Lets face it, for Perry, it is a great sell to former JW's if he can convince you that JW's and atheists are alike. To which I say...
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Ok, I had to get that out.
AllTimeJeff
JoinedPosts by AllTimeJeff
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322
God and Suffering
by AK - Jeff ina few weeks back, in the midst of the haiti tragedy, much discussion took place in cyberland about the tolerance [or indeed the insistence on] suffering by a loving god.
the furor over haiti has settled a bit [as unfortunately most tragedy is wont to do far too quickly in the human mind], but this persistent matter continues to chew at my subconscience.
today i came across this:.
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55
New BOE letter on inactive ones
by JWFreak inagain..please do not ask for a pdf scan as the only copies i have are the interbranch electronic copies from the us branch to our local branch.. .
november 3, 2009 .
to all bodies of elders .
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AllTimeJeff
Blondie, you beat me to it on your quotes there....
My overriding thought for all of this is simple, everything is purposely vague to give the elders and esp, the Service Dept an out whenever they might need it. This is illustrated by this comment that you have...
ks 100 par 5: "If the individual still professes to be a Witness and is willing to meet with the judicial committee, the matter should be handled in the normal way. However, when factors such as possible legal actioin exist, it is best to consult the Society before proceeding. (w87 9/1 p 14)"
In other words, they will consider calling off a JC if legal retalliation is possible, although not in all cases. It depends....
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92
To All Our Canadian Friends
by AllTimeJeff inwhen you are done watching the opening ceremonies, come in and say hi.. hey outlaw, they are doing the prarie tribute as i write this.
hope you like joni mitchell.... ;).
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AllTimeJeff
We are just watching our DVR. So far, all the ski jumpers suck.
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55
New BOE letter on inactive ones
by JWFreak inagain..please do not ask for a pdf scan as the only copies i have are the interbranch electronic copies from the us branch to our local branch.. .
november 3, 2009 .
to all bodies of elders .
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AllTimeJeff
Ok, first of all, I think many of us know that these "guidelines" elders follow vary from local area and congregation. Having said that, here are procedures from the ks91. Remember, any reference to the PO is now the COBOE.
k91 pg 97 pars 3-7
A judicial committee is not automatically formed even when a person is accused of serious sin
Some matters may be handled by the elder who hears of the wrondoing. (Gal 6:1)
Although you may feel that your counsel will suffice to restore the individual, it is advisable to inform the presiding overseer of the matter; there may be other factors involved.
The matter may have come up before, or there may have been other acts of wrongdoing concerning which he has knowledge.
Some matters may be investigated and handled by two elders assigned by the body of elders.
Some comments on the above: First of all, the PO's first and foremost responsibility is the administration of the judicial machinary that the GB has in place. Everything goes through him. In all cases, before the body of elders is informed, the PO will assign two elders of his choosing to investigate a matter, and report back to him. The PO has discretion to consider the matter handled or to bring the matter to the entire body.
Even if the entire body is called to hear the evidence, the PO can (and has) argued against the forming of JC's even in the cases of serious sin, depnding on the length of time and practice of it, or if it was one occurrence, can affect a decision to form a JC.
I know of at least 3 cases of fornication that were single occurrence, over a decade past, that were handled by the two elders assigned by the PO. In each of these cases, the elders were informed, but that was it, no judicial sanction was given.
Having said that, it really matters most who the elders are, who the PO is, etc. But there are cases where the PO can pretty much squelch a committee from forming.
The PO does have discretion to not bring up certain cases of wrongdoing to the body of elders and keep the facts to himself, if he so chooses.
This is probably a semantics issue, agreed...
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322
God and Suffering
by AK - Jeff ina few weeks back, in the midst of the haiti tragedy, much discussion took place in cyberland about the tolerance [or indeed the insistence on] suffering by a loving god.
the furor over haiti has settled a bit [as unfortunately most tragedy is wont to do far too quickly in the human mind], but this persistent matter continues to chew at my subconscience.
today i came across this:.
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AllTimeJeff
Ok, this is too easy, someone else handle this...
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92
To All Our Canadian Friends
by AllTimeJeff inwhen you are done watching the opening ceremonies, come in and say hi.. hey outlaw, they are doing the prarie tribute as i write this.
hope you like joni mitchell.... ;).
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AllTimeJeff
The Spaghetti Westerns of Clint Eastwood has launched many an alcoholics career.....
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55
New BOE letter on inactive ones
by JWFreak inagain..please do not ask for a pdf scan as the only copies i have are the interbranch electronic copies from the us branch to our local branch.. .
november 3, 2009 .
to all bodies of elders .
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AllTimeJeff
Blondie
I will get my ks91 (elders) book out and type this out so there is no confusion.
Wait, I just said no confusion and JW's in the same sentence. Sorry... lol.. Give me a minute...
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92
To All Our Canadian Friends
by AllTimeJeff inwhen you are done watching the opening ceremonies, come in and say hi.. hey outlaw, they are doing the prarie tribute as i write this.
hope you like joni mitchell.... ;).
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55
New BOE letter on inactive ones
by JWFreak inagain..please do not ask for a pdf scan as the only copies i have are the interbranch electronic copies from the us branch to our local branch.. .
november 3, 2009 .
to all bodies of elders .
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AllTimeJeff
Blondie
The COBOE (formerly the PO) has the discretion, if 2 elders he assigns discover wrongdoing on the part of a long time inactive publisher, to determine whether or not it needs to be handled judicially. Ditto for an active publisher who sinned a long time ago. The CO will discuss these cases with the PO, but usually, the CO won't get too involved unless something crazy went wrong....
Obviously, the long time inactive person would probably be more scrutinized, but I know of cases where nothing was done because of the length of time that had lapsed since the "sin".
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322
God and Suffering
by AK - Jeff ina few weeks back, in the midst of the haiti tragedy, much discussion took place in cyberland about the tolerance [or indeed the insistence on] suffering by a loving god.
the furor over haiti has settled a bit [as unfortunately most tragedy is wont to do far too quickly in the human mind], but this persistent matter continues to chew at my subconscience.
today i came across this:.
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AllTimeJeff
Happy Guy imo has hit on 2 very important points that aren't easily explained away. (hope you don't mind my agreement... ;)
God can't get out of his own way when it comes to his negligence regarding Eve in particular. That and the fact that the punishment didn't fit the crime (Don't eat from my tree, even if a talking snake tells you to, or I will kill YOU and all your CHILDREN!)
Again, the most logical explanation of course is that the Genesis account is total fiction, from the creative days to the talking snakes to the way too easily pissed off YHWH, to the flood... Everything seems, you know, exaggerated a teeny weenie bit?
