Posts by hillary

63

SHOULD SUSAN ATKINS BE RELEASED FROM PRISON?

by Mary in

susan atkins, one of the manson "family" members convicted in the 1969 murders of actress sharon tate and six others, is dying of brain cancer and asking to be released from a california prison after 37 years behind bars.

do you think she should be released?.

ailing manson follower asks for early release due to terminal illness by linda deutsch, the associated press .

hillary_step

Six,

I hope as many of us, and more, read his latest book titled The Prosecution of George W. Bush for Murder in which he makes the case that a President can be prosecuted for murder when he lies to the American people into a war that was unnecessary.

Yes, I have read this book Six, and he does make a compelling case for Presidential prosecution. What is missing in Western Politics is the accountability that a natural sense of justice demands. If a person feared a life in jail as a judgement against irresponsibly causing the death of others by their decisions, as do workers in many other situations in life, they would I am sure think far more carefully before experimenting with a dangerous and badly planned political ideology.

Bugliosi argues, as do I, that politicians should have no greater exemption from prosecution than do any other workers whose irresponsible actions leads to the death of others.

Good for him.

HS

43

Do you exercise or isn't that your thing.

by LouBelle in

jw
friends

for the last 5 and 1/2 weeks i have been at the gym mostly twice a day except saturdays - i only have one training session.

each of my sessions is at least an hour long but can go for two hours.

i do various cardio in the evenings and do strength training in the morning.

hillary_step

I run.

I have run regularly since my teens and am now in my mid-fifties and still running. Until my mid forties I ran seven miles, three times a week. Now I am down to three miles three tiimes a week, though between days I work on a home gym and like Terry am very aware of making everyday actions an excercise in themselves.

I am a great believer in exercise where improving the quality of life is concerned, though not a fanatic. It may only give you an extra few years, but you arrive at old age much more comfortably and with far fewer hospital visits.

HS

63

SHOULD SUSAN ATKINS BE RELEASED FROM PRISON?

by Mary in

susan atkins, one of the manson "family" members convicted in the 1969 murders of actress sharon tate and six others, is dying of brain cancer and asking to be released from a california prison after 37 years behind bars.

do you think she should be released?.

ailing manson follower asks for early release due to terminal illness by linda deutsch, the associated press .

hillary_step

Gregor,

I think when we start trying to put ourselves in the shoes of the criminal by taking into consideration their own abuse as a child or how long they have aleady suffered in prison and even their terminal illness - we are getting into a bog of empathy that reveals more about our own innocence and insecurities than anything else.

I understand what you are saying, and in many ways agree but you need to feed into this factor the theory and practice of understanding the nature of crime. The reason why this is necessary is that society can be better protected if we recognize the signs of what leads a person to commit crime.

Six is quite right. Had the signs been noted in the early years of a Manson, he may now be hailed as one of the heroes in our society rather than one of its most henious criminals. Environment is important in all our emotional development, but especially so to the sociopathic personality.

I am ambivelent toward Atkins. She is as far removed from my life in every way as I want her to be, and as you note the Law can only be a tool of approximation. We have however moved a long way from the days, historically quite recent, as to when we hung people for stealing apples, or transported them for stealing linen from the Master, or castrated them for being a diffeent color to ourselves. It is not due to revengful attitudes that these changes for the better have taken place, but by putting into place tried and tested legal paradigms.

In our own minds we need to try to separate the personal feelings of outraged revenge, from greater needs of a social community. Sometimes these elements combine in some good, often they do not.

It is progessive thinking that leads to a fairer society, and while the law is an approximate tool, so too are the hopeful enterprises that lead to a more civilized society. Along the way both have made mistakes and both have had their successes.

Bugliosi himself has no issue with Atkins being released at this stage and he was the professional who prosecuted her and coped with the misery of the victims families first hand. As far as I am concerned he knows better than I what should be done.

HS

63

SHOULD SUSAN ATKINS BE RELEASED FROM PRISON?

by Mary in

susan atkins, one of the manson "family" members convicted in the 1969 murders of actress sharon tate and six others, is dying of brain cancer and asking to be released from a california prison after 37 years behind bars.

do you think she should be released?.

ailing manson follower asks for early release due to terminal illness by linda deutsch, the associated press .

hillary_step

Burn,

I think we all have the the monster inside. Each and every one of us.

Well, I have heard the expression 'every man (or woman) is capable of anything', and while I agree in the main part, the 'monster' that lives in the sociopath is very different, and very few of us have it.

HS

63

SHOULD SUSAN ATKINS BE RELEASED FROM PRISON?

by Mary in

susan atkins, one of the manson "family" members convicted in the 1969 murders of actress sharon tate and six others, is dying of brain cancer and asking to be released from a california prison after 37 years behind bars.

do you think she should be released?.

ailing manson follower asks for early release due to terminal illness by linda deutsch, the associated press .

hillary_step

Big Tex,

I asked that question of how the criminal lives with it when I began looking at my parents, and I wondered how they did it. I came to the conclusion that the only way is to change the events in your own mind. The event either never happened or the person changes their role in it to one of innocence or even being victimized themselves. In my own family, they chose the former. Nothing ever happened; at least in their mind. And after a few decades they even begin to believe it themselves.

Yes, this is exactly the process that many criminals, and the worse the crime the more noted the emotional transference, make in their own thinking. Rather like the break in a bone, it either never heals properly in the minority of cases, or when it does heal, the place of the break becomes harder than the surrounding bone itself.

There are those who are paid to try to understand why this happens, poor sods. What they do know is that sociopaths and to a more limited degree sociopathic thinking is a defect from birth. Some are born with this defective thinking. If they are raised by loving parents they tend to become the heroes and 'daredevils' in society. If they are raised surrounded by dysfunction, they become the remorseless killers. If you have read anything about Manson's early life, you will note the incredibly dysfunctional childhood that he had. At one stage his sixteen year old hooker mother swapped him for a drink!

Very few people who are truly evil think themselves as evil, they think themselves used by God, used by fate, chosen to be different, brilliantly cunning (Manson despite never having attended school for longer than a few weeks at a time had a tested IQ of 121) anything but face the mirror of their soul.

You have been through the type of Hell that most people could barely imagine Chris. That you have survived with such a big and open heart speaks much for your character. I have no idea how you are able to cope, but I admire you for it.

HS

63

SHOULD SUSAN ATKINS BE RELEASED FROM PRISON?

by Mary in

susan atkins, one of the manson "family" members convicted in the 1969 murders of actress sharon tate and six others, is dying of brain cancer and asking to be released from a california prison after 37 years behind bars.

do you think she should be released?.

ailing manson follower asks for early release due to terminal illness by linda deutsch, the associated press .

hillary_step

Big Tex,

Seriously now ... how does someone live with themselves after being involved in such a horrific crime?

This is something that haunts my haunts my thinking too.

I have been working recently with a charitable concern that is helping to emotionally reconcile the over 40,000 Croatian women who were raped in every conceivable manner, some as young as six years of age, some kept as camp whores for years, servicing up to twenty men a night from the age of thirteen, some sold into slavery and smuggled to Russia, Bulgaria etc to work in brothels and the pronography industry, and who are still enslaved all these years later. Cut off from their family and their childhood dreams and imprisoned in a world of misery and insanity to serve as the playthings for brutal men, year after year.

It breaks me apart to read reports and eye witness testimonies, to look inside the vicious heart, while so very few men have ever been bought to trial. Thousands of sadistic rapists are walking free, living life among us, while their victims lie dead, mutliated, or damaged for life by their actions. How do they sleep at night? Who knows Chris. I wish that I believed in a God and a final court of judgement, but that luxury is not to be.

We must stand up in this life and be counted.

As to Atkins, having had the sort of nightmarish childhood most of us would have difficulty imagining, and then falling under the spell of a man she thought to be 'Jesus', when she was eighteen, she was a murderer waiting to happen. The racially bigotted, unhinged, but cunning Manson hoped that by sending out his cronies to commit horrendous crimes that would spark of a race war. I guess what cult victim and cult founder have discovered, as have we all as XJW's, is that the Ferryman must be paid and we must take responsibiity for our actions.

I have to say that given she became a Born Again Christian in 1974 faith to which she holds to this day, it is ironic reading the comments above from some Christians who do not seem to be the forgiving sort.

HS

54

Today is my 4 YEAR ANNIVERSARY on JWD!! Can't believe it!!

by Terry in

jw
friends

four freakin' years!.

look at the number of posts!

i can assure you very few of those posts were short, pithy, truncated or otherwise carefully considered sententious sentences!

hillary_step

Terry,

You have played an important role on this Board in helping those who lack critical thinking skills, to at least experiment with lateral thinking. No need to disaparage your input. Those who understand appreciate, those who do not never will.

Hillbilly,

Not at all Terry. Hillary Step has a lock on those categrories

If I thought I could take seriously anything that slid from your oily mouth, I might be upset. As it is, having displayed yourself publicly and repeatedly as a dumbass of staggering proportions, being described as 'pompous', by a semi-literate windbag like yourself, holds no fears for me.

Keep it coming.

HS

99

time to move on....

by wings in

jw
friends

just wanted to say how much you here on this board have helped me and a sincere thank you.

i am moving... into a huge, and potentially, wonderful transition in my life.

hard times ahead, but i think the worst is behind me.

hillary_step

Wings,

Sorry HS, didn't mean to be patronizing, condescending and rude to you. I just had a stupid moment, it was not my intention to upset you.

I am not in the slightest upset Wings, as I have tried to impress on you a number of times. I am puzzled by your behavior, but not upset. It is yourself and a number of erratic posters that seem to be living through you via emotional transference issues that are upset.

I am honestly sorry.

I accept your apology and wish you all the best for the future. I hope that life treats you a little more fairly in the years to come.

Best regards - HS

99

time to move on....

by wings in

jw
friends

just wanted to say how much you here on this board have helped me and a sincere thank you.

i am moving... into a huge, and potentially, wonderful transition in my life.

hard times ahead, but i think the worst is behind me.

hillary_step

Jk666,

wings,
Patronizing
Condescending
Rude
Stupid
Those four words could never rightfully apply to you, from what I have experienced on this board!!!

Are you sure you meant to direct these words to Wings? Not very supportive of you.

Never let someone through cleverly crafted words make you believe that

Grow up man! Get back into rehab and make something of your life. Hanging around an exJW discussion board hoping to find Nivarna shaped sobriety is not going to happen. Take responsibility for who you are, what you became, and what you want to be. Stop blaming the WTS or your family for your alchoholism. Until you do so you will never grapple with any success with the demons that haunt you. Of course, you have heard all this in AA, have you not?

There you go 'cuddly-club'. A little support given for free by HS to JK666. Sure, it is not love-bombing, or empowering him to wallow in his excesses and issues. It is the type of support he will receive, and I suspect has received from a professional counsellor. I also suspect that it will go in one ear and out of the other, which shows just how serious a 'support' Board this is!

HS

99

time to move on....

by wings in

jw
friends

just wanted to say how much you here on this board have helped me and a sincere thank you.

i am moving... into a huge, and potentially, wonderful transition in my life.

hard times ahead, but i think the worst is behind me.

hillary_step

Wings,

However much you now try to play the sweet innocent, your UNSOLICITED private mail was patronizing, condescending and just plain rude.

The reason that the whole matter to this thread was that you sent me numerous obnoxious UNSOLICITED private emails, then announced that you were leaving the Board. I made sure that people knew what you had done, though I have never once mentioned what you wrote in your notes so please do not try to suggest that I did. If you have something to say to me, say it publicly, but drop the attitude and remember that I do not need 'counsel' from you or anybody else as to how to live my life. I am

The past couple of years this Board has turned from vehicle that imparted accurate, analaysed and useful information from which persons could make decisions, to a sort of outpatient doodling venue for those who need 'support'. This Board by definition can only supply limited and facile support. Any person with serious issues needs to have those issues seriously attended to, not rely on some stranger behind a computer screen who has never had a days training in such matters to do it for them. People need to know the difference between infomation and support. Not many seem too.

Take the example of Richie. He arrived on this Board at seventeen years of age, a bright kid with an attitude. He was 'love-bombed' and then empowered by some of the worst advice that I have ever seen meted out, by 'cuddly-clubbers' who once he had made some dire choices in life, moved on to their next victim. Do these 'supporters' actually think they helped this kid? Shame on them.

The concept of this Board was and is a good one, and in times past the discussions, debates and information that one could find here made this Board unique. I doubt that the battalion of the 'needy' that seems to have arrived the past couple of years have ever read serious posts by AlanF, Marvin Shilmer, TMS, janH, Ginny Tosken, Norm, etc. etc., but they should. After these they may find that the INFORMATION contained in them while not immediately 'supportive' was far more valuable in dealing with the emotional negativity that emerging from a cult can envelop us in. Knowledge is freedom, and that means freedom from neediness too.

One needs also to raise the issue of believability too. Over the years we have seen many people who actually recognizing the games that can be played with 'supporters', fake a personna, fake an illness, an addiction and cause havoc in peoples lives.

Be careful people. Do not expect more from this Board than it can fairly give.

HS

PS - Ooompa. I am glad that you have thought better of continuing your physical threats against me. Keep it that way.

hillary_step

Posts by hillary_step