leavingwt

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Posts by leavingwt

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  95

  What was it about Bethel that woke you up?

  by cognisonance in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  one the how many exbethelites thread it was mentioned that some think one either leaves down the path towards apostasy or as a 100% true believer.

  i'm curious what experiences did you face at bethel that woke you up (or started to at least)?.

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  leavingwt

  puffthedragon: Your experience alligns with what I observed 100%. I enjoyed reading it.
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  8

  Man Of Steel

  by PSacramento in

  1. social
  2. entertainment

  coming out in june 2013.. while i have always been a bigger fan of batman ( martial arts infulence) there was always something special about superman.. my favorite superman storyline is kingdom come.. i was never a fan of the superman series with christopher reeves, superman returns was at best ok and while i liked smallville ( tv series) it was overlong and had some glaring faults.. this movie, however, is filling me full of hope :).

  the first two are teasers, one with kevin costner voice over ( john kent), the other with russel crowe vo ( jor-el).

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_vrp5q1zow.

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  leavingwt

  I pretty much agree with this guy:

  http://thedailybanter.com/2012/12/dissecting-the-new-man-of-steel-trailer/

  I will also disclose my personal bias. Superman (1978) was the very first film that I ever saw in the theater. Gene Hackman is my all-time favorite actor.
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  95

  What was it about Bethel that woke you up?

  by cognisonance in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  one the how many exbethelites thread it was mentioned that some think one either leaves down the path towards apostasy or as a 100% true believer.

  i'm curious what experiences did you face at bethel that woke you up (or started to at least)?.

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  leavingwt

  "I heard a rumor that they search people's belongings in Bethel on a fairly regular basis"

  I would say that this is not true/misleading, but that the general sentiment is based upon truth. See below.

  What is true is that if they have reason to suspect you have some type of contraband, they will most certainly go through your things. However, you will be there when they do it. Further, it has been the case that if the housekeeper sees something (that is left in plain site, or is visible inside a drawer when she is dusting) she will most definitely contact the Home Overseer, etc.

  But, it's not true that people secretly invade your room and look through your stuff.
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  95

  What was it about Bethel that woke you up?

  by cognisonance in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  one the how many exbethelites thread it was mentioned that some think one either leaves down the path towards apostasy or as a 100% true believer.

  i'm curious what experiences did you face at bethel that woke you up (or started to at least)?.

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  leavingwt

  One more thing. I've stated this before.

  If every Bethel elder were forced to produce list of his infractions of the Bethel rules -- big and small -- they'd all be asked to leave. The environment is full of stupid rules that people disobey, and then remain quiet about, so as to avoid the disciplinary machinery.

  If the people running the place were reasonable, these long-time, valuable workers could help reform the rules that everyone is 'forced' to break.

  Keep in mind that most of the time, these Bethel rules are not "sins". They're simply Bethel rules. (Example: We were forbidden to wear Bermuda shorts anywhere in Brooklyn Heights, for any reason, at any time.)
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  95

  What was it about Bethel that woke you up?

  by cognisonance in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  one the how many exbethelites thread it was mentioned that some think one either leaves down the path towards apostasy or as a 100% true believer.

  i'm curious what experiences did you face at bethel that woke you up (or started to at least)?.

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  leavingwt

  Yes, I remember that story. I knew at least one of the guys. I thought it was ridiculous. I think that was in 2000.
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  20

  How would you answer? Part 1

  by problemaddict in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  so in my limited quest on here and elsewhere, i am intrigued by the kind of canned responses that come from conversations with my friends and family about "my doubts".

  these are of course conversation i usually should not have had in the mind state i was in, or in any state right leaving wt?.

  anyways, i wanted to throw out here some of the common things espoused, and see what you all thought was a fair and even handed response.

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  leavingwt

  The people that you're having these conversations with are spies. Make no mistake, they will rat you out, should they feel the pain of their guilty conscience. These friends are all conditional. I was ratted out by my best friend, after he specifically told me he wouldn't say a word.
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  95

  What was it about Bethel that woke you up?

  by cognisonance in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  one the how many exbethelites thread it was mentioned that some think one either leaves down the path towards apostasy or as a 100% true believer.

  i'm curious what experiences did you face at bethel that woke you up (or started to at least)?.

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  leavingwt

  Christ Alone: I recall GQ magazine and Esquire magazine being contraband. Smart Bethelites got themselves a Post Office box early on, I guess. It's hard to imagine free people letting their employer sort and deliver their mail -- as they see fit.
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  95

  What was it about Bethel that woke you up?

  by cognisonance in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  one the how many exbethelites thread it was mentioned that some think one either leaves down the path towards apostasy or as a 100% true believer.

  i'm curious what experiences did you face at bethel that woke you up (or started to at least)?.

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  leavingwt

  "Examples?"

  The basic lack of kindness and decency from the GB an other "heavies" at Bethel.

  The prevailing attitude at Bethel -- from the leadership -- that those not in the full-time service were 2nd class Christians.
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  95

  What was it about Bethel that woke you up?

  by cognisonance in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  one the how many exbethelites thread it was mentioned that some think one either leaves down the path towards apostasy or as a 100% true believer.

  i'm curious what experiences did you face at bethel that woke you up (or started to at least)?.

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  leavingwt

  cognisonance: I'm sorry that I wasn't more specific. When I speak of grievances, I mean when something at Bethel is not right. There is no way to address a Bethel rule/procedure/action that is wrong/wasteful/inconsiderate, etc. It can take years and multiple Zone Visits just to make a simple adjustment in a rule or procedure. The rules and procedures are treated as being from God, when in reality they are often complete hogwash, making little sense. To question or legitimately criticize something is seen as having a bad attitude, it brings your spirituality into question.

  Another example would be if your Bethel overseer (boss) was a jerk or was treating you in an unfair manner. You essentially have no options. It's a top-down authority structure. That one person controls your fate. I've seen good people sent home, simply because the overseer didn't "like" them.

  One could argue that this environment is exactly what is needed in the military. I simply couldn't see why God's House was run this way. Simple fairness and equal treatment that individual citizens get are something foreign to Bethel. There is absolutely no equality. It's who you know, what you know and what you can get away with.
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  95

  What was it about Bethel that woke you up?

  by cognisonance in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  one the how many exbethelites thread it was mentioned that some think one either leaves down the path towards apostasy or as a 100% true believer.

  i'm curious what experiences did you face at bethel that woke you up (or started to at least)?.

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  leavingwt

  I could write page after page.

  Rather than doing that, I'll put forth one of the most compelling facts.

  There is absolutely no procedure to have your legitimate greivances aknowledged and dealt with by the powers at Bethel. The authority structure is that of slaves working for a dictator. Since your livelihood literally hangs in the balance (food, shelter, clothing), individuals have close to zero wiggle room. You don't like something? You were legimately wronged? Fine, hit the door. Even better, you're DF'd, now hit the door. Good luck.

  That bottom line threat is always present.

  Sounds like a spiritual paradise.

  I recall, early on, thinking to myself: "If the New System is anything like this, most of the JWs that I know are going to hate it."

  The Bethel Family was constantly presented with information that we were asked not to share with the outside. Why? Because this information would put Bethel in an extremely negative light, and for good reasons. When speaking with my family back home, I had to censor myself, so as not to "stumble" them.

  So, if it's the House of God, why was it run no differently than a cut-throat corporation or dictatorship?

  The answer is simple, but it took me a few years to connect the dots.