I threw the last square suit case I had two weeks ago. I told my mother in law she could give it to some "brother" in her hall if she wanted to. She told me no one uses those anymore. They are all digital.
StephaneLaliberte
JoinedPosts by StephaneLaliberte
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45
P. Ms Letter to non subscibers to Redress Scheme
by jonahstourguide inspotted this article this morning.
i will try to post a link.. jtg.. australia.. institutions refusing to join the national redress scheme are "doubling down" on the crime of child sexual abuse, prime minister scott morrison says.. mr morrison and social services minister anne ruston have warned institutions they may lose funding and tax concessions if they fail to sign up by tuesday's deadline and will be named and shamed.. "all institutions are doing in not joining is doubling down on the crime and doubling down on the hurt," they said in a letter to 25 institutions.. "we consider it to be reprehensible that you have failed to sign up to the scheme.".
the jehovah's witnesses is among the organisations that has refused to sign up, arguing it does not have the institutional settings of other faith-based institutions that the redress scheme is designed to cover.. senator ruston is set to name the non-participating institutions on wednesday, when she will announce what action the federal government will take against them.. "we urge you to join the scheme not because of concerns about being identified, but because it is the right thing to do," the minister and mr morrison said.. "it is the right thing to do by survivors and their families and it is what every, decent, honest, australian demands.".
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StephaneLaliberte
I thought the JWS had a set doctrine which stated that they were to obey governmental authorities
Unless it is against the will of the
governing bodyGod, for God has supreme authority. -
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P. Ms Letter to non subscibers to Redress Scheme
by jonahstourguide inspotted this article this morning.
i will try to post a link.. jtg.. australia.. institutions refusing to join the national redress scheme are "doubling down" on the crime of child sexual abuse, prime minister scott morrison says.. mr morrison and social services minister anne ruston have warned institutions they may lose funding and tax concessions if they fail to sign up by tuesday's deadline and will be named and shamed.. "all institutions are doing in not joining is doubling down on the crime and doubling down on the hurt," they said in a letter to 25 institutions.. "we consider it to be reprehensible that you have failed to sign up to the scheme.".
the jehovah's witnesses is among the organisations that has refused to sign up, arguing it does not have the institutional settings of other faith-based institutions that the redress scheme is designed to cover.. senator ruston is set to name the non-participating institutions on wednesday, when she will announce what action the federal government will take against them.. "we urge you to join the scheme not because of concerns about being identified, but because it is the right thing to do," the minister and mr morrison said.. "it is the right thing to do by survivors and their families and it is what every, decent, honest, australian demands.".
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StephaneLaliberte
The girl Next door: However, the court of public opinion will weigh differently.
Unfortunately, this doesn’t matter much at this point; they are not making new converts. The majority of their new members are their children and these are the ones the government is seeking to protect.
The girl Next door: If every JW victim in Australia got the full amount we are talking over $150 million AUD.
While I join everyone in wanting to hurt the WT organization financially for their reprehensible actions, this will actually do little in eradicating the cult. People will keep practicing their “religion” through zoom and meetings in their various houses or individual properties.
They don’t need any of their buildings to keep their faith. Sure, they’re ability to bring in new members will be reduced, but that has already been the case for a few years now. So, I don’t actually see much impact from removing their buildings, studios, etc.
The only way to stop them is to criminalize certain actions that are no longer acceptable today; among these things are people not reporting child abuse to the authorities.
Smiddy3: Jehovah’s Witnesses have not sponsored any programs or activities that separate children from their parents at any time.
Yes, they do/did: They coupled young kids with experience pioneers. Brothers often have bible studies with the kids of single mothers. They often send out kids in service with adults without their parents.
I personally see nothing wrong with the above by the way. Parents are ultimately responsible to know who they trust. But we cannot say that they don’t have activities that separate the kids from the parents.
Smiddy3: their charitable status should be revoked and they should definitely not get any Government money funded support at all.
I agree, however, as long as they are considered a religion, this will not happen. Unless the governments no longer view ALL religions as charities.
Cofty: Surely it can be shown that they have repeatedly broken the law by failing to report abuse in Australian states that have a reporting law.
I’m not a legal expert, but it appears that these laws only have financial implications, they are not part of the criminal code where they could send those responsible in jail for it. That needs to change.
Smiddy3: At the ARC Geoffrey Jackson the Aussie G.B. member said it would make their life easier if it was mandatory for them to report such instances
That was one of the most nauseating things he said. They take zero accountability for their actions and shift the blame on the government. Typical abusers. I heard apologists say that they could be sued if they broke the confidentiality of some pedophiles. Strangely, instead of taking that fight, they take the one that puts the kids at risks.
Cofty: BUT if the govt make reporting compulsory they will comply.
Even if it was criminal to not report, I suspect that they still wouldn’t until a few of them have been put in jail for it. Long jail sentences are not needed. Just long enough to lose your job and have a criminal record. That will make a whole lot of people think twice.
I can imagine a conversation like this: Why are Brothers Smith, Banks and Craig going to jail for 60 days? Well, they didn’t report a pedophile to the police and that pedophile made 2 other victims. So, they were judged as accessory to his crimes.
Phizzy: The JW Org has done its usual callous calculation, no thought, let alone love, for the victims. It is calculating that to lose Tax Exemption would cost them far less over the years than paying up to $150 Million AUD.
They won’t lose it. These are empty threats and they know it. As they already don’t bring in new members from the public, they don’t care about their public image either. They have gone full cult mode.
Cofty: Do we know the sum that they are being asked to contribute to the scene?
Even if it was 3 million, they wouldn’t. It would imply saying sorry which sounds impossible for them. I’ve never seen them say sorry for absolutely anything.
No-zombie: when the Organization loses its non-charity tax exemption, what would be actual loss to them. I'm assuming that any donations given to the local branch would be taxed.
That won’t happen. They’ll go full persecution mode and will go underground, not declaring any income of any kind. It would actually be easy when you think about it.
Fadeaway1962: Agree with crofty the money is important but what is more important is saying sorry because that would mean acknowledging that the inspired word of god is wrong regarding the two witness rule
They won’t say sorry because it would bring their “reproach” on their organization. Never did, never will. The reason they don’t report to the police has nothing to do with the bible. Even when guilt is established, they still don’t report to the police. Hence, this has nothing to do with the 2 witness rule. Its all about them not wanting to let the authorities in what they perceive as being “their business”.
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45
P. Ms Letter to non subscibers to Redress Scheme
by jonahstourguide inspotted this article this morning.
i will try to post a link.. jtg.. australia.. institutions refusing to join the national redress scheme are "doubling down" on the crime of child sexual abuse, prime minister scott morrison says.. mr morrison and social services minister anne ruston have warned institutions they may lose funding and tax concessions if they fail to sign up by tuesday's deadline and will be named and shamed.. "all institutions are doing in not joining is doubling down on the crime and doubling down on the hurt," they said in a letter to 25 institutions.. "we consider it to be reprehensible that you have failed to sign up to the scheme.".
the jehovah's witnesses is among the organisations that has refused to sign up, arguing it does not have the institutional settings of other faith-based institutions that the redress scheme is designed to cover.. senator ruston is set to name the non-participating institutions on wednesday, when she will announce what action the federal government will take against them.. "we urge you to join the scheme not because of concerns about being identified, but because it is the right thing to do," the minister and mr morrison said.. "it is the right thing to do by survivors and their families and it is what every, decent, honest, australian demands.".
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StephaneLaliberte
The WT will lose it’s tax exempt charitable status in Australia, I’m certain of it.
I doubt it.
To take JWs off of their charitable status would imply not recognizing them as a religion. Unfortunately, thought the JWs actions were cruel and outright immoral, they didn’t break the law.
To fight the problem at its core, Australia will need to pass laws meant to enforce some of the findings of that commission. For instance, requiring religions to report child abuse. Once they fail to do it, Australia will need to prosecute the dissidents and send them to jail. These will then be in jail, not for their faith, but purely for not reporting ongoing child abuse.
Now, if the JWs leaders refuse to comply with such laws, this would make their organization a criminal one. Only then will Australia be able to question the religious status of the JWs.
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Leaked WT Elder Training Video
by Vanderhoven7 inhttps://youtu.be/2nacvosx8n0.
good to see the caring brothers help establish depth of guilt..
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StephaneLaliberte
Now that I'm old enough to be one of the judges, I see this process in a different light. This kid seriously messed up. A girlfriend is pregnant... he now will have a child with a women he might not even love and has little in common with her. That in itself is already a huge consequence that will have tremendous impact on his life. They could have told him:
Listen kid, you now have plenty of hardships ahead of you. That doesn’t mean you can’t take control back over your life though. Start walking in line with your faith and your friends and family will stand by your side helping you get through this.
Instead, they complain about his lack of relationship with God, the very thing they are supposed to help restore. Then, it’s all about them: He deceived us, he didn’t report to us earlier, he only confessed because he had to, our forms and documents and rules say this and that… where is the love?
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Expectation vs Reality
by joey jojo in.
just wanted to put this out there for any lurkers.. as someone that grew up during the 70s and 80s, we were promised that we would be in the first picture long ago.
if you are still on the fence, please let this sink in for a while..
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StephaneLaliberte
WingCommender, I'm also 41 and what you said is soo true. Never could I have mentionned to my parents that Armageddon wouldn't have come by 2020. It was impossible, not logical. there was no doubt about the generation of 1914 and only evil, blind people would not see it. We had the truth!
I'm looking at myself in the mirror and I'm discovering gray hair. Not only my parents grew old, so am I!
What puzzles me is that people who lived in these years will still practice shunning if you dare to question the teachings. nonesense.
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Expectation vs Reality
by joey jojo in.
just wanted to put this out there for any lurkers.. as someone that grew up during the 70s and 80s, we were promised that we would be in the first picture long ago.
if you are still on the fence, please let this sink in for a while..
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StephaneLaliberte
Expectation: Family Happiness
Reality:
- Broken family due to practice of shunning
- Divorce rate is as high as anywhere else
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Expectation: True Happiness
Reality: Depression due to aspirations (become a sport star, a phychologist, etc) being suppressed.
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Expectation: Love and friendship
Reality: Endless gossiping and competition
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Expectation: Protection from wickedness within the congregation
Reality:
- Pedophiles are not reported to the police
- Some abuse their fellow congregants knowing they will be discouraged from going to court.
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Expectation: Value and Respect
Reality:
- Individuals who do not hold a title or disregarded.
- Individuals often told that if they think differently than from the organization, they are boastful filled with pride.
- Women are oppressed
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Expectation: Honesty
Reality: Individuals are by and large shielded of anything negative concerning the organization.
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77
A question about the contemporary generation teaching following a conversation with a JW apologist
by Giles Gray ini would like to ask the ex-jws on this site to put their ‘apologists hat’ back on for a moment, so that i can go through the overlapping generation teaching in an attempt to make sense of it.
i apologise if these points have already been addressed on this site.a quick background for the reason for my request… having never confronted a jw apologist on the topic, i recently engaged with a jw regarding the official understanding of a ‘generation’ and unfortunately he didn’t have an answer to the points i was making.
i was left a little confused as to what the official jw response would/should be.so i was hoping that my thoughts below might be considered from an apologist’s perspective.the point in question relates to this section of the watchtower article below from 2008, as well as the jw.org video explanation of the overlapping generation:---:w08 2/15[box on page 25] can we calculate the length of “this generation”?the word “generation” usually refers to people of various ages whose lives overlap during a particular time period or event.
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StephaneLaliberte
Slimboyfat: The best a JW apologist could say, in my opinion, is that the faithful and discreet slave don’t claim to be infallible, and that understanding of this verse awaits clarification.
This is exactly what I was doing when I was in. However, when it was time to teach this to my kids, I simply could not. I could not bear the thought of teaching them non sense. So I quit.
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What Happened at the Tulsa Rally? I Thought There Were Requests for a Million Tickets?
by RubaDub init just seems rather odd to me that supposedly a million people had tickets or wanted tickets and yet the upper deck of the arena was half empty (or less) and they cancelled the outdoor overflow thing.
just a bit strange based from what was reported the day before.. i wonder if it was no-shows or being overly optimistic..
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StephaneLaliberte
I'm not for Trump, but I can tell that this kind of anti-democratic action will work in his favor at the next election.
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Noah’s flood
by dothemath ina few years ago at one of the conventions, there was a talk on gods remarkable creation.
one of the slides showed a giant sequoia tree, approximately 5000 years old!.
later another talk was about noah etc.
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StephaneLaliberte
Yep. Told by the same authorities that claim the weight of the water pushed everest up and carved tg3e grand canyon
OMG!!!! How did I not see that????