But, sadly, the WT could do so (and be following its own rules) if it disfellowshipped him first.
I thought of this but didn't want to give them any ideas ...
donuthole
JoinedPosts by donuthole
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217
DMCA Complaint from The WatchTower for links to KS-10 'Shepherding' book
by Simon inyes, that's right, they really do not like people being able to read that book so they wanted links to it removed (it appears they have also been going after the hosts of the content itself as well).. unfortunately, i had to removed the links (which were dead anyway when i checked) and i'd ask that people don't re-post them (sorry).
i'm sure there are lots of alternative ways for those with the information to get it to those who need it.. here are the discussions on the book:.
http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/200524/1/ks10-chapter-one-discussion.
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donuthole
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217
DMCA Complaint from The WatchTower for links to KS-10 'Shepherding' book
by Simon inyes, that's right, they really do not like people being able to read that book so they wanted links to it removed (it appears they have also been going after the hosts of the content itself as well).. unfortunately, i had to removed the links (which were dead anyway when i checked) and i'd ask that people don't re-post them (sorry).
i'm sure there are lots of alternative ways for those with the information to get it to those who need it.. here are the discussions on the book:.
http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/200524/1/ks10-chapter-one-discussion.
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donuthole
As a p.s. to my last post -
If it is in indeed an active JW elder who copied and leaked this material the WT would be forbidden from taking the individual to court anyway under the rules against such activity in the new elder's book.
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217
DMCA Complaint from The WatchTower for links to KS-10 'Shepherding' book
by Simon inyes, that's right, they really do not like people being able to read that book so they wanted links to it removed (it appears they have also been going after the hosts of the content itself as well).. unfortunately, i had to removed the links (which were dead anyway when i checked) and i'd ask that people don't re-post them (sorry).
i'm sure there are lots of alternative ways for those with the information to get it to those who need it.. here are the discussions on the book:.
http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/200524/1/ks10-chapter-one-discussion.
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donuthole
The recent cases where big lawsuits have been filed for copyright infringement such as by the RIAA all have to deal with copying and distribution not downloading or possessing. Where things get fuzzy is if you use a file-sharing program to download a copyrighted file you may in the process be distributing the file depending on what P2P program you are using and how it is set up. But, even this isn't cut and dry because due to the nature of torrent you may only be sharing a fraction of copyrighted work and not the whole thing. (This argument is yet untested in court.) Again this assumes that the copyright holder, the Watchtower, would even pursue the matter in court. Firing off cease-and-desist form letters is one thing, bringing litigation against individual file sharers is another animal. I would have to ask if general public exposure over their secret elders manual is worth it.
If individuals wish to further educate themselves over all the ins and outs of copyright issues in the digital age a good resource is the Electronic Frontier Foundation
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Watchtower Sends Legal Notice To Website Regarding Coyright Infringement
by Bangalore inthe watchtower has sent a legal notice to the owners of the eds blog for posting copyrighted material without permission.
here is the link to the trancript.
the site owners response is also there.. .
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donuthole
Sending a "cease and desist" notice is of little effort. It is really an hour of legal time and is very effective. You don't even need a legit claim, most web hosts and ISP will readily comply. Bringing a full-on lawsuit take time and money. They must weigh a variety of factors and decide if it is worth it.
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217
DMCA Complaint from The WatchTower for links to KS-10 'Shepherding' book
by Simon inyes, that's right, they really do not like people being able to read that book so they wanted links to it removed (it appears they have also been going after the hosts of the content itself as well).. unfortunately, i had to removed the links (which were dead anyway when i checked) and i'd ask that people don't re-post them (sorry).
i'm sure there are lots of alternative ways for those with the information to get it to those who need it.. here are the discussions on the book:.
http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/200524/1/ks10-chapter-one-discussion.
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donuthole
The laws are continually changing in this digital age but downloading and possessing a copyrighted work is not a illegal. Distribution is illegal. However the reason the RIAA is able to file such a large suit on music file sharers is because they can claim a financial loss because the works that are being downloaded are also sold. If the Watchtower decided to be litigious they would have a difficult time proving up financial losses for an internal manual that is freely distributed to elders within their religion. Further they would have to decide if bringing a lawsuit to the public is worth the attention it would bring to a document that they very much want to keep away from public (legal) scrutiny.
Make no mistake about it, despite eggnogs claims, the elder's manual is very much a secret document. Letters have already leaked where the elders received official directives that no one but elders are permitted to look at it. It must be kept out of site, even from family. Further having the book spiral bound by a place like Kinko's or a sister in the congregation is expressly forbidden. The only exception is that a baptized brother may bind but only under the direct supervision of an elder. Think about it. If the book was not intended to be secret why such strict directives?
In the meantime, those that have chosen to distribute this file are taking an understood risk and are engaging in civil disobedience for what they believe to be the greater good. (That is if they even are in a country where these laws are applicable.) There is a public value in having this book widely released. Here are just a few reasons:
1.) Their secret directives on how to handle someone who has a blood transfusion is in violation to the agreement they made with the Bulgarian government.
2.) Some of their secret instructions on how to handle judicial meetings betray any claims to clergy confidentially the Watchtower has used when shielding such meetings from scrutiny during child abuse lawsuits.
3.) When a Witness undergoes a judicial meeting they are not fully informed of their rights. The release of the manual provides information for those who are being tried in such a manner so that they are better prepared.
That being said this website is exercising their due diligence by removing links to the material ensuring that this forum resource can remain available for those who would benefit from it. Even then removing links right now won't matter too much in the long run. The cat is already out of the bag. WikiLeaks currently has their hands full with the release of the Iraq war documents but eventually the book will end up on their servers for any who have a continued interest in it. Even though they have nothing to do with this religion they fully understand that there is an important public interest in having the material available.
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Not surprisingly, the rumor mill has started...
by SweetBabyCheezits inmy wife and i have not even been df'd for a week and an old friend on fb (an inactive jw who has active jw friends who used to be friends of mine) says there's a rumor going around that i'm gay.
wow.
really jws?
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donuthole
Typical. Like all "apostates" I have started my own religion. I am also rumored to be crazy and have been making prank phone calls on JW's. One the of the reasons I sent a letter to my congregation prior to being disfellowshipped was to let them know exactly what I was being disfellowshipped was to avoid being called an adulterer or a fornicator. It retrospect, given their opinion of "apostates", adulterer might have been the better label.
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donuthole
It may be a bit "tin-foil-hat" for some but I avoid tap water when possible BECAUSE OF flouride. It is interesting that many countries have banned flouride in water because of health and other concerns. Beyond that there are other concerns with tap water such as in 2008 when National news agencies reported where traces of pharmaceuticals were discovered in tap water.
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DMCA Complaint from The WatchTower for links to KS-10 'Shepherding' book
by Simon inyes, that's right, they really do not like people being able to read that book so they wanted links to it removed (it appears they have also been going after the hosts of the content itself as well).. unfortunately, i had to removed the links (which were dead anyway when i checked) and i'd ask that people don't re-post them (sorry).
i'm sure there are lots of alternative ways for those with the information to get it to those who need it.. here are the discussions on the book:.
http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/200524/1/ks10-chapter-one-discussion.
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donuthole
The law regarding linking to material is unclear at the moment as it hasn't been tried in court
Unfortunately linking to infringing content has been tried and the US courts have sided with the copyright owners. Per the article I quoted above the courts have forced websites to remove links to internal manuals that the mormon church claims as copyright protected. Even Google will remove search links to material when there is a valid copyright claim. As it currently stands there is a legal precedent that even linking to copyright materials is illegal.
I don't think the issue will go away any time soon in this digital age. With secret books like the Elder's manual it is in the public interest that this information be made available and not hidden behind overextended and abused copyright laws. I'm interested to see if the idea of fair use could be tested to apply such circumstances. Until then it will fall upon the civil disobedience of sites like Wikileaks to make available this information for the benefit of others.
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48
Jesus Trashes 1914 in ONE Sentence!
by Farkel init only takes one short sentence from the bible to thoroughly demolish the watchtower religion and the doctrine they claim is their most important one.
this sentence is so crystal clear that there is no way the wts can weasal out of it.
that's why they don't even try.. although their real most important doctrine is that the governing body speaks for god, their claimed most important doctrine begins with the notion that jesus took kingdom power and began reigning in 1914. if that doctrine can be shown to be false, the entire watchtower theology scam crumbles into the trash heap where it belongs.
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donuthole
Donuthole--if I recall correctly, I think the WT says this 'child' was not Jesus, but rather, symbolically represents the Kingdom arrangement, with Jesus as its primary King. (The woman represents God's heavenly organization, if I recall correctly.) Because, after all, since the Kingdom was 'born' in 1914, well after Jesus' life on earth, the child can't be him. The context that follows connects it to Satan's being ousted from heaven, which...'happened in 1914'. As if we can pinpoint the exact date of an event like that. I'm sure debator will correct me if I'm wrong on that.
Thank you for the clarification. I'm really happy that I'm gradually forgetting all of this stuff!
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DMCA Complaint from The WatchTower for links to KS-10 'Shepherding' book
by Simon inyes, that's right, they really do not like people being able to read that book so they wanted links to it removed (it appears they have also been going after the hosts of the content itself as well).. unfortunately, i had to removed the links (which were dead anyway when i checked) and i'd ask that people don't re-post them (sorry).
i'm sure there are lots of alternative ways for those with the information to get it to those who need it.. here are the discussions on the book:.
http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/200524/1/ks10-chapter-one-discussion.
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donuthole
I didn't want to start a new topic so I'm posting here. This is a write-up about the mormon church's legal moves to block the publication of their own secret elders' book. It is relevant to the Watchtower and worth a read for all who may be interested in this sort of thing.
The Wikimedia Foundation has received a copyright infringement claim from The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, widely known as the Mormon Church or LDS Church. The infringement claim is in reference to a URL used as a source in a Wikinews article about Mormon Church documents leaked to the website Wikileaks, titled "Copy of handbook for leaders of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints obtained by Wikinews". The URL was originally cited as a link in the sources subsection of the article. The Wikimedia Foundation is a donor-supported non-profit organization which runs Wikipedia and Wikinews. This is the first time that the Wikimedia Foundation has received a copyright infringement claim regarding an article published by Wikinews.
The Wikinews article, originally published on April 19, described material in the Church Handbook of Instructions. The work is a two-volume book of policies and is a guide for leaders of the Mormon Church. Wikinews obtained the Church Handbook of Instructions from Wikileaks, a whistleblower website which publishes anonymous submissions of sensitive documents while preserving the anonymity of its contributors. Wikileaks describes the material as significant because "...the book is strictly confidential among the Mormon (Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, aka LDS in short form) bishops and stake presidents and it reveals the procedure of handling confidential matters related to tithing payment, excommunication, baptism and doctrine teaching (indoctrination)."
The material was released on the Wikileaks website on April 16, and according to the site was first made available on the document sharing website Scribd. A message at Scribd now states: "This content was removed at the request of copyright agent B. S. Broadbent of the Intellectual Property Division of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints."
On May 5, the Wikimedia Foundation received a copyright infringement claim from Intellectual Reserve, Inc., the legal entity that owns the intellectual property of the Mormon Church. The infringement claim is addressed to Jimmy Wales, the designated agent of the Wikimedia Foundation, and requests that access to the link to Wikileaks be removed. The link was removed from the article on May 5 by a Wikinews administrator, and the article remains available without the link. The infringement claim was sent by Berne S. Broadbent, president of Intellectual Reserve, Inc. and director of the Intellectual Property Division of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. According to Mike Godwin, general counsel for the Wikimedia Foundation, the Mormon Church has not filed a Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA) notice with the foundation.
In 1999, Jerald and Sandra Tanner, prominent critics of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, released material from the Church Handbook of Instructions to the Internet through their organization Utah Lighthouse Ministry, without including the copyright notice of Intellectual Reserve, Inc. or obtaining permission from the church. The website of the Utah Lighthouse Ministry describes as its purpose: "...to document problems with the claims of Mormonism and compare LDS doctrines with Christianity." The Tanners had received a copy of the 1998 edition of Church Handbook of Instructions from an anonymous sender in October 1999. They published 17 pages of the 160-page handbook on the Utah Lighthouse Ministry website.
The church sent the Tanners a letter threatening a copyright infringement lawsuit if the material was not removed, and the Tanners removed the material from their site the same day, and posted the church's letter to their website. The website still contained links to other locations that had the material, and an article in the Salt Lake Tribune listed addresses of these links. The church sued the Tanners through its company Intellectual Reserve, in the 1999 case Intellectual Reserve v. Utah Lighthouse Ministry.
The plaintiffs filed their complaint on October 13, 1999, and the United States district court issued a preliminary injunction on December 6, 1999 barring posting of the material by the defendants as well as posting links to other websites which contain the material. The New York Times and other news publications called the injunction a "chilling effect". In November 2002, the church dropped the lawsuit against Utah Lighthouse Ministry, on condition that the Tanners destroy all copies of the Church Handbook of Instructions, and not include more than 50 words at a time from the handbook in any of their future articles.
WikiLeaks will not remove the handbooks, which are of substantial interest to current and former mormons. WikiLeaks will remain a place were people from around the world can safely reveal the truth. Wikileaks has received copyright infringement claims from organizations including the Church of Scientology's Religious Technology Center and the Swiss Bank Julius Baer, and the Chinese government attempts to censor every website with the word "wikileaks" in the web page address. Bank Julius Baer sued Wikileaks after sending cease and desist letters in January 2008 which cited the Digital Millennium Copyright Act. As a result of the lawsuit, the bank obtained an injunction preventing the site's domain name registrar from associating with Wikileaks, but this injunction was lifted in March 2008 and Bank Julius Baer dropped the case.
As of May 13 Wikileaks had not taken down the material on the Church Handbook of Instructions, and a second webpage at the site with a different version of the material was also still available. In a statement to Wikinews, a Wikileaks representative commented on the material hosted at the site: "WikiLeaks will not remove the handbooks, which are of substantial interest to current and former Mormons. WikiLeaks will remain a place where people from around the world can safely reveal the truth."
