trebor

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Posts by trebor

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  24

  Do you still say JEHOVAH when scared to chase away the demons?

  by Greybeard in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i was scared stiff of the demons all of my life growing up as a jw.

  you know the stories.

  i am way more open minded now that i have been out for 3 years or so.

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  trebor

  Part of freeing myself from the Watchtower cult was to stop using their loaded language. Terms like "Friends/Brothers/Sisters" when referring to members of the organization, or calling the teaching, practices and beliefs of Jehovah's Witnesses according to the Watchtower Society's interpretations as "The Truth".

  I found it even easier to stop referring to what others may refer to as God (The Father), or whatever your belief/terms may be, as "Jehovah" was knowing and realizing the organization's printed information on the matter:

  According to Insight on the Scriptures Volume 2, page 5 under the heading, 'Jehovah' the following is stated:
  
  "Correct Pronunciation of the Divine Name. “Jehovah” is the best known English pronunciation of the divine name, although “Yahweh” is favored by most Hebrew scholars. The oldest Hebrew manuscripts present the name in the form of four consonants, commonly called the Tetragrammaton (from Greek te•tra-, meaning “four,” and gram'ma, “letter”). These four letters (written from right to left) are ???? and may be transliterated into English as YHWH (or, JHVH)."
  The Watchtower Society adds "(or, JHVH)" in their publication, but that letter usage was to make allowance and flexibility centuries later. It does not attribute towards accuracy. The confusion stems from Latin sources, in which the same letter represents both J and Y, and another single letter represents both V and W. Nonetheless, the original Hebrew translates to YHWH.
  
  On page 7, the same publication continues:
  
  "Since certainty of pronunciation is not now attainable, there seems to be no reason for abandoning in English the well-known form “Jehovah” in favor of some other suggested pronunciation. "
  
  So the Watchtower Society is stating that there is no way to attain the correct pronunciation of God’s name, but since ‘Jehovah’ is supposedly so well-known, let’s stick with it. Regardless of the facts that Hebrew scholars use YaHWeH, and earliest documented evidence shows YHWH – Not JHVH [JeHoVaH] as valid consonants in the name.

  The Divine Name brochure on page 7 under ‘God’s Name – It’s Meaning and Pronunciation’ makes the following statements:
  
  “How Is God’s Name Pronounced? The truth is, nobody knows for sure how the name of God was originally pronounced."

  There is more information, but the above alone was plenty enough for me to easily stop using "Jehovah" as the name of "God".
• 
  40

  Just some personal ramblings. Move on if you want to argue.

  by OnTheWayOut in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  okay, first of all: i like the earth, the polar bears, the whales, and any other part of the planet that someone wants to help.

  i appreciate any efforts that people exert.

  the planet is going through global warming and pumping exhaust from automobiles and factories and other sources does contribute to the global warming.

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  trebor

  Well said, OTWO. I agree with many of your points and understand your viewpoint. Wishing you all the best if the opportunity did not present itself again to state such, I wanted to get that in now.
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  93

  Are There ANY Prophecies or Beliefs That The Witnesses Have Right In Your Opinion?

  by minimus in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  regarding prophecy, i see nothing that they've ever been correct on.

  from my understanding, they've always had to change the "truth" about the "truth".. scripturally, i can't see the logic of a godhead or a loving father eternally roasting a person who is deemed "bad".. yout thoughts, please?.

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  trebor

  InterestedOne...Ya, killing me...LOL.

  NomadSoul too?

  Jeez, I picked a fine time to be more a poster than lurker.

  Anyhow, happy Friday all...Hope everyone has a great weekend!
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  93

  Are There ANY Prophecies or Beliefs That The Witnesses Have Right In Your Opinion?

  by minimus in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  regarding prophecy, i see nothing that they've ever been correct on.

  from my understanding, they've always had to change the "truth" about the "truth".. scripturally, i can't see the logic of a godhead or a loving father eternally roasting a person who is deemed "bad".. yout thoughts, please?.

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  trebor

  @InterestedOne

  "In our day, seemingly learned men, educated in the wisdom of this world, may say otherwise. Their goal is to convince you of their view, and they may even do so with religious fervor. They seek to further their own careers in pursuit of fame by sifting the facts. In stark contrast, Jehovah's people are humble, unlettered and ordinary. They allow Jehovah, who knows the beginning from the end, to guide them into all truth. Yes brother, in the name of our now-reigning king, Jesus, whom the facts show was evidently placed on his throne by Jehovah in 1914, Amen."

  Ad hominem attacks along with a few other argument fallacies. You come across as a Watchtower study article.
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  93

  Are There ANY Prophecies or Beliefs That The Witnesses Have Right In Your Opinion?

  by minimus in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  regarding prophecy, i see nothing that they've ever been correct on.

  from my understanding, they've always had to change the "truth" about the "truth".. scripturally, i can't see the logic of a godhead or a loving father eternally roasting a person who is deemed "bad".. yout thoughts, please?.

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  trebor

  @NomadSoul

  "Matthew 24:14"

  Listing that scripture the implication is the message Jesus and his followers preached according to the Bible, and the message Jehovah's Witnesses preach is the same.

  This is not true.

  Also, just popping one scripture up out of context proves not a thing. But since that's your thing here's one for you straight from The New World Translation:

  Luke 10:7...
  "So stay in that house, eating and drinking the things they provide, for the worker is worthy of his wages. Do not be transferring from house to house."
• 
  93

  Are There ANY Prophecies or Beliefs That The Witnesses Have Right In Your Opinion?

  by minimus in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  regarding prophecy, i see nothing that they've ever been correct on.

  from my understanding, they've always had to change the "truth" about the "truth".. scripturally, i can't see the logic of a godhead or a loving father eternally roasting a person who is deemed "bad".. yout thoughts, please?.

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  trebor

  @NomadSoul
  "Well, there is new light that has shined upon the meaning of generation."

  The Watchtower Society focuses on the scripture in Proverbs 4:18 as support of their changing or developing doctrines. That verse states:

  "But the path of the righteous ones is like the bright light that is getting lighter and lighter until the day is firmly established."

  Far from being justification for an organization's change in doctrine, the verse when read in its context (In other words, read the entire chapter) concerns advice from a father to his children. It is not to be taken in part as an excuse or a crutch to be used by an organization for modification of their teachings.

  However, for the sake of argument, let's say their interpretation is correct. Does it apply to the factual history of the organization's teaching?

  Generation (Mathew 24:34)...

  -1927 = The Anointed
  [Watchtower February 15, 1927 page 62]

  -1942 = Anyone alive to see 1914
  [Watchtower July 1, 1942 page 204]

  -1995 = Wicked People alive today
  [Watchtower November 1, 1995 page 19]

  -2008 = The Anointed
  [Watchtower February 15, 2008 page 24]

  -2010 = Overlap Generations of the Anointed since 1914
  [Watchtower April 15, 2010 page 10]

  In summary, the Watchtower Society’s teaching concerning the meaning of 'generation' as recorded in Matthew was first 'correctly' understood to be 'The Anointed' in 1927. But brighter light caused it to become an incorrect teaching of a couple of different things over the course of 81 years, only to return back to the original ‘correct’ 1927 teaching of 'The Anointed'. However, a few years after it has proved to be not completely accurate and needed more 'tweaking' to overlap generations of the Anointed since 1914.

  Just looking at their flip-flopping on the generation teaching alone it is evident that while the Watchtower Society loves to focus attention to Proverbs 4:18, perhaps they should be paying more attention to the verse that follows it. In Proverbs 4:19 it states:

  "The way of the wicked ones is like the gloom; they have not known at what they keep stumbling."
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  93

  Are There ANY Prophecies or Beliefs That The Witnesses Have Right In Your Opinion?

  by minimus in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  regarding prophecy, i see nothing that they've ever been correct on.

  from my understanding, they've always had to change the "truth" about the "truth".. scripturally, i can't see the logic of a godhead or a loving father eternally roasting a person who is deemed "bad".. yout thoughts, please?.

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  trebor

  @Acluetofindtheuser.

  "If Genesis 6:3 is meant to be a lifespan limit then the Organization has until 2034 to get the Armageddon date right, with respect to 1914."

  Where do you deduce that a life space limit brings you to the year 2034? Implying that a life span is 120 years goes against the data you provided. Out of the 10 people you listed, 1 lived that long, the other 9 did not.

  Whether you realize it or not, it sounds more like Watchtower babble [December 15, 2003 Watchtower, page 15], and their latest not so subtle implied parallel that Noah preached for 120 years until that end (flood); using similar math would bring 2034 as the end date if you start with 1914. They've just learned a little from their past mistakes to know blatantly not to state such nonsense.

  You know what? After 2034 comes and goes, there will be another explanation or implication, just like when the end “is”:

  1975 from 6,000 years of man's existence
  1984 from a generation equals 70 years
  1994 from a generation equals 80 years

  And now:
  2034 from a generation equals 120 years.

  There's enough ambiguity in the Bible along with human creativity and imagination, you can find a number of dates and conclusions to come to many assumptions.

  Extra bonus points for adding: "Then again it would have to be sooner because that year is based on ones born in 1914."

  Again, realizing it or not, in a somewhat passive manner, you have sounded a Watchtower warning:

  "The end will come by 2034 or sooner."

  Sorry, the sky is NOT falling. Study history or the repeating of history enough to recognize B.S.
• 
  18

  Have you ever been falsely accused or blamed?

  by Fernando in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  read this on the internet today:.

  "within jungian psychology there is a concept known as the shadow.

  most of us encounter our own shadows in the form of projection.

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  trebor

  I'm willing to wager that the majority of those who have left the Watchtower have been falsely accused. Personally, I had accusations of being too "prideful" or/and "haughty" for leaving 'The Organization'.

  After all, this is what the Watchtower Society teaches of those who leave, is it not?

  My reply to the accusations was quite simple:

  It is an overwhelming humble and humiliating experience to realize that I was so wrong about so many things for so many years and having to admit it to myself and feeling the need to apologize to the many people I encountered, cut-off, or tried to prove their beliefs were 'wrong' and mine were 'right'.
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  25

  Thanks and farewell...

  by Alfred in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hello all..... a few months ago my wife expressed serious concerns about the time i had spent over the past couple of years reading old watchtower literature (printed circa 1880 through the late 30s) and the time spent on this site and several others.

  she is very grateful that i was very persistent in trying to convince her that this is just a mind-control cult run by clueless men who simply make things up as they go along.

  it wasnt easy, but im thankful that i was able to wake her up thanks to many of you.

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  trebor

  Alfred,

  I'm glad you and your wife are both 'free', as well as that other individual who sent you the aforementioned email.

  Wishing you and your wife all of the best.

  Take Care!
• 
  104

  Hear ye!hear ye!!!!Take notice

  by mouthy in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  tomorrow the 22nd i will be 85 years old .

  good wishes only please,remember if you say something nasty i will cry.

  and my mum told me it is a sin to cry on your birthday .

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  trebor

  Happy 85th Birthday and all the continued best for you!