Posts by AllTimeJeff

39

Tell me why MY VIEW of Christianity is wrong

by Terry in

i sometimes think the standard christian view of things is this.. mankind, like the people in new orleans after hurricane katrina, are stranded waiting on aid and god flys over and sees them on the roof waving and holding up signs, but, he can't really do as much as he would like to.. he has some stopgap aid here and there for a few, but, mostly everybody just has to do the best they can to hang on.. like federal aid or the national guard---jesus is coming!

hang on!

jesus is coming!.

AllTimeJeff

I think Christianity is a bit overstated in what it can do.

I prefer for example, PSac views, simply because they allow for other people's beliefs. Also, he has a belief that I would agree with were I a Christian, that not all "gods" are for all people.

However, it can't be denied that even if God is real to you, he isn't real to others, nor can he be pointed to in any kind of tanglible, real way. No theist should think that somehow, because God is real to them, that should make him real to others

BTS, correct me if I am wrong, but in your last post, it sounds more to me like you are talking about the value of faith. Thats different. I think people with a spiritual need and pursue that with worship are alright with me, so long as they can maintain some semblance of intellectual honesty.

It would be VERY nice to hear more of PSac's sentiments, which if I understand him correctly, says. "I believe in god. I can't prove what I believe. My faith is strong and important to me, and that's good enough for me. At the same time, I understand why others don't believe, and I can't give them answers to their questions, although it is my hope that they will be at peace however they choose to answer the god question for themselves."

I might be high on that one, but it'd be nice.

In short (sorry for the rant there) to Terry's point, the lack of agreement even among Christians to me demonstrates that Christianity is a good fit as a personal philosophy, a bad fit for a religion that makes the claims it does. (i.e. the truth for all, the key to eternal salvation...)

322

God and Suffering

by AK - Jeff in

a few weeks back, in the midst of the haiti tragedy, much discussion took place in cyberland about the tolerance [or indeed the insistence on] suffering by a loving god.

the furor over haiti has settled a bit [as unfortunately most tragedy is wont to do far too quickly in the human mind], but this persistent matter continues to chew at my subconscience.

today i came across this:.

AllTimeJeff

So if not the biblical explanation about us being by nature...his enemies, What?

You mean, there isn't another explanation. This is very arrogant of you. Religiously, there are 6 billion people on earth with different explanations, based on the religious traditions. These billions would be offended that you haven't considered their texts or reasons. You are being self righteous again Perry.

Either God is good; or, we are good. That's really what it comes down to.

No way in hell is this correct. Having said that, I have seen evidence of man being good, not god.

Either God doesn't exist and matter appeared out of nothing, or we aren't good. We have zero evidence for the former and mountains of evidence for the latter to those willing to look at it.

I don't rule out a first cause, but that hardly reveals love and concern or personality. My house was made by a builder who doesn't even know me or my sufferings. So what? Even if you want to assume creation doesn't mean that it explains suffering. You are being self righteous again Perry.

Perry, your belief in god, as powerful as that is in your life, doesn't explain suffering. For that matter, God isn't explaining suffering anyway right now. YOU are Perry, DD, and others who are trying to say the following:

"Yes, God cares about you and the worlds suffering. Prove it? Ok, look here at this bible text. No? It's too old and scattershot with odd thoughts? Written by men? Ok, look, we are created beings, as evidenced by the universe having a common beginning. That is proof that God cares about sufferiing. How? Because that prove God exists. Does God existing mean's he cares? Ok, look here at this bible text. No? It's too old and scattershot with odd thoughts? Written by men? Ok, look, we are created beings, as evidenced by the universe having a common beginning. That is proof that God cares about sufferiing. How? Because that prove God exists. Does God existing mean's he cares? Ok, look here at this bible text. No? It's too old and scattershot with odd thoughts? Written by men? Ok, look, we are created beings, as evidenced by the universe having a common beginning. That is proof that God cares about sufferiing. How? Because that prove God exists. Does God existing mean's he cares?Ok, look here at this bible text. No? It's too old and scattershot with odd thoughts? Written by men? Ok, look, we are created beings, as evidenced by the universe having a common beginning. That is proof that God cares about sufferiing. How? Because that prove God exists. Does God existing mean's he cares?"

Let me know when you all stop chasing your tail around.

38

Are JWs attracting more and more off-center people?

by undercover in

jw
friends

this thread is prompted by the thread about a jw woman who disprupted a funeral.

i don't know the details as i can't view youtube from work, but it did get me to thinking.... over the last couple of decades, at least, i've noticed that more and more 'fringe personalities', for a lack of a better term, have infiltrated the ranks of the everyday jws.

true, jws are themselves a fringe element to normal society, but even within their own communities, there used to be a sense of normalcy, or at least seemed to be.. has the cultic message of the wt society started attracting people with different thought processes over this time period?

AllTimeJeff

I think an overall liberalization of the world and religious views have affected all religions, and because of this, it has affected JW's.

It was my observation that JW's were somewhat adept at getting the zealous fringe people from other religions up through some point in the 1980's, with some ebb and flow in between. These people went from passionately caring about their old religion to passionately caring about JW dogma and all the "organized" activities of JW's...

This is just a newly formed thought for me, but it seems reasonable as a working theory to postulate that as overall religious zeal has ebbed since the 1990's, that the ratio of zealous JW converts has dropped. Thus, the only really zealous converts would have to be, by process of elimination, just a bit high strung, unstable, irrational, needing to do and believe in something no matter what.

Enter Jehovah's Witnesses, the religion of no matter what.

Yeah, as a general answer, JW's rarely convert what most people would consider as normal or stable people.

86

Favorite catch phrases from movies, the ones you actually use.

by John Doe in

jw
friends

the old wierd guy on "princess bride" who says "have fun storming the castle!

" i've used that line more than once.

.

AllTimeJeff

I wish I could quote scripture like Samuel L Jackson did in Pulp Fiction, passionate, soaring oratory, and being able to aim a gun at anyone who pissed me off while I was quoting the good book... (I am in a mood tonight.... lol)

20

Bethel snobs tell me off for wearing Rebooks and polo shirt to Bethel! Next time I'm going Nude!

by Witness 007 in

2007 so we go on holidays and my wife decided to visit bethel.....i wasn't even planning to go to the meetings, so i put on running shoes, blue slacks, and a light blue polo shirt....clean shaven....to a "worldly" person i would look neat and tidy....a bit of a nerd even!

to bethelites i looked like a slob giving the finger to jehovah!

one bethelite girl asked my wife if we were "newly interested.

AllTimeJeff

Tom was never the same after Splash... No wonder he accepted a bible study. Mermaids will kill ya!

Next time, where a shirt and tie, and super glue some extra large nipples to the inside of the shirt. If anyone asks, tell them you're lactating.... It should have the awesome, intended side affect of causing unwanted sexual arousal for many of the bethelites, and they honestly won't be able to figure out why....

20

Update: Mrs. Chickennest's cancer

by Thechickennest in

jw
friends

my dear wife has undergone three rounds of chemotherapy as an inpatient at the mayo clinic in the past two months.

we are returning to minnesota/mayo clinic this saturday.

she will begin seven weeks of chemotherapy/radiation.

AllTimeJeff

33

The TRUTH will spread like wildfire!!

by EndofMysteries in

i'm pretty shocked and excited right now.

first i want to say i am not disclosing any details at this time, but i think i have good news for those wondering when the truth and blind will awake.

most of us know what happens when talking to family, friends, anyone whos a jw, it's an instant mental block.

AllTimeJeff

Ah man! I missed some fun today I see. Damn job.....

My fear at the moment is that this is one of the only solid bright truths which are undisputable that I've got,

Thats what I'm afraid of too...

It's so undisputable, once the truth of it is revealed, that it DESTROYS the entire revelation book climax at hand, and almost all last days interpretations. Since they are all separate individual interpretations.

You mean, the Revelation Climaxed book has yet to be proven wrong, and we were waiting... for you? "Almost" all of the interpretations are wrong? Which one did they get right?

Oh well. EOM, you do know that you aren't the only one who tries to intepret Rev... *sigh* Go ahead, maybe its better then torturing kittens for you. Sounds like a nice hobby....

Since we sin due to imperfection, God if you have faith will overlook your IMPERFECTION, if you GO BEYOND sinning because you think you have a free ticket, then your ABUSING it. He will read your heart for why you do what you do.

Oh, uh, didn't know this. Will try to stop abusing myself by going beyond the Revelation Climaxed book. (there was nearly a joke in there somewhere...)

79

Finished Ex-Jehovah's Witness Survey (Please fill out for help with project)...

by Tuesday in

jw
friends

hey everyone!.

) did you feel the religion was a cult before leaving?:.

) do you feel the religion is a cult now after leaving?:.

AllTimeJeff

A.) Name: (First name only please) Jeff

B.) Gender

Male

C.) Age:

31-35

1.) How were you introduced to Jehovah's Witnesses:

Parents/Grandparents/Relatives were in before you were born and taught you

2.) How did you leave the religion:

Disassociated (I call it resignation, they can call it whatever they want)

3.) What Age did you leave?

31-35

4.) Were you Baptized

Yes

5.) What General reason did you leave the religion: (both reasons here are primary reasons for me)

Didn’t believe the teachings, not allowed to question the teachings, disagreed with stance on social issues, didn’t agree with things said in the magazines or on the platform.

Felt the elders or organization abused their power, felt they took presidence over God, Problem with the way they organized the religion

6.) How did you feel about the doctrine before leaving:

Believed there were more things right than wrong

7.) Did your feelings about the doctrine effect the way you left?

Yes

8.) If you were disfellowshipped for sin, did your feelings on the doctrine effect you sinning in the first place?

N/A

9.) Did you feel the religion was a cult before leaving?:

I saw a few similarities between the religion and a cult

10.) Did you research the religion's teachings after leaving?

Yes

11.) What are your feelings on the doctrine of the religion since leaving? (all 3, pick one if you need only one)

The religion has a problem with nearly every teaching

They might have one or two teachings that are still right if I strain hard enough to think about it

They are totally wrong

12.) How do you feel about the organization since leaving?:

There are many problems which far outweigh the good

They are Totally wrong

13.) How do you feel about the people since leaving?:

They have more good people than bad people

They are no different than any other religion, they have good and bad

They are misguided people and I feel sorry for them

14.) Do you feel the religion is a cult now after leaving?:

Yes they are definitely a cult

15.) What is your opinion on the intelligence of those still in the Organization? :

They're somewhat intelligent

They're intelligent but purposely deny facts for their religion

16.) Are you happier now that you’re gone?

I think every day about how happy I am to have left

I think I’m somewhat happier now that I’m gone

17.) Do you feel that other than the fact you left the Jehovah’s Witnesses that they would agree with how you live your life?

I do quite a few things they would not agree with

18.) If a Jehovah’s Witness approaches you to discuss their religion you’re more than likely do the following:

Tell them I was raised a Jehovah’s Witness and feel they’re wrong

Discuss in detail all the wrong things in their religion

Discuss their religion with them and take whatever they want to place, I remember being like that

19.) Would you consider returning?

When hell freezes over

20.) How do you feel about discussing your time as a Jehovah's Witness?:

It's part of me I'll discuss it if it comes up

I bring it up occasionally

I’ll only talk about it with certain people who understand the circumstances

Questions:

86

Favorite catch phrases from movies, the ones you actually use.

by John Doe in

jw
friends

the old wierd guy on "princess bride" who says "have fun storming the castle!

" i've used that line more than once.

.

AllTimeJeff

"keep your friends close, and your enemies closer"

"I'll be your huckleberry"

31

Canada Finall Wins Gold!

by shamus100 in

jw
friends

and why do we all get excited over it?

we're a smaller country, and we've been skunked every time getting a gold when the olympics have been here.

wahoo!

AllTimeJeff

They can't trade Ignalia. They won't.

Oh wait, Edmonton traded Gretzky. Never mind. (well, they did keep Messier...)

I loooove me some hockey!