Posts by Rocky

52

Honest questions for believers.....

by Paulapollos in

jw
friends

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over the last couple of years, i have done a lot of reading, and rather than answering my questions, it has made me think even more - particularly about god and the bible.. when i was kicked out of the wtbts, it was because of my personal belief in jesus.

Rocky_Girl

Sorry it took so long to respond. I do believe in God as a specific being, I just don't think he really involves himself with our affairs.

I believe that we are a product of his creation, but not the direct intention. And, I think that we are, in some ways, creators ourselves.

Because of this, I see him in the way I described earlier. Directly or indirectly, he is the reason I have the keen intuition I have. Does it matter whether he actually gave me direction, or created the matter that eventually developed into me?

It may be self-serving to believe in God but not think that I have to do anything about it... But that is what I believe!

As for truth, I don't believe that there is any truth when it comes to God, at least that we can know.

31

You're only an ATHEIST because of the abusive relationship you had with your former religion..?

by Velour in

the few times that i've had a chat about my atheism, i usually get a response like the one above.

"well, seeing how you were in a cult- i can understand why you're an atheist now," just dismissing the bulk of the reasons i have for my disbelief.. i think what is particularly awkward about someone telling me this is- it's part way true- only part way though.

however, they stop listening after i explain to them that, "yes, being in a cult was an impetus to my search" and they fail to hear the rest of what i'm saying and believe that i went from point a to point f and just skipped all the steps and months of research in between out of some kind of anti-jw tantrum.

Rocky_Girl

Doesn't it make you wonder how those people who say that came to be involved in their current religion? Did they join in an emotional tantrum? Maybe that is why they can't understand someone coming to a particular conclusion through actual research and logic.

52

Honest questions for believers.....

by Paulapollos in

jw
friends

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over the last couple of years, i have done a lot of reading, and rather than answering my questions, it has made me think even more - particularly about god and the bible.. when i was kicked out of the wtbts, it was because of my personal belief in jesus.

Rocky_Girl

Paulappolos - You speak above of truth. There is not absolute, provable truth. Anyone who claims to have the "truth" is lying to you, and probably himself. Once you let go of that need for a specific truth, you can be free to choose what you believe knowing there are warts involved with any belief, or non-belief, system. Perhaps you could compromise by finding what rings true to you, with the acknowledgement that it may not feel right to someone else. It requires strength to take a stand on the question of God - whether you believe or not.

Only you can decide whether the warts of a certain belief are too big or ugly to live with.

52

Honest questions for believers.....

by Paulapollos in

jw
friends

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over the last couple of years, i have done a lot of reading, and rather than answering my questions, it has made me think even more - particularly about god and the bible.. when i was kicked out of the wtbts, it was because of my personal belief in jesus.

Rocky_Girl

Do you consider him a separate part of you or an integral part of you?

Somewhat integral, like the little voice inside that tells you which path is correct. But also separate, like the events that seem to fall perfectly in place for you when you need help. Serendipity, perhaps.

Is he a part of everyone and/or everything else?

Yes, everything and everyone. But passively. Not pushy or intrusive.

Not a traditional viewpoint, I admit, but it has developed over time.

52

Honest questions for believers.....

by Paulapollos in

jw
friends

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over the last couple of years, i have done a lot of reading, and rather than answering my questions, it has made me think even more - particularly about god and the bible.. when i was kicked out of the wtbts, it was because of my personal belief in jesus.

Rocky_Girl

you do not have the Bible as a basis for your beliefs. I presume you don't have any other book either?

That is true, I view all holy books as written by humans in an attempt to portray God in a certain way. They all have value, because they give us a glimpse of other viewpoints and perceptions.

If so, can I ask you, why do you believe in God?

I honestly don't know why, when given the same information, I believe in God when others do not.

What has prompted you to?

I feel a need to believe in something bigger than myself. I would not have that need if there was not something bigger to believe in. For me, that is God.

Do you feel that there is no need to have any "objective" proof for belief in God?

No. My belief in God does not change my perception of what will happen to me after my time on Earth is done. I do not believe that God cares whether we believe in Him or not; our fate is not dependant on our belief system. What would happen if I am right? What would happen if I were wrong? The same thing... Believing fills a place in my heart, so I believe.

I am genuinely interested, because you seem to have a fairly post-modern approach to the question of God, values, and the way we live our lives

Some would say that I am wishy washy; I like your description better. I actively study religious thought and philosophy and keep company with intellectually curious people. It seems that every culture and society agrees on what is "moral" or "correct" behavior. It is generally wrong to kill others without cause, take other's possessions, or to be dishonest or abusive to others in your community. It is all about respect and generosity. I put more stock in that than any "holy book."As for God, I consider Him as part of me, and so praying is a sort of meditation where I find my own answers.

52

Honest questions for believers.....

by Paulapollos in

jw
friends

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over the last couple of years, i have done a lot of reading, and rather than answering my questions, it has made me think even more - particularly about god and the bible.. when i was kicked out of the wtbts, it was because of my personal belief in jesus.

Rocky_Girl

I am a believer in God, but not a Christian.

I have come to believe that the bible is, indeed, a collection of literature - poetry, myth, tradition. It has a lot of insight on the human capacity for love, hate, violence, peace, tolerance, and intolerance. If you read the bible as if you were reading a novel or book of poetry, you can gain some of this insight. I look at each story and ask myself why - why would someone write this? why are the characters acting this way? why does the author portray God this way? I can usually find a nugget of wisdom in each one.

You will probably receive answers to the questions that you pose that will wind you through scripture and tradition - forcing your mind into a theological pretzel - but once you begin to question how scripture is applied, it is hard to accept apologetic answers.

You can believe in God without believing that the bible was specially written by His direction, or without proof that He exists. Or, you can choose not to believe in Him and you may be right! In any case, remember that your opinion on these matters are as valid as anyone else's. Go with what makes sense to you. Trust your own intuition.

10

Seeking Advice Please

by Eiben Scrood in

jw
friends

some background: i am an only child, a born-in, my parents were considered superstars of the watchtower having been missionaries and "exemplary" for their entire lives.

shortly after they died in 2002, i started a very slow fade and finally stopped all meeting attendance in 2005.. both sides of the family are, with a very few exceptions, also hardcore watchtowerites as in 'if the watchtower says my green bible is purple, then it must be purple.

' i have lost touch with one side of the family almost completely but the other side has always been close to me and in particular, i miss two cousins who were like brothers to me.

Rocky_Girl

Every family is different and, though they claim unity, every congregation is different. Some areas are more or less lenient than others when it comes to the treatment of those who left. I can tell you what worked for my family, but there is no guarantee when working with human beings.

At first, I sent out a newsletter to everyone in my family talking about what was going on with me and the kids, along with current photos. Some of the family sent them back, so I took them off the "send" list. The others got regular updates. I never spoke of religious matters, did not send birthday/holiday photos, and did not push them to visit or talk. After some time, those who remained in contact started calling again and even asked me to visit. (I am not DF'd ro DA'd) Now, some of the others have asked for pictures of the kids, so I put them back on the list.

I gave them a window into the part of my life that would be the same in or out of their religion - going to the park, school days, vacations - so they would remember that there are a million subjects to discuss besides religion. In essence, I plastered the big elephant in the room with family photos. It took the pressure off of them to comment on my inactive status and showed them that I was not a rabid apostate, hell bent on turning them away from the big J.

Like I said, it may work, it may not. Having children helps - who can resist a sweet little newborn baby? Congratulations, by the way! Good luck!

8

drama

by outsmartthesystem in

jw
friends

since i am not yet fully out.....i was at the dc.

the drama was just awful.

for anyone else that saw it....i need your opinion.

Rocky_Girl

The rumor would spread that he was homosexual. Why else would he care if someone thought he slept with a hot girl? I do NOT miss the dramas!

10

Do You Want to be Valid?

by AllTimeJeff in

jw
friends

i know how you feel...... you come to this forum for reasons of your own.

we all have as our default settings in our head that everyone else should think and see as we do.. sadly, or happily, the more you expose yourself to others, the more you experience the delicious irony that no one is the same, that god is so different to billions, or non existent to millions...... what we want though when we come here as former jw's isn't agreement, it's validation.. not that everyone else is wrong, but rather, just so that we matter.

that our life wasn't in vain.

Rocky_Girl

The discovery of us is the most important thing we can do. Regardless of what it turns into, that respect for ourselves is essential. The lessons we learn on that journey should also teach us to respect the journies of all others too.

This was a lesson I learned late in the game. I was trying so hard to fit into a Christian faith because I just "knew" that it was the right way. I stumbled from one denomination to the next, always feeling like an outsider, until the chaplain at my college told me to stop trying so hard. She encouraged me to do some soul searching and find out what I needed from a faith. That is when I realized that I wasn't Christian. It was hard for me to admit that for a long time.

If I hadn't stopped to actually think about who I "was" instead of who I "should be," I would still be church hopping and feeling guilty for not believing. This is why I get so frustrated with faiths that push people to make the decision to convert quickly. One could argue that those faiths have nothing to offer, so they don't want a potential convert to think too much about it; but I like to give them the benefit of the doubt and assume that they are so caught up in their own spiritual experience that they push out of excitement. Either way, the result is the same - people trapped by guilt.

I have close friends who are devout Christians, Muslims, Atheists, Buddists, and Jewish - several are religious leaders - and I find value in each of their belief systems. I am fascinated by the choices they made along their paths to arrive where they are today. As for me, I have had many stops on my own journey and I may have many more. But now it is on my terms and not led by guilt.

8

Christian Mingle. FAIL!!!

by whereami in

jw
friends

.

Rocky_Girl

nice...

Rocky_Girl

Posts by Rocky_Girl