I am very sorry to hear that Mary - but am sure you will be an excellent support for your sister at this difficult time
LUKEWARM
JoinedPosts by LUKEWARM
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MY BROTHER-IN-LAW HAS DIED
by Mary inthis is one post i had always hoped i would never have to do, but after a long and brave battle, my beloved brother in law has died.
i have done a couple of threads on this in the past, so many of you know the battles he was facing.
he had been diagnosed earlier this year with myelodysplastic syndrome and the mortality rate of this disease is quite high.
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Don't worry about H1N1, just wash your hands and cough on your sleeve says letter from Branch
by cattails inhey you don't worry about h1n1, just wash your hands and cough on your sleeve says a recent letter from wts branch to all congregations.it's to be expected that there would be "pestilences" so why worry, right?elders were told to arrange for a special needs talk about handling the situation locally.
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LUKEWARM
So you are saying it was read to the congregation or just posted to the elders?
Which country is this in?
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Blondie's Comments You Will Not Hear at the 09-27-09 WT (BOLDNESS)
by blondie inhttp://exjehovahswitnessforum.yuku.com.
http://www.jwsupportforum.com/index.php.
http://www.jehovahswitnessrecovery.com/.
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LUKEWARM
Thanks Blondie - sorry to hear about your health and hope the medicine will magage & keep it contained
Q15. How does the truth divide people today?
COMMENTS
THE TRUTH divides people...some hate us (jws); target of misinformation and malicious propaganda through the media.What misinformation and malicious propaganda?
It's frustrating that they never elaborate and deliberately mislead the membership in accepting their word - so sad that this mind control prevents the average member in investigating what others disagree with and more importantly, if there is substance to the objections and alternative arguments. -
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Congregation "Bible Study" Comments - Week Commencing 28 September 2009
by LUKEWARM in*** lv chap.
10 pp.
110-120 marriage-a gift from a loving god ***.
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LUKEWARM
*** lv chap. 10 pp. 110-120 Marriage-A Gift From a Loving God ***
Q16, 17. Those preparing for marriage should meditate on what Scriptural principles?16 Preparing for marriage involves meditating on the roles that God has assigned to husband and wife. A man needs to know what it means to be the head of a Christian household. This role is not a license to act as a tyrant. Rather, he must imitate the manner in which Jesus exercises headship. (Ephesians 5:23) Likewise, a Christian woman needs to understand the dignified role of the wife. Will she be willing to submit to "the law of her husband"? (Romans 7:2). She is already under the law of Jehovah and the Christ. (Galatians 6:2) Her husband's authority in the household represents another law. Can she be supportive and submissive when it comes to the authority of an imperfect man? If that prospect is not appealing, she does well to refrain from marrying.
Why does the Bible say that the head of every man is the Christ and not the Faithful and Discreet Slave?
"...the law of Jehovah and of Christ" and the law of the WTS makes JW's subject to 3 laws when it should only be the law of the Christ for Christians.
17 Further, each mate needs to be ready to care for the special needs of the other. (Philippians 2:4) Paul wrote: "Let each one of you individually so love his wife as he does himself; on the other hand, the wife should have deep respect for her husband." Under divine inspiration, Paul saw that the man has a special need to sense his wife's deep respect for him. And the woman has a special need to feel loved by her husband.-Ephesians 5:21-33.
"ready to care for the special needs of the other" - how is that completely possible when the WTS requires its members to be so busy volunteering their time for them which leaves so little time to spend with the family?
Q18. Why should couples exercise self-control during courtship?18 Courtship, then, is not merely a time to have fun. It is a time for a man and a woman to learn how to deal properly with each other, to see whether marriage would be a wise choice. It is also a time to exercise self-control! The temptation to become physically intimate can be very strong-after all, the attraction is natural. However, those who truly love each other will avoid any acts that could harm a loved one spiritually. (1 Thessalonians 4:6) So if you are courting, exercise self-control; you can benefit from that quality throughout your life, whether you marry or not.
[Picture on page 119]
During courtship, many couples wisely arrange for a chaperone
"It is a time for a man and a woman to learn how to deal properly with each other" - Well instead of having time to do this and enjoy their twenties more by going out and having fun, they are instead required to go out on in service and attend repetitive meetings.
"...any acts that could harm a loved one spiritually." - Why not elaborate on what these are exactly and when an act qualifies as loose conduct?http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/102445/1/Elders-school-notes-Part-6-The-JW-Talmud-and-Trust-UsHOW CAN YOU MAKE A MARRIAGE LAST?
Q19, 20. How should a Christian's view of marriage differ from that of many in today's world? Illustrate.19 If a couple is to make their marriage last, they need to have the right view of commitment. In novels and movies, a marriage often provides the happy ending that people crave. In real life, though, marriage is not an ending; it is a beginning-the start of something that Jehovah designed to last. (Genesis 2:24) Sadly, that is not the common view in today's world. In some cultures, people speak of marrying as "tying the knot." They may not realize how aptly that illustration describes the common view of marriage. How so? While a good knot should hold fast as long as it is needed, another key requirement is that it can be tied and untied with ease.
Is it possible for non-jw's to "have the right view of commitment"? Do non-jw's commonly view marriage as something not "designed to last"?
"They may not realize how aptly that illustration describes the common view of marriage." - More interpretative wisdom from the institutionalized members of the WTS
20 Many today see marriage as temporary. They enter into it readily enough because they think that it will suit their needs, but they expect to be able to get out of it as soon as it seems to be challenging. Remember, though, the illustration that the Bible uses for a bond such as marriage-the cord. Cords or ropes made for sailing ships are designed to last, never to fray or unravel, even in the harshest storm. Likewise, marriage is designed to endure. Remember, Jesus said: "What God has yoked together let no man put apart." (Matthew 19:6) If you marry, you need to have the same view of marriage. Does that kind of commitment turn marriage into a burden? No.
Why is it that "many" non-jw's marriages last and are more permanent and happy that JW marriages? Does it perhaps have to do with the additional pressure and strain a relationship is under to please the WTS?
Considering "Jesus said: "What God has yoked together let no man put apart", why does the WTS teach that if one marriage mate disagrees with its interpretation of the Bible, then the other mate has grounds for separation?
Q21. A husband and wife need to maintain what attitude toward each other, and what may help them to do so?21 A husband and wife need to maintain the right view of each other. If each one strives to focus on the good qualities and efforts of the other, the marriage will be a source of joy and refreshment. Is it unrealistic to have such a positive view of an imperfect mate? Jehovah is never unrealistic, yet we count on him to maintain a positive view of us. The psalmist asked: "If errors were what you watch, O Jah, O Jehovah, who could stand?" (Psalm 130:3) Husbands and wives need to have a similarly positive and forgiving view of each other.-Colossians 3:13.
"Jehovah is never unrealistic" but the WTS frequently is...http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/84206/1/Awake-3d-college-educationQ22, 23. How did Abraham and Sarah set a good example for married people today?22 Marriage can become a greater blessing as it endures over the years. The Bible shows us the marriage of Abraham and Sarah when they were an elderly couple. Their life was by no means free of hardships and challenges. Imagine what it was like for Sarah, a woman possibly in her 60's, to leave her comfortable home in the prosperous city of Ur and take up dwelling in tents for the rest of her life. Yet, she submitted to her husband's headship. A true complement and helper to Abraham, she respectfully helped to make his decisions work. And her subjection was not superficial. Even "inside herself," she referred to her husband as her lord. (Genesis 18:12; 1 Peter 3:6) Her respect for Abraham came from the heart.
So Sarah "possibly in her 60's" was asked lived in a "comfortable home in the prosperous city". Does the WTS approve of its members to enjoying their retirement in this way?
Sarah "submitted to her husband's headship" when they needed to move to another location because Gods directly told him to do so - Are the WTS requirements imposed on husbands to be viewed in the same manner?
Should Christian wives refer to their husbands as "lord"?
23 Of course, that does not mean that Abraham and Sarah always saw things the same way. She once made a suggestion that was "very displeasing" to Abraham. Still, at Jehovah's direction, Abraham humbly listened to the voice of his wife, which turned out to be a blessing to the family. (Genesis 21:9-13) Husbands and wives today, even those married for decades, can learn much from this godly couple.
Q24. What kind of marriages reflect well on Jehovah God, and why?24. In the Christian congregation, there are many thousands of happy marriages - marriages in which the wife deeply respects her husband, the husband loves and honors his wife, and both work together to put the doing of Jehovah's will first in all things. If you decide to marry, may you choose your mate wisely, prepare well for marriage, and work at a peaceful, loving marriage that brings honor to Jehovah God. In that case, your marriage will certainly help you to remain in God's love.
"Christian congregation" = Only JW's?
"In the Christian congregation, there are many thousands of happy marriages" - is it possible for them to comprehend that there are millions of non-JW marriages which are happy and enduring?
"...doing of Jehovah's will first in all things" means attending all the meetings, 8 hours a month in field service, not celebrating birthdays, donating to the worldwide work etc -
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What do you think about this quote from the 2003 District Convention talk "Beware of the Voice of Strangers"?
by LUKEWARM in[23:23] so friends, hypothetically, and i repeat, hypothetically, even if an angel were to come down here and land on this platform, today, at this moment, and to present something to us that didn't fit into the pattern of truth, what should we be ready to do?
we should be ready to say, " hold on there, that doesn't fit into the pattern, and i am not going to listen to it!
" yes, even if it were one of jehovah's angels.. .
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LUKEWARM
In other words, if Jesus himself said something different than what the watchtower teaches then he is automatically wrong.
True! As one poster here put it, "if Jesus came down from heaven right now and told JW's to STOP LISTENING TO THE SOCIETY, STOP GOING TO THE MEETINGS, told them I DON'T NEED YOUR FREAKIN 10 HOURS PER MONTH! They'd just blink really fast and open up the latest issue of the WT magazine and proceed with this month's suggested presentation."
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What do you think about this quote from the 2003 District Convention talk "Beware of the Voice of Strangers"?
by LUKEWARM in[23:23] so friends, hypothetically, and i repeat, hypothetically, even if an angel were to come down here and land on this platform, today, at this moment, and to present something to us that didn't fit into the pattern of truth, what should we be ready to do?
we should be ready to say, " hold on there, that doesn't fit into the pattern, and i am not going to listen to it!
" yes, even if it were one of jehovah's angels.. .
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LUKEWARM
[23:23] So friends, hypothetically, and I repeat, hypothetically, even if an angel were to come down here and land on this platform, today, at this moment, and to present something to us that didn't fit into the pattern of truth, what should we be ready to do? We should be ready to say, " Hold on there, that doesn't fit into the pattern, and I am not going to listen to it!" Yes, even if it were one of Jehovah's angels.The full transcript http://www.silentlambs.org/education/districttranscript2.htm
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Ray Franz on Fear Among JWs
by compound complex into this day, in all countries, any persons among jehovah's witnesses who find they cannot conscientiously support fully the organization's teachings or practices live in a climate of fear, feeling they must constantly be on guard as to what they say, what they do, what they read, with whom they associate, from whom they receive letters, not feeling any sense of freedom even when among personal friends or close relatives if these are also witnesses.
as stated, in my personal experience i have had people phone who were afraid to give their name or who felt it necessary to use a fictitious name, some who even felt it necessary to take out a special post office box to be able to correspond without danger of their correspondence with me or other former witnesses being discovered.
they face a form of "hostage" situation, produced by the organization's authority.
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LUKEWARM
I sincerely believe that, of all the personalities on the Governing Body during the 70's and 80's. It was Ray that God saw something special in. Something good he could use to help others.
I believe he used Ray's unique experience, personal knowledge and kind heart to free many of us trapped in this cult.
I hope and pray that Ray now looks back on the first 60 years of his life, not as a waste of time, but as a training ground for the work given to him after leaving JW's. Similiar to Moses with the Egyptians or Daniel with the Babylonians.
I owe that man a H U G E debt of thanks for the life he's had. For without his experience, my whole family would still be trapped and misreable.Well said!
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LUKEWARM
AE and Pjs - have you read these 2 discussing the blood issue?
http://newsblaze.com/story/20081209054218zzzz.nb/topstory
If so, what are your thoughts?
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My sister died in a head on collision last night
by Bumble Bee ini still can't believe it.
she was here for the bbq, we had an awesome time, laughing, her telling stories from our childhoods.
i gave her a hug and told her i loved her before she left.
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LUKEWARM
I am so very sorry to hear about this (((((Bumble Bee)))))
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Congregation "Bible Study" Comments - Week Commencing 21 September 2009
by LUKEWARM in*** lv chap.
10 pp.
110-120 marriage-a gift from a loving god ***.
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LUKEWARM
*** lv chap. 10 pp. 110-120 Marriage-A Gift From a Loving God ***
WHO WOULD MAKE A GOOD MARRIAGE MATE?
Q9, 10. (a) How did Paul illustrate the danger of forming close bonds with unbelievers? (b) What often results from ignoring God's counsel not to marry an unbeliever?9 Paul was inspired to write down a vital principle that should be applied when choosing a marriage mate: "Do not become unevenly yoked with unbelievers." (2 Corinthians 6:14) His illustration was based on a fact of agricultural life. If two animals that differ greatly in size or strength are yoked together, both will suffer. Similarly, yoked together by marriage, a believer and an unbeliever will undoubtedly face friction and strains. If one mate wants to remain in Jehovah's love and the other cares little or nothing about that, their priorities in life will not match, and much discomfort is likely to result. Paul thus urged Christians to marry "only in the Lord."-1 Corinthians 7:39.
When Paul referred to "unbelievers' was he talking about non JW's or people who did not believe in the Christ?
Why are they not specific as to what a "believer" is? Is this another instance of twisting the scriptures - making the application mean a member of the Jehovah's Witness religion?
"If one mate wants to remain in Jehovah's love..." means if one party accepts that the WTS has the correct interpretation of the Bible and are willing to live and die in accordance with these directives and advance that to others as the "truth".
"...priorities in life will not match, and much discomfort is likely to result." - Imagine the discomfort if one marriage mate believed that the generation born in 1914 would see the end only to have this life changing "truth" deleted by the WTS in one sentence in 1996 without even apologizing for another false prophecy!
10 In some cases, single Christians have come to the conclusion that an uneven yoking would be better than the loneliness they currently feel. Some decide to ignore Bible counsel, and they marry a person who does not serve Jehovah. Again and again, the outcome is sad. Such ones find themselves married to a person with whom they cannot share the most important things in life. The loneliness that results may be far greater than any that they experienced before they married. Happily, there are many thousands of single Christians who trust in and loyally adhere to divine counsel in this regard. (Psalm 32:8) Though hoping to marry someday, they remain single until they find a mate among those who worship Jehovah God.
"Some decide to ignore Bible counsel" should be rephrased to WTS counsel since the Bible clearly talks about people believing in the Christ, not people belonging to a certain Christian denomination.
"...person who does not serve Jehovah" are non JW's - some 6,500,000,000 individuals who will be destroyed according to the WTS teaching.
"...trust in and loyally adhere to divine counsel in this regard." What divine counsel? The WTS is again going "beyond the things written" and requiring others draw the same conclusion
Q11. What can help you to choose a marriage mate wisely? (See also the box on page 114.)11 Of course, not every servant of Jehovah is automatically a suitable marriage mate. If you are considering marriage, look for someone whose personality, spiritual goals, and love for God are compatible with your own. The faithful slave class has provided much food for thought on this subject, and you would do well to consider such Scriptural counsel prayerfully, letting it guide you in making this important decision.-Psalm 119:105.
What are "spiritual goals"? Are they full time pioneering, serving where the need is greater, bethel service, missionary service?
Do all the 9980 anointed ones compose "The faithful slave class" and are they collectively consulted in what food needs to be disseminated?http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/174833/1/6-15-WT-GB-More-Powerful-than-Worldwide-Anointed-Dont-Judge-Partaking"...consider such Scriptural counsel prayerfully, letting it guide you in making this important decision" - how many were guided by the below ruling?
"While both homosexuality and bestiality are disgusting perversions, in the case of neither one is the marriage tie broken. It is broken only by acts that make an individual "one flesh" with a person of the opposite sex other than his or her legal marriage mate." W72 01/01 pp.31-2
[Box/Pictures on page 114] WHAT AM I LOOKING FOR IN A MATE?
Principle: "The two will be one flesh.-Matthew 19:5.
Some questions to ask yourself
- Why is it important to be "past the bloom of youth" before marrying?-1 Corinthians 7:36; 13:11; Matthew 19:4, 5.
- Although I am old enough to marry, how can I benefit from staying single for a period of time?-1 Corinthians 7:32-34, 37, 38.
- If I choose to marry, why is it important that my prospective mate have a record of faithful service to Jehovah?-1 Corinthians 7:39.
- How can the following scriptures help a sister to identify the qualities needed in a mate?-Psalm 119:97; 1 Timothy 3:1-7.
- How could Proverbs 31:10-31 help a brother choose a marriage mate wisely?
Q12. What custom regarding marriage prevails in many lands, and what Bible example offers some guidance?12 In many lands, it is customary for parents to choose a mate for their child. It is widely agreed in those cultures that parents have the greater wisdom and experience needed to make such an important choice. Arranged marriages often work out well, as they did in Bible times. The example of Abraham sending his servant to find a wife for Isaac is instructive to parents who may be in a similar position today. Money and social standing were not Abraham's concern. Rather, he went to great lengths to find a wife for Isaac among people who worshipped Jehovah.-Genesis 24:3, 67.
"...went to great lengths to find a wife for Isaac among people who worshipped Jehovah" What about Moses, Joseph, Esther and Ruth's husband etc who were married to unbelievers?
HOW CAN YOU PREPARE FOR A SUCCESSFUL MARRIAGE?
Q13-15. (a) How can the principle found at Proverbs 24:27 help a young man who is thinking about marriage? (b) What can a young woman do to prepare for marriage?13 If you are thinking seriously about marriage, you would do well to ask yourself, 'Am I really ready?' The answer does not simply lie in your feelings about love, sex, companionship, or child rearing. Rather, there are specific goals that each prospective husband or wife should think about.
14 A young man who seeks a wife should think carefully about this principle: "Prepare your work out of doors, and make it ready for yourself in the field. Afterward you must also build up your household." (Proverbs 24:27) What is the point? In those days, if a man wanted to "build up [his] household," or establish a family by getting married, he needed to ask himself, 'Am I ready to care for and support a wife and any children who might come along?' He had to work first, caring for his fields, or crops. The same principle applies today. A man who wants to marry needs to prepare for the responsibility. As long as he is physically able, he will have to work. God's Word indicates that a man who does not care for the physical, emotional, and spiritual needs of his family is worse than one without faith!-1 Timothy 5:8.
"Am I ready to care for and support a wife and any children who might come along?" - Disgusting how the WTS feels no guilt or shame knowing that by discouraging higher education, the young man will end up with a lower paying menial job and will need to work so much harder and longer to support his family
"God's Word indicates that a man who does not care for the physical, emotional, and spiritual needs of his family is worse than one without faith!" As usual, no apologies from the WTS for the way they have directly contributed to the husband load encouraging the minimum standard of education; rather they resemble the Pharisees in quickly heaping the guilt back on the individual.
15 A woman who decides to marry is likewise agreeing to shoulder a number of weighty responsibilities. The Bible praises some of the skills and qualities that a wife may need as she helps her husband and cares for her household. (Proverbs 31:10-31) Men and women who rush into marriage without preparing to take on the responsibilities involved are really being selfish, failing to think of what they can offer a potential mate. Most of all, though, those contemplating marriage need to be prepared spiritually.