Posts by WhatSexRU

24

Affirmative arguments for the non-existence of Jesus

by WhatSexRU in

i was just reading a thread on this forum called saviors of the world?.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/10/136105/1.ashx.

that thread discussed similarities between the various saviors, or messiahs that are said to have walked the earth, most of them appearing long before jesus supposedly emerged.

WhatSexRU

Imo, the most striking part of that article is this section:

Virtually every detail of the life of Jesus comes from Old Testament scriptures

I know that Leolaia and Narkissos have talked about this a lot.

In Critical Thinking there is a postulate called Occam's Razor:

One should not increase, beyond what is necessary, the number of entities required to explain anything.

It seems to me that if an actual man named Jesus existed that he would just interfere with the development of the stories we have now.

24

Affirmative arguments for the non-existence of Jesus

by WhatSexRU in

i was just reading a thread on this forum called saviors of the world?.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/10/136105/1.ashx.

that thread discussed similarities between the various saviors, or messiahs that are said to have walked the earth, most of them appearing long before jesus supposedly emerged.

Zeroday,

At this point I think you’re probably right. But your answer is boring, and that isn’t the type of comment I was looking for. I enjoy learning about this stuff and like to support my opinions with facts.

Here’s that link again:

http://www.rationalrevolution.net/articles/jesus_myth_history.htm#3

Look at they way he is presenting his arguments.

Don’t you wish you could do that?

31

Saviours of the world?

by fullofdoubtnow in

i just read this really interesting article about similarities between the various saviours, or messiahs that are said to have walked the earth, most of them appearing long before jesus supposedly emerged.

http://www.gardinersworld.com/content/view/164/1/.

i don't personally believe that jesus was the son of god, or that he came to die for all mankind, but i kind of believe he may have been a historical figure with a certain amount of charisma, an ancient version of modern-day cult leaders like jim jones and david koresh.

WhatSexRU

Hey Leolaia,

Thanks for the link.

http://www.thedevineevidence.com/jesus_similarities.html

I noticed this:

An important difference between Jesus and the other figures in this article is the existence of verifiable facts surrounding Jesus' life: we know the approximate year of His birth and death, numerous records exist which verify His existence …

Is this really true? I always thought there was a ten-year gap between the death of Herod and the census of Quirinius. But maybe I’ve just been reading a lot of Internet trash. However, I did notice that the author didn’t bring any facts to support that part of his claim.

Fyi, this has motivated me to start thread called “Affirmative arguments for the non-existence of Jesus” where we can discuss it.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/10/136735/1.ashx

24

Affirmative arguments for the non-existence of Jesus

by WhatSexRU in

i was just reading a thread on this forum called saviors of the world?.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/10/136105/1.ashx.

that thread discussed similarities between the various saviors, or messiahs that are said to have walked the earth, most of them appearing long before jesus supposedly emerged.

WhatSexRU

Hi everyone. I was just reading a thread on this forum called “Saviors of the world?”

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/10/136105/1.ashx

That thread discussed similarities between the various saviors, or messiahs that are said to have walked the earth, most of them appearing long before Jesus supposedly emerged. Fwiw, I tend to agree with Leolaia and Narkissos that those claims are exaggerated.

In this thread I would like to solicit comments and opinions concerning the claims that Jesus never existed at all. Not even a ‘regular guy.’ Below is a link to an article by someone named R.G. Price. This article is representative of the types of arguments that are being made:

http://www.rationalrevolution.net/articles/jesus_myth_history.htm#3

I'm no expert on any of this stuff but to me that article seems very, very, convincing.

Any comments?

31

New Testament support for the name Yahweh?

by WhatSexRU in

excuse me if this has been discussed before but im looking for evidence that any of the nt authors knew that the name yahweh (yahveh, jehovah, yhwh, or any variation) existed.

im testing a naive hypothesis that says that the nt authors were reading from the lxx and that they only saw kurios.

keep in mind im a complete novice and a (friendly) dangerous idiot.

WhatSexRU

Thanks Narkissos. You understood me. This is incredible!

What are your thoughts on the on “the Power” in Mark 14:62?

Did “Jesus” say the divine name YHWH?

Is this why he was guilty of blasphemy?

Or was he guilty of blasphemy for some other reason?

Do you see where I am going with this?

Were the authors of the NT aware of the name YHWH and did they think it was blasphemy to say it?

Or,

Was “Jesus” guilty of blasphemy because he claimed to be “the anointed one” (or something similar)?

31

New Testament support for the name Yahweh?

by WhatSexRU in

excuse me if this has been discussed before but im looking for evidence that any of the nt authors knew that the name yahweh (yahveh, jehovah, yhwh, or any variation) existed.

im testing a naive hypothesis that says that the nt authors were reading from the lxx and that they only saw kurios.

keep in mind im a complete novice and a (friendly) dangerous idiot.

WhatSexRU

No, I think that is very remote. The Canaanite/Israelite figure of El may indeed lie behind the Danielic and Enochic "Ancient of Days"/"Head of Days" (and the Enochic concept is clearly anticipatory of the Son of Man language in Mark 14:62 ), but nowhere is this figure called El in late Second Temple writings, nor would 'ly in Psalm 22 have been interpretable as "my El" imho.

I think you’re probably right but I wanted to bounce it around to elicit any comments. You never know what might fall out when you shake a tree.

What are your thoughts on “the Power” in Mark 14:62? Is this just a placeholder for the divine name YHWH?

Where did that expression come from? Is it used anywhere else?

What did it mean to commit blasphemy in Mark 14? Did Jesus need to drop 'the name' or would claiming to be 'the anointed one' suffice?

Kothar sitting at the right hand of Baal??? Where in the world does this come from?

From Ugaritic mythology. Ditto the footstool.

Baal is also not in Psalm 110 ; the word for "lord" in v. 5 is 'dny "my lord", i.e. not involving b`l "lord/master" I know.

Sorry. I wanted to talk about the similarities between Ugaritic mythology and Psalm 110, but I tried to go too fast and it came out weird.

Most folks think that Mark 14:62 is an allusion to Daniel 7 AND Psalm 110. But I’m a weirdo and I’m wondering if Psalm 110 is really necessary. Could the "sitting at the right hand" stuff have come from somewhere else?

This all ties into the issue of if any of the authors of the NT knew about the name YHWH because AFAIK the episode “Jesus vs. Sanhedrin” is the only place that comes close. Am I making any sense?

BTW Michael Heiser wrote a rebuttal to Mark S. Smith’s take on Deut 32:8~9 and Psalm 82. Have you read it?

31

New Testament support for the name Yahweh?

by WhatSexRU in

excuse me if this has been discussed before but im looking for evidence that any of the nt authors knew that the name yahweh (yahveh, jehovah, yhwh, or any variation) existed.

im testing a naive hypothesis that says that the nt authors were reading from the lxx and that they only saw kurios.

keep in mind im a complete novice and a (friendly) dangerous idiot.

WhatSexRU

Also - concerning Psalm 110 and Kothar sitting at the right hand of Baal: Can anyone point me to any biblical or extra biblical texts that might serve as intermediate steps toward Jesus sitting at the right hand of God?

31

New Testament support for the name Yahweh?

by WhatSexRU in

excuse me if this has been discussed before but im looking for evidence that any of the nt authors knew that the name yahweh (yahveh, jehovah, yhwh, or any variation) existed.

im testing a naive hypothesis that says that the nt authors were reading from the lxx and that they only saw kurios.

keep in mind im a complete novice and a (friendly) dangerous idiot.

WhatSexRU

Is anyone familiar with the Gospel of Peter?

Evidently Jesus cries from the cross, “My power, my power, thou hast forsaken me.”

If this is an allusion to Psalm 22 then couldn’t “My power” be taken as a reference to El?

Compare that to Mark 14:62 where Jesus says “Power.”

Was Jesus’ crime that he said “El?”

Did the author of Mark 14 think that the sacred name was El?

I - know - I’m weird.

31

New Testament support for the name Yahweh?

by WhatSexRU in

excuse me if this has been discussed before but im looking for evidence that any of the nt authors knew that the name yahweh (yahveh, jehovah, yhwh, or any variation) existed.

im testing a naive hypothesis that says that the nt authors were reading from the lxx and that they only saw kurios.

keep in mind im a complete novice and a (friendly) dangerous idiot.

WhatSexRU

The thing I hear all the time is that the name YHWH was considered sacred and taboo, and that’s why YHWH was replaced with LORD. But even if that is true then isn’t it also possible that the NT authors never knew about the name YHWH? Also, what specifically was Jesus accused of in Mark 14? What constituted blasphemy? Was it that he said YHWH? Or is it that he claimed to be the anointed one?

31

New Testament support for the name Yahweh?

by WhatSexRU in

excuse me if this has been discussed before but im looking for evidence that any of the nt authors knew that the name yahweh (yahveh, jehovah, yhwh, or any variation) existed.

im testing a naive hypothesis that says that the nt authors were reading from the lxx and that they only saw kurios.

keep in mind im a complete novice and a (friendly) dangerous idiot.

WhatSexRU

Thanks everyone. Great info. But I think you misunderstood me (it happens all the time). I know that the name YHWH was replaced with the title LORD in the LXX. And I know that the NT followed. But what I want to know is if the various authors of the NT were even aware that the name YHWH existed? I know I’m being weird - but please deal with it. Suppose for the sake of argument that they (any of the various authors of the NT) thought that the LORD was a title for Theos, or Elohim, or El. How do we know that they knew that the name YHWH existed?