Posts by llbh

165

So an 8 year old is killed by a machine-gun and it's no ones fault?

by Simon in

i think us gun laws are s-t-u-p-i-d ... and the legal system more so.

saw a very good suggestion yesterday though - force people who want to own a gun to require insurance (hey, you have to have it for a vehicle for gods sake).

single-shot hunting rifle?

llbh

I am free to chose too BTS and I prefer to live in The UK. I note that you failed to address the wider issue in my last post, and that surely is part of the reason Simon began this thread.

I have managed perfectly well to live in gun free society.BTW my mum and my wife both small women have not felt vulnerable either, nor does my 80 y mil feel the need to carry a gun.

From my understanding most gun crime is visited upon criminals ( usually drug addicts) by other people of a similar ilk. Drugs here are a huge problem as in The US, sensible debate about to reduce its use would, without doubt reduce usage and crime.

David

165

So an 8 year old is killed by a machine-gun and it's no ones fault?

by Simon in

i think us gun laws are s-t-u-p-i-d ... and the legal system more so.

saw a very good suggestion yesterday though - force people who want to own a gun to require insurance (hey, you have to have it for a vehicle for gods sake).

single-shot hunting rifle?

llbh

Thanks for your contribution bts, thoughtfull as ever, it made me think.. a little.

David

165

So an 8 year old is killed by a machine-gun and it's no ones fault?

by Simon in

i think us gun laws are s-t-u-p-i-d ... and the legal system more so.

saw a very good suggestion yesterday though - force people who want to own a gun to require insurance (hey, you have to have it for a vehicle for gods sake).

single-shot hunting rifle?

llbh

TD you ask me what I am allowed to defend myself with in a public place, the simple answer is whatever is to hand, I would not expect to be the victim of any gun crime, nor do our police who use Truncheons largely, as i said only specially trained officers carry them. I regularly go into central London and feel quite safe. I suspect if I lived in The US and in a dodgy area i might want to own a gun, and that proves my point, that allowing the sale of firearms more people carry them; and in particular the criminals, no one wins, even the bad guys. This is the case in large parts of Europe too.

Surely what is needed is a debate in how to decrease violence, rather than demand rights.

David

165

So an 8 year old is killed by a machine-gun and it's no ones fault?

by Simon in

i think us gun laws are s-t-u-p-i-d ... and the legal system more so.

saw a very good suggestion yesterday though - force people who want to own a gun to require insurance (hey, you have to have it for a vehicle for gods sake).

single-shot hunting rifle?

llbh

Hi james,

That maybe an exjw mindset, though I do not think so, most Brits are pro The US (myself included), we do not always get the rationale behind some of more right wing manifestations though. Simon's views whilst cogently argued are his own, and are not ( except for his views on guns) shared by everyone here

TD we feel much safer without guns, we feel that by and large it is the job of the police to protect our citizens. As for self defense, there is enshrined in law a right to self defense, however that defense must be proportional to the threat, ie if you feel your life is in danger, you can kill your attacker justifiably, and the law will protect you. If however a person steals from you that does not in and of itself give you the right to harm them per se.

David

165

So an 8 year old is killed by a machine-gun and it's no ones fault?

by Simon in

i think us gun laws are s-t-u-p-i-d ... and the legal system more so.

saw a very good suggestion yesterday though - force people who want to own a gun to require insurance (hey, you have to have it for a vehicle for gods sake).

single-shot hunting rifle?

llbh

james_woods where do you get the idea that we do not like your political and legal system? we certainly in The UK do not understand your love affair of guns, and how it can possibly make you feel safer, anymore than you can understand how we feel and are safer without them ( the vast majority of law officers included), that should not be conflated as meaning we do not like other aspects of your system.

David

442

Congresswoman Shot in Tucson

by leavingwt in

several shot at tuscon grocery .

several people were shot saturday at a grocery store in tucson, arizona, a spokesman for the pima county sheriff's department said.. the shooting occurred at a safeway shortly after 10 a.m. mst, according to sheriff's spokesman deputy jason ogan.. a couple of victims with gunshot wounds have arrived at northwest medical center, according to spokesman richard parker.. "they've been coming in the last 10 minutes.

i'm not sure of the severity of their injuries," he said.. ogan said the motive for the shooting is unclear.. "we're just trying to sort this out right now," he said.. .

llbh

Thanks to you Beks that is the the sort of thing I was alluding to, actual bodily harm (ABH) can be levied even without violence I know of a family member who has a criminal record for violence even though no act was committed, such is the seriousness with which we take violence here; just to carry a firearm carries a non negotiable five year stretch.

David

442

Congresswoman Shot in Tucson

by leavingwt in

several shot at tuscon grocery .

several people were shot saturday at a grocery store in tucson, arizona, a spokesman for the pima county sheriff's department said.. the shooting occurred at a safeway shortly after 10 a.m. mst, according to sheriff's spokesman deputy jason ogan.. a couple of victims with gunshot wounds have arrived at northwest medical center, according to spokesman richard parker.. "they've been coming in the last 10 minutes.

i'm not sure of the severity of their injuries," he said.. ogan said the motive for the shooting is unclear.. "we're just trying to sort this out right now," he said.. .

llbh

Intentional homicides by country

Source: United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime , 2000 [ 8 ]

Country	% homicides with firearms	Firearm homicide rate per 100,000 pop.	Non-firearm homicide rate per 100,000 pop.	Overall homicide rate per 100,000 pop.
Australia	16	0.31	1.26	1.57
Azerbaijan	8	0.22	2.59	2.81
Barbados	40	3.00	4.49	7.49
Belarus	33	3.31	6.82	10.13
Bulgaria	19	0.77	3.3	4.07
Canada [ 24 ]	34	0.54	1.04	1.58
Chile	11	0.18	1.37	1.55
Colombia	85	51.8	10.9	62.7
Costa Rica [ 24 ]	51	3.38	3.19	6.57
Denmark	24	0.26	0.83	1.09
England & Wales [ 24 ]	8	0.12	1.33	1.45
Estonia	13	1.53	8.92	10.45
Finland [ 25 ]	19	0.43	1.94	2.19
Germany	40	0.47	0.70	1.17
Guatemala	75	6.97	25.5	25.47
Hungary	21	0.44	1.61	2.05
India [ 24 ]	25	0.93	2.04	2.97
Ireland [ 24 ]	24	0.32	1.01	1.33
Latvia	11	1.3	10	11.3
Lithuania	18	2.24	10	12.3
Macedonia	36	1.28	2.31	3.59
Mexico	21	3.7	14.1	17.8
Moldova, Republic of	5	0.47	8.13	8.59
New Zealand	13	0.18	1.17	1.36
Paraguay	38	7.4	12	19.4
Poland	7	0.43	5.61	6.04
Portugal	25	0.85	2.45	3.31
Qatar [ 24 ]	25	0.18	0.53	0.71
Singapore	3	0.03	0.92	0.95
Slovakia	45	2.17	2.65	4.81
Slovenia	25	0.6	1.81	2.41
Spain	16	0.25	1.25	1.5
Switzerland	37	0.56	0.96	1.52
Ukraine	4	0.35	8.93	9.27
United States [ 24 ]	65	2.97	1.58	4.55
Uruguay	35	2.52	4.61	7.13
Zimbabwe	40	4.75	7.24	12

More stats from The UN, no offence BTS but please treat information from the Mail with suspicion most in The UK do

Regards

David

442

Congresswoman Shot in Tucson

by leavingwt in

several shot at tuscon grocery .

several people were shot saturday at a grocery store in tucson, arizona, a spokesman for the pima county sheriff's department said.. the shooting occurred at a safeway shortly after 10 a.m. mst, according to sheriff's spokesman deputy jason ogan.. a couple of victims with gunshot wounds have arrived at northwest medical center, according to spokesman richard parker.. "they've been coming in the last 10 minutes.

i'm not sure of the severity of their injuries," he said.. ogan said the motive for the shooting is unclear.. "we're just trying to sort this out right now," he said.. .

llbh

http://www.gun-control-network.org/GF01.htm

This article shows that gun crime is directly related to gun ownership and the US has a homicide rate 35 times that of The US ,well why i not surprised, and one third of even Canada, so please be careful bts with your stats, and do use sources other than the Mail and it ilk. If you read that article carefully you will note that it was an attempt to discredit the then Home Secretary Alan Johnson, who is a socialist, so they do / just might have had an agenda

David

442

Congresswoman Shot in Tucson

by leavingwt in

several shot at tuscon grocery .

several people were shot saturday at a grocery store in tucson, arizona, a spokesman for the pima county sheriff's department said.. the shooting occurred at a safeway shortly after 10 a.m. mst, according to sheriff's spokesman deputy jason ogan.. a couple of victims with gunshot wounds have arrived at northwest medical center, according to spokesman richard parker.. "they've been coming in the last 10 minutes.

i'm not sure of the severity of their injuries," he said.. ogan said the motive for the shooting is unclear.. "we're just trying to sort this out right now," he said.. .

llbh

No you do not need a gun to engage in violence bts, yet you have threatened violence on a person, who believed that should you find out where he lived you would cause him harm, that is awful, and that because he showed the paucity of your arguments..

Now for your statitistice, the Newpaper which from which you quote is well known for its hyperbole so I would not be in a rush to quote from it if i were you.

A very senior police officer with whom I have had many long cinversations laments to me that the media here does give credit for the reduction in crime, and he provides a long line of statistics to prove his points. We have far fewer crimes since he first became a junior officer 25 years ago.

We in the UK are not a society awash with violent crime, so you need to do better than quote fro The Mail that has its own well known and poorly informed agenda.

David

442

Congresswoman Shot in Tucson

by leavingwt in

several shot at tuscon grocery .

several people were shot saturday at a grocery store in tucson, arizona, a spokesman for the pima county sheriff's department said.. the shooting occurred at a safeway shortly after 10 a.m. mst, according to sheriff's spokesman deputy jason ogan.. a couple of victims with gunshot wounds have arrived at northwest medical center, according to spokesman richard parker.. "they've been coming in the last 10 minutes.

i'm not sure of the severity of their injuries," he said.. ogan said the motive for the shooting is unclear.. "we're just trying to sort this out right now," he said.. .

llbh

Hey BTS what were your allusions to Europe all about?? People in the UK are very very rarely shot, even by the police, who mostly do not carry guns. There is a not culture of gun ownership in Europe, though laws do vary. Any shooting makes National headlines.

You yourself threatened violence to HS, so maybe words and ideas would be more persuasive than the threat of violence ,whoever uses it. Violence mostly produces pyrrhic and short victories

Maybe the one thing that might come out of this is more polite debate in politics in the US.

David