Posts by independent

407

Is it the JW's or the God of the bible you no longer believe?

by reniaa in

i have a question for the ex-jw's on this forum after months of reading the forum..... many say how good it is to be free of the oppressiveness of the jw's that they can now enjoy the freedom to... have sex, celebrate christmas, gamble, embrace politics etc.

there are still biblical scriptures and principles in place that if you still followed the bible would mean you avoid these things and yet these are now embraced as one of the perks of no longer being a jw so in my confusion i ask.... if these are what you want, isn't it more correct to say you no longer follow the bible as apposed to just the jw's?.

independent_tre

i'm sorry isaacaustin I guess I wasn't really clear on the point I was trying to make which was that the rituals of these forgotten pagan festivals have a great a hold on us. And that people couldn't conceive of not doing them or changing the date they observe jesus's birthday on, people find change hard.
I don't want to keep banging on about christmas it's taken what I really wanted to discuss right off topic and considering the replies i've had it's an old well discussed topic.
I appologise to those that feel I have not answered or addressed their questions enough but I really want to keep this thread more on topic now and only address people staying within the topic of "If it's Just the Jw's they've left and not the God of the bible?" although i think we may have pretty muched covered it .

To be fair to you Reniaa, I will answer your original question if that honestly was your reason for bringing this up. I left the JW's, not the Bible. As a matter of fact I feel that the bible has more meaning to me than at anytime I've ever been a dub.

I did not leave for sex - the only person I'm gettin' it on with is my hubby.

I did not leave to celebrate holidays - so many of them are Hallmark-money-making holidays anyway, but I do believe it is my choice and not condemned by the Bible.

I did not leave to gamble - I can find many more satisfying ways of flushing my money down the toilet.

I did not leave to vote - I still retain a healthy skepticism of politics and politicians.

I left because I found out it was not the truth. A deep study of the bible without the WT narrative will uncover that. I left because of all the extrascriptural requirements that did not make sense. I left because I realized that Jehovah's Witnesses are not a 'special people'; they are like every other group of people on this earth, there is good and bad in all.

Most of all - I left because I wanted to be FREE! That is my hope for you, Reniaa.

Take care.

Independent Tre

407

Is it the JW's or the God of the bible you no longer believe?

by reniaa in

i have a question for the ex-jw's on this forum after months of reading the forum..... many say how good it is to be free of the oppressiveness of the jw's that they can now enjoy the freedom to... have sex, celebrate christmas, gamble, embrace politics etc.

there are still biblical scriptures and principles in place that if you still followed the bible would mean you avoid these things and yet these are now embraced as one of the perks of no longer being a jw so in my confusion i ask.... if these are what you want, isn't it more correct to say you no longer follow the bible as apposed to just the jw's?.

independent_tre

Just read all eight pages of this thread, and while there doesn't seem to be a need for any more questions to be raised for Reniaa to answer, I have to agree that she has not answered them according to the scriptures. Anyone can go on debating forever by using 'what if' scenarios, personal opinions, inordinate comparison (apples and oranges), exaggerations and unsupported facts. I would like to see Mary's, lil's, and outlaws questions answered clearly according to the Bible, But I don't think that's going to happen.

35

11/15/08 WT: Sick? Too damn bad - get yer @$$ back to the KH, slacker!

by sir82 in

jw
friends

there's been a few topics on the "search out the inactive ones" articles in this wt, but i haven't seen anything on the 3rd study article, titled "maintain a scriptural view of healthcare".. i was unaware that the bible had anything to say at all about healthcare, but oh how wrong i was!.

unfortunately, no scanner - perhpas one of the other intrepid posters could scan and post it.. but here are a few choice quotes:.

paragraph 6: "...we know it is wise to avoid letting our health become an obsession or a constant concern.".

independent_tre

lol... Another true story.. Because of my hypertension, my doctor recommended regular exercise ( as any good doctor would). On the way out of my local health club, I ran into 2 sisters from my hall, working the parking lot. One of them said to me, "While you were in there building yourself up physically, we were out here building people up spiritually!"

71

Milk and Meat are poisoning people and destroying our health!

by Witness 007 in

i have read a dozen different health books that come to this same conclusion.

what is milk?

mammal infants require milk from their own species to grow quickly and start solid food.

independent_tre

I know a lot of folks on here like to decry research as a bunch of hocus pocus and medical chicanery, but honestly there is a whole heaping lot of medical journal articles which link certain foods with elevated risks of cancer and heart disease.

And I like a good burger or hot dog as much as anyone else

Just sayin is all…

71

Milk and Meat are poisoning people and destroying our health!

by Witness 007 in

i have read a dozen different health books that come to this same conclusion.

what is milk?

mammal infants require milk from their own species to grow quickly and start solid food.

independent_tre

Didn't read the whole thread, but foods that are high in saturated fat - meat, eggs, and dairy do contribute to high blood cholesterol levels, thus arterioscleorisis and heart disease.

High Blood Cholesterol. One of the major risk factors for heart disease is high blood cholesterol. Cholesterol, a fat-like substance carried in your blood, is found in all of your body's cells. Your liver produces all of the cholesterol your body needs to form cell membranes and to make certain hormones. Extra cholesterol enters your body when you eat foods that come from animals (meats, eggs, and dairy products).

Although we often blame the cholesterol found in foods that we eat for raising blood cholesterol, the main culprit is the saturated fat in food. (Be sure to read nutrition labels carefully, because even though a food does not contain cholesterol it may still have large amounts of saturated fat.) Foods rich in saturated fat include butter fat in milk products, fat from red meat, and tropical oils such as coconut oil.

Too much low-density lipoprotein (LDL or "bad cholesterol") in the blood causes plaque to form on artery walls, which starts a disease process called atherosclerosis. When plaque builds up in the coronary arteries that supply blood to the heart, you are at greater risk of having a heart attack.

Taken from an article quoting the Texas Heart institute...

50

As I stated before the Great Tribulation is picking up speed!!!!!!!!!!

by unbaptized in

when i think about the biblical tale of noah!

i think of the time we are living in today and how it resembles noah's time.

no one's really paying attention.

independent_tre

Very interesting webpage dave; I find it amazing that even though the bible states no one knows and the laundry list of influential persons that have predicted the end over the centuries - people will still have the ignorant audacity to make predictions and set dates.....

A dub at my job does this everytime there's a gloomy headline in the paper..."we are just so close to the end.. we have to get our priorities straightened out.." It really gets on my effin nerves.

Edited to Add: Shamus, you have a really good point... even as a dub, when I used to get caught up in looking for signs of the end, it never occurred to me that people in different nations have been suffering from economic hardships, famines, and other crisis for decades. It's only when something goes on in the 50 states do American jw get all riled up about the end being immenient.

23

A CLEAR definition of "higher education"

by easyreader1970 in

jw
friends

yesterday i went to the saturday segment of the two day circuit assembly.

the brother giving the talk wanted to make sure that all in attendance understood clearly what the watchtower's definition of "higher education" was.

this is not verbatim, but this is as clear as i can remember it.

independent_tre

why is wanting be become a doctor such a terrible thing.... Everyone living and breathing has probably needed a doctor at one time or another, and last I checked they did not have 2 yr MD programs availble.

50

As I stated before the Great Tribulation is picking up speed!!!!!!!!!!

by unbaptized in

when i think about the biblical tale of noah!

i think of the time we are living in today and how it resembles noah's time.

no one's really paying attention.

independent_tre

LOL... Sir82.. you are hilarious!

BTW, what ever happened to no man knowing the day or hour? I guess some folks have a really good feeling the end is near.

30

A few questions for all you experts from my long JW meeting yesterday

by AuntBee in

jw
friends

here are a few things that were said that seemed kind of dubious to me.

(i had a meeting with 2 women that came to the door - full story in the thread "i received the knock...").

they baptize in the name of the father, son and holy spirit.

independent_tre

In a way, I felt like I became a JW without reading the fine print in the contract. When you're a 3rd gen witness, and your parents, relatives, and cousins are all in, you take it as the truth because it's all you know, not based on really researching their doctrines.

As some have said here, all you have to do is research their own publications, and you'll find the truth behind what they teach. If you printed it out, those sisters probably still wouldn't necessarily look at it.

But the overarching issue is not debating each doctrine, it is whether or not you're allowed to disagree. Trust me, some here have gotten disfellowshipped for voicing their doubts in doctrines such as 1914 and the 144,000. I know better than to question doctrine and as someone here has already mentioned, you can find yourself in deep doo-doo by saying the wrong thing to the wrong person. Or the object of sheperding calls at the least. Not only that, many practices are considered 'organizational' ones, but of course you are expected to tow the line.

Plain and simple, its deceptive and its a trap.

5

jw's emphasis life not dependant on works, but

by booby in

obedience it is all about obedience and zeal to that obedience in the mind of the wts..

independent_tre

This sounds like more WT doublespeak to me; it's not the result of the work, but the work itself that results in salvation? NOT.

One of the greatest things I've learned since fading from the org and studying the bible w/o WT influence is that only faith saves, man cannot 'earn' salvation no matter how many works he has produced.

This statement was probably included so witneses will continue to put in laborious field service time even though it doesn't seem productive. As if the number of hours put in will gaurantee salvation even if it doesn't produce one bible study.

independent_tre

Posts by independent_tre