebunny in

jw
friends

some people are of the opinion that it doesn't make any sense to be proud of one's nationality because we had nothing to do with where we were born.

the decision wasn't ours.

they opine that it's ludicrous to be proud of our countries' prior achievements if we had no part in those achievements because we weren't even around then.

AllTimeJeff

You can love your country like a little child loves its parents: They can do no wrong.

Or, you can love your country like a grown up, recognizing it's flaws and working to correct them.

Or, you can change your country. In the United States (for the sake of over generalization) there are two main groups, conservative and liberal, fighting for change according to their respective political philosophies. Obviously, there are many shades of gray in that spectrum.

For my part, my JW experience made it very difficult for me to love any group. I value being my own person and thinking for myself. Group think makes me sick. Yet, we thrive when there is genuine teamwork and mission that we can agree to. For me, it is honestly sort of sad to contemplate.

I don't like it when "love of country" and "patriotism" equals persecution, marginalization of minority groups, and the taking away of rights of others.

50

You Know You're Starting To Wake Up When...

by pale.emperor in

you start listening to music deemed "unsuitable for christians".

you pretend to knock on the doors.

you explain a jw teaching to someone and realize how ridiculous it sounds.

AllTimeJeff

My List Part 2 After Gilead as I was planning on leaving

When you realize your wife really does love the Borg more than you, and that her indoctrination is more then can be overcome. And so you get your heart broken again, but you move on anyway

When you read CoC for the first time, and it rings so true so as to leave no doubt that you must leave this cult

When you try to tell yourself its a cult, but its a bit too much at first, so you simply say to yourself you belong to a "high control group"

Later on, you admit that it really is a cult

When you go to a bookstore for their Wifi so you can visit a few websites like this

When you knock on a door and simply say "I am a JW, but I'd really like to listen to what you think." And then you listen

When you pretend to fall and hit your head on the kitchen counter and pretend your dizzy because you are so desperate not to go to a meeting

When you leave your resignation letter and "Dear John" letter on the table at the same time and start life over

PS: For those who know Bethel, the letter was on one side of one piece of paper. Just how they like it.... ;)

50

You Know You're Starting To Wake Up When...

by pale.emperor in

you start listening to music deemed "unsuitable for christians".

you pretend to knock on the doors.

you explain a jw teaching to someone and realize how ridiculous it sounds.

AllTimeJeff

My list when I left

When you realize that Elijah and Elisha are not Rutherford and Knorr respectively, but instead are two old dudes alleged to be prophets by YHWH.

When you look behind you at Gilead and everyone is shaking their head up and down like "Yeah! Elijah really did foreshadow Rutherford and Elisha Knorr! Why didn't I see it before?!"

And when you suddenly admit say it to yourself in Gilead "This isn't the truth." Just like that. And you die a little inside.

When you see first hand that the WTB&T$ is all about the American Dollar.

When before you go to your foreign assignment, you have to sign a disclaimer allowing them to throw you out of the missionary home with no way of getting to your home country for "sins".

When you have to calm down a bitter old elder who wants to investigate a congregation member because they didn't talk very nicely to their relatives.

When you you're not supposed to call the police on pedophiles, unless you do so anonymously.

When on the day before you leave your resignation letter, you pray to whomever is up there, and ask that somehow they take care of the good people, and that they are shown some love somehow.

12

Song: The Life Of A Pioneer

by pale.emperor in

jw
friends

it struck me today how the lyrics to kingdom song 81 "the life of a pioneer" sound almost like a slave song from a plantation or something.

what's also sad is, if you read, you'll notice that they sound not only like slaves, but slaves that are admittedly tired and worn out yet grateful to serve their governing body overseers master to prove their devotion to him.. very sad indeed..

at the start of the day, with the sun yet to rise,.

AllTimeJeff

Wait, What??

I left in '06. This is a real song?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!

Ok, thanks for the laughs. Can't wait for this little diddy to be nominated for a Grammy....

This was specifically written for pioneer meetings. I can't imagine what the music arrangements are like. (disclaimer: I am NOT asking for the music to be posted.) So glad to be out of this sickness... This coming from a 12 year pioneer before I left.

24

Why do Jehovah's Witnesses always answer questions through the bible?

by MarieChii in

hi.. recently i've been researching jehovah's witnesses and their beliefs and found out that they don't believe in blood transfusions.

so, i've asked one of my friends who is a jw as to what is the reason for this, and so far, they had always directed me to a bible verse that is in their bible.. clearly, i wasn't getting anywhere and so far, it's pretty much frustrating to even make my friend give me reasonable reason.

when i was getting somewhere, even a smidgen, they would answer with a question.

AllTimeJeff

@Mariechii

Apologies for my comments. This is your topic you started, so I will stay on topic...

I think you are on to something when you noted "When I was getting somewhere, even a smidgen, they would answer with a question. So you can get why I'm getting a little frustrated."

My comments are, don't look for logic where it doesn't exist, and don't use logic where it is not welcome or useful.

Most reasonable people know that JW's are just a little off. (ok, a lot off) JW's dodge questions when their initial answer isn't accepted. In other words, they are shallow. They are taught and trained to go two levels deep, if you will. Even when there are many more levels.

Elders are taught to give up at a certain point when talking to potential "apostates". They know that if the argument gets too deep, they'll be discredited. So there is a bit of a poison pill built into how far JW's will try to win. If you continue to go further and educate them, it is likely you will be rebuffed.

Sometimes, you can plant seeds of real truth (ironic, since that is what JW's claim they do all the time) but it takes a while. There is no immediate satisfaction in arguing or debating with a JW, because you are dealing with insidious indoctrination that frankly takes months or years to get over. Few ever do.

24

Why do Jehovah's Witnesses always answer questions through the bible?

by MarieChii in

hi.. recently i've been researching jehovah's witnesses and their beliefs and found out that they don't believe in blood transfusions.

so, i've asked one of my friends who is a jw as to what is the reason for this, and so far, they had always directed me to a bible verse that is in their bible.. clearly, i wasn't getting anywhere and so far, it's pretty much frustrating to even make my friend give me reasonable reason.

when i was getting somewhere, even a smidgen, they would answer with a question.

AllTimeJeff

An observation:

Academics vs non-academics on occasion will come to roughly the same conclusion in some matters. Such is the case with JW's.

JW's, and especially their ruling GB, must be judged against their current and historical claims.Both those who use to be JW's (or "disaffected members", likely those who are shunned for the simple act of disagreement I imagine) or "anti cult activists" (those who correctly point out the dead from those who weren't really able to take blood medicine and still keep an active status within JW's, or perhaps those who have been molested by cult leaders) often provide real time and real life experiences into what the day to day is like.

Though not scholarly, I would politely disagree with vienne's comment above about how "misleading" such source information is. While vienne is well within his rights to point out how outliers like "six screens of WT" will latch on to ANY story, regardless of veracity, to discredit JW's, most who leave and blog simply tell their story. Like a puzzle, piece them together, and most reasonable people will see a picture come together. That picture of course, is that JW's are a cult....

A scholarly study is just that. An examination of writings, dogma, and changes through the years. That too disproves JW/WT/GB teachings, unless you have been inoculated from these changes by buying into "new light" and all that goes with it.

My comments are motivated by vienne's closing statement: "Approaching the study of any religion though the work of disaffected members or anti cult activists will mislead you." This is as false as claiming that a study of the Nixon presidency via the claims of John Dean was void because he was once a member of the Nixon administration. Far from it, his first hand accounts laid bare the true nature of the beast. So it is with former JW's and the light they hold up against the former cult they belonged to and their ruling, idiotic, despotic, governing body.

133

What Is The Most Ridiculous Thing You Have Heard From A Witness?

by minimus in

jw
friends

i remember an elder questioning a woman who had admitted to giving and receiving oral sex from her unbelieving mate.

he asked her the most intimate questions which clearly flustered her.

interestingly, she “confessed “ to the elders because her conscience bothered her.

AllTimeJeff

My personal watershed moment will always be at Gilead when discussing the first chapters of 2Kings. Rutherford = Elijah and Knorr = Elisha. That was it for me. The bird flew in and out of the clock and I checked out right there.