I grew up with 3 other boys in my Congo. One was definately slow but not quite retarded. The other 2 guys died very young one at 18 one at 20. I felt an obligation to look out for the slow guy as we did when kids. Tried to find him after made fade when the other guys died, I saw him once he was so high/drunk and insane I couldn't handle him. Last I heard he got DF'd and reinstated twice and the third DF'ing they told him to get lost. In addition to being slow he had an abusive father that was a couple of bricks short of a load. I think they made him a MS, shit he is probably a CO by now. It's disgusting to me and I think Child Services should be involved in stuff like this.
Brocephus
JoinedPosts by Brocephus
-
28
Keeping the congregation clean- from the wickedness of the retarded
by JimmyPage inwell i saw my parents again.
and i just had to bring up this subject.
a certain person i grew up with named "megan" is disfellowshipped.. "mom," i asked, "isn't megan mentally challenged?
-
-
-
41
Phrases NOT to say if you are in a judicial committee meeting for apostasy
by BonaFide ini have only been on a couple of committee's for actual apostasy, and in one the brother never showed, and in the other, the person said they don't want to be a witness.
but in having experience as an elder and a c.o., and in reading this forum, here are my suggestions.. do not say:.
"i don't believe that the faithful and discreet slave is god's channel" - why not?
-
-
Brocephus
If I could do it again. I'd show up with a deck of cards, a cooler of beer and light a Stoogie and start dealing Texas Hold Em!
-
9
Witness parents using "loophole" to associate with Disfellowshiped children! threats?
by Witness 007 inin my old congregation there are many disfellowshiped young ones.
the parents use the watchtower rule that they need "assistance" from their children therefore can have them over and associate with them more freely.
this has clearly been abused as disfellowshiped kids taking the whole family on hloidays out to dinner, etc....but the elders turn a blind eye.
-
-
Brocephus
There is no difference Dinah. That is why so many people stay in their self-esteem is too low or their Bull Shit tolerance it too high. It's a cult that attracts people that equate = spirtual and emotional abuse with love. That's why it's so hard to get those still in out, they are scared to be with out that crutch. It's been one of my personal hangups in relationships. I have noticed than being needed or having excessive demands but on me some how makes me feel loved. It's tough sometimes to tell the difference between a healthy and unhealthy relationship for me sometimes.
-
129
Religious Fundamentalist Terrorist Strike Again?
by Justitia Themis init doesn't appear police know the motive for this shooting, but it seems there is a high chance it is religous terrorism.
this doctor has repeatedly put his life on the line to fight fundamentalism.
abortion provider dr. george tiller killed at church.
-
-
Brocephus
Sammieswife: I am certian that you are indeed certain of your stance. That was never in doubt.
-
50
Super serious question
by 5thGeneration inplease no sarcastic crap from mean members.. i had a family member kill herself over being raised by a c.o.
who told her that it ruined their life and that she was a mistake.. i have a 10 page report from a psychiatrist back, who was also a jw, in the eighties that is pretty incredible.. now, i was also born jw with a 100 year "truth" heritage to cause me the same guilt.. and it may be drivng me the same way.
i feel the same way my aunt felt.
-
-
Brocephus
First off I am sorry to hear about your loss.
I don't have much in the way of books but I did go through a 4-day program in 2004 that helped me a lot. I had guilt, anger, pain all of the stuff you are going through and this helped me a lot. I think you are in California and the next dates there are in August in LA but here in Texas we hold it once a month. The website is www.lifeenrichmentbootcamp.com there is a psychologist endorsement in one of the video clips. It might be good to share this with anyone you are seeing as well. If you are up for it I would be more than happy to buy your ticket.
If you have any questions email me at [email protected] I meet about 1 or 2 ex JW's every month at this event and they get a lot of healing.
Either way, good luck I'll be praying for your healing.
-
129
Religious Fundamentalist Terrorist Strike Again?
by Justitia Themis init doesn't appear police know the motive for this shooting, but it seems there is a high chance it is religous terrorism.
this doctor has repeatedly put his life on the line to fight fundamentalism.
abortion provider dr. george tiller killed at church.
-
-
Brocephus
sammieleeswife: You are completely wrapped up in the emotion of the situation. About 80% of what you say I agree with but you aren't debating anything. You are just effusing emotion that I guess you feel makes your position more correct. Pathos is the weakest form of argumentation and I am looking for a little more than that to provoke my intellect.
keyser: You are making this too black and white. Because someone understands and even symphathizes with a killers logic is far from condoning it. I understand Bin Laden's logic, he hates the U.S. He feels the U.S. is the reason his people are oppressed. He wants to kill Americans. 9/11 makes sense to me, doesn't mean I condone it for one second. I'd be the first one to kick ol' Bin Laden's ass given the chance. You are trying to paint anyone who is anti-abortion into the "look he wanted the doctor to get shot!" camp. You are looking for one little snippet to take out of context and say "LOOK I TOLD YOU... HE'S A CRAZY HOMICIDAL PRO-LIFER!" You are doing the same thing guys like Bill Oreilly and Rush Limbaugh do on the other side of the political spectrum. That is not intellectual honesty, which is all I am asking for from the posters.
CNN, FOXNEWS, TALK RADIO and other forms of media are all biased. You can get valuable information from them but you have to process it and think for yourself. They are owned by corporations who must make profit. They fragment the population and pander to their audience to sell more advertising space. Let's come together and discuss things honestly and intellectually, puleeeeeeze!
-
129
Religious Fundamentalist Terrorist Strike Again?
by Justitia Themis init doesn't appear police know the motive for this shooting, but it seems there is a high chance it is religous terrorism.
this doctor has repeatedly put his life on the line to fight fundamentalism.
abortion provider dr. george tiller killed at church.
-
-
Brocephus
keyser: Good to see you back. I never said I place great value on ALL life. Just that of innocents. I consider a fetus at 5 and half months that could survive out of the womb to be an innocent life. I understand not all agree but that is my opinion of when a life is a life. Legally it's a gray area in an abortion case it's at birth but if you hit a pregnant woman in my state (TX) and she miscaries you will be charged with murder of that fetus as a human life. So for those using the current law as your compass on this explain that? That being said my opinion is this Dr's life has less value than say that of a school teacher. Does that give the shooter the right to break that law and kill him, ABSOLUTLEY NOT. But if I have to choose to place a value on a life which we do as a society (the death penalty and organ donations) that's how I would decide. The shooter certainly will pay for his actions and is subject to law. Do I have to feel sorry for this Doctor being gone, nope not at all. This Doctor bragged about preforming over 60,000 abortions. Many on this board would say Hitler's life was less valuable than say Mother Theresa's as Hitler deliberately killed six million innocent victims. I would say none of you would shed a tear over Hitler's demise, but I will stop short of calling you hypocrits. I don't think that is necessary or productive.
-
129
Religious Fundamentalist Terrorist Strike Again?
by Justitia Themis init doesn't appear police know the motive for this shooting, but it seems there is a high chance it is religous terrorism.
this doctor has repeatedly put his life on the line to fight fundamentalism.
abortion provider dr. george tiller killed at church.
-
-
Brocephus
beksbks you are probably correct I can be a big smug and verbose when debating but I was taught confidence in my arguments from an early age.
Back on topic. You said you feel far more "Generous" towars John Brown. They both essentially did the same thing. Can you please explain the difference to me? In John Brown's day it was the "law of the land" to own slaves. John Brown had no more of a "legal" right to shoot a slave holder or auctioneer than I would to kill someone for owning a dog or Ford. I am not sure if you condone John Brown's actions or you are just saying you can emphathize and see how he could think he had to take such drastic measures to stop something he felt was so wrong.
John Doe The first 2 pages of this thread suck and are full of trite platitudes and emotionalism. It took a while but I finally got people to start talking about their own thoughts and to stop parroting the pro-life or pro-choice mantras around page 3.
-
129
Religious Fundamentalist Terrorist Strike Again?
by Justitia Themis init doesn't appear police know the motive for this shooting, but it seems there is a high chance it is religous terrorism.
this doctor has repeatedly put his life on the line to fight fundamentalism.
abortion provider dr. george tiller killed at church.
-
-
Brocephus
Looks like beksbks is going to pic up the name calling torch that Keyser and Dinah dropped.
Justitia you are correct, Dinah did take the bait and I am glad I made my point. Not to humiliate anyone but to get the debate going from a e-lynching to a discussion. Also if I would have called each opponent in Speech or Debate class a "prick" and sat down I would have failed and ultimately been dismissed from college. In the boardroom? I don't know what business you work in but anyone in my profession (banking) would not be taken seriously if they just resorted to name calling with anyone who disagreed with them. We expect facts, reason, and hopefully numbers to back up arguments in my profession.
I am very impressed with everything I have read over the last 3 pages. I find journey-on's slave analogy interesting. Didn't JOHN BROWN go around killing slave holders and slave auctioneers before the civil war? He attempted to start the Civil War and a slave rebellion at Harpers Ferry to abolish something he saw as digusting. This is a good analogy for this reason: The question isn't is slavery or abortion morally or legally correct. The question is when a man finds something that digusting and horrible what obligation or right does he have to stop it? For the record, yes John Brown was a nut like the shooter of the Doctor.
Finally people are expressing their thoughts. I guess it's time I express mine.
Personally, I think the professional pro-life harassers are not helping their cause. While I don't think a woman has a right to electivley abort a fetus as that fetus has a right to live in my opnion. The fetus didn't choose to have unprocted sex or sex at all. I can't imagine making a fetus responsible for my lack of self control. In a life or death case of the mother, that is different and must be a decision for the family and the doctor to make. But abortion as contraception is disguting to me and wrong. However, the only way to reasonably change this is through the legal system. Killing abortion doctors is murder and insane in my opinion. However because I can understand the shooters motivation and feelings doesn't mean I condone his actions. How many people understand why John Brown did what he did, but he was a mad man and wrong.
And on a personal note, I fully understand the consequences of making abortions tougher to get. I lost a relative due to a "back room" illegal abortion. That was her choice and she knew bleeding out was a possible consequence. It makes me very sad that it happened but doesn't change what I think is wrong or right. If my brother died robbing a bank I would be sad but I wouldn't say bank robbing is ok because of a personal tradgedy.
-
129
Religious Fundamentalist Terrorist Strike Again?
by Justitia Themis init doesn't appear police know the motive for this shooting, but it seems there is a high chance it is religous terrorism.
this doctor has repeatedly put his life on the line to fight fundamentalism.
abortion provider dr. george tiller killed at church.
-
-
Brocephus
Well atleast folks seem to be making a choice and giving a reason why. The last 2 pages of post have certainly provoked more thought than the first two.
Sammieswife: I am sorry if you felt my demand was arrogant but I was getting tired of your evasiveness. Just say you don't want to answer the question so you can keep preaching about how bad crazy some people are that oppose Abortion on religous principles. I already agree with you on that. If you haven't connected the dots yet my opposition is on a scientific/logical level.
Logos, pathos, ethos folks...
Man I just found $20 in my pocket I am going out to dinner, peace out.
Justitia: I didn't intend for it to become an Abortion debate either. I just wanted to have it explained why some reasonable people can logically support something I consider insane. It was like pulling teeth but I think I finally got a couple of honest explanations with which I should marinate my mind.